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Traffic Cams Co-opted for Surveillance

Posted by michael on from the eye-in-the-sky dept.

Aardpig writes "The Register has a brief piece reporting that some traffic-monitoring CCTV cameras in London are offline today, for "operational reasons so that maintenance can be performed". Coincidentally, or not, the offline cameras happen to lie along the route of today's May Day demonstrations. As The Reg points out, the same happened earlier this year, during two of the anti-war demonstrations which took place in the capital. The UK is already one of the most monitored states in the world, as far as CCTV monitoring goes. Does this bode ill for our future privacy, or is this a necessary measure to maintain safety at large protests?"

8 of 67 comments (clear)

  1. No Privacy Possible in a Public Place. by cloak42 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If you're in public and you're doing something, it's not a matter of privacy. It is by definition impossible to have privacy when everybody else is there, too.

    So if the government wants to preempt the use of a surveillance camera to keep tabs on a public location, I see no problem with that.

    Now, if the government turned one of those cameras toward my bedroom window, I might get a little miffed.

    1. Re:No Privacy Possible in a Public Place. by missing000 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Privacy is not the issue.

      Access to information is the issue
      The government either wants to keep the parade quiet, and / or they want the ability to beat and gas the crowd without people watching it live.

      Any government that abuses people in the name of "privacy" is really evil.

    2. Re:No Privacy Possible in a Public Place. by PD · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Well, those are the government's cameras, so they presumably can turn them off when they want to.

      But, as far as I know, it's not illegal (yet) for private citizens to own cameras and use them. Where are your cameras? Why isn't there some effort to provide private camera coverage of these demonstrations?

      If the opponents of a protest are smarter and better prepared than you, then who is really to blame? I know that organizing demonstrators can be like herding cats, but somebody has to think of these things and get the counter-surveilance implemented.

      --
      If tits were wings it'd be flying around.
    3. Re:No Privacy Possible in a Public Place. by missing000 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Well, those are the government's cameras, so they presumably can turn them off when they want to.

      I don't agree. The government pays for the cameras with money collected from the people, no? If thats the case, then the people deserve equal access when the cameras are placed for civilian use.

      But, as far as I know, it's not illegal (yet) for private citizens to own cameras and use them. Where are your cameras? Why isn't there some effort to provide private camera coverage of these demonstrations?

      There is. It's grassroots, but we are out there. For examples of what I'm talking about, I suggest you look at indymedia.

      If the opponents of a protest are smarter and better prepared than you, then who is really to blame? I know that organizing demonstrators can be like herding cats, but somebody has to think of these things and get the counter-surveilance implemented.

      There are also real limits imposed by the police when people try to do this. They take your cameras, arrest you, beat you, etc. I'd like to get cameras mounted from above, where they are hard to get at, and broadcast in real time, but the costs plus the government censorship is really prohibitive here.

      I'd even bet that they would consider that kind of observation as some kind of domestic terrorisim.

  2. Frined of mine ins into Faulin Gong. by Unknown+Poltroon · · Score: 3, Insightful

    FOr good or bad, whatever. THe interesting bit is, every time they have a parade/demonstration in the us, they get their pictures taken by chinese guys i vans with high quality camera.

    THey just had one of their members, a U.S. CITIZEN arrested in china, getting off the plane to visit his family. Basically he was arrested for something he did in this country. THE Skylarov case comes to mind. I like how the us and uk are emulating china in their policies.

    --
    All Troll + "offtopic" mods are meta moderated as "Unfair", because you abused the system.
  3. seems logical... by jeffy124 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    police in many cities worldwide do video surviellence of major demonstrations/protests/etc - but as part of their own defense. Some protest groups, for whatever reason, are quick to say there was undue police force involved if they get arrested, deny things like resisting arrest, etc. The tapes are used to counter those arguments.

    Think I'm off my rocker? Guess what - protest groups bring their own cameras to do their own surveillence of the police. It's used both ways to keep everyone (protesters and police) in check.

    --
    The One Rule Of Chess You'll Ever Need: Don't play someone who carries a kit in their bookbag.
    1. Re:seems logical... by andyt · · Score: 3, Insightful

      police in many cities worldwide do video surviellence of major demonstrations/protests/etc - but as part of their own defense. Some protest groups, for whatever reason, are quick to say there was undue police force involved if they get arrested, deny things like resisting arrest, etc. The tapes are used to counter those arguments.

      Think I'm off my rocker? Guess what - protest groups bring their own cameras to do their own surveillence of the police. It's used both ways to keep everyone (protesters and police) in check.

      Seems to me that the difference is that the police can make those cameras "go away" fairly easily.

      Thud! Splat! No more pesky camera.....

  4. Eh, could just be common sense. by Paddyish · · Score: 3, Interesting

    It may not be a coincidence, but that still doesn't make it a big deal. Since there may be a lack of traffic along the parade route, it seems to me that it would be a good time to take the system down for maintenance. There probably won't be a big need for it.