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Washington State Legalizes NEVs on Public Roads
ptorrone writes "Washington State just passed NEV legislation, legalizing them for in-road use. NEVs are neighborhood electric vehicles. This is a big deal with more and more consumers having the choice of a variety of non-car solutions, we'll see charging stations and more people in general considering alternative transportation means. It'll also be fun to geek out some NEVs." From zero to twenty in 9.8 seconds!
so do you think that all bicycles should be off the road? they can't keep up with traffic either. modern working cars -do- pollute, in fact that's where over half of the pollution comes from in my state (wa).
The problem with this is that there aren't really any road-capable NEV's or whatever you want to refer to them as.
The segway hits a top speed of what....11MPH? Do you really want to get stuck behind some yuppie and his $5000 segway inching along the street when you are in a rush to get to the office?
We already have enough traffic problems with vehicles that CAN do the speed limit, lets not worry about alternative transportation until it can at least keep up with normal means of travel.
I would expect such blatant racism on Fark, but on Slashdot? Mods please ban this asshole.
How is a bike a danger? It typically weighs 20-30lbs and travels 20-30 mph cf a car that weights 100 times as much, and travles about 2wice as fast Cars are much more dangerious.
Bikes can travel near the shoulder and do not obstruct the flow of faster moving traffic. Indeed in stop and go traffic bikes can 'white-line' and are faster than cars.
Pedaling 45 mph (posted speed limit) is not the problem. Pedaling 45 mph and having traffic merging to your right at 60mph is the problem. Doubters can take East Cahuenga from Burbank to Los Angeles, running alongside the 5 Freeway (Cahuenga Pass), by bicycle - I did that for several months as part of a 15 mile commute (that's 15 miles each way, 30 miles a day.) Face it, you're always going to have normal car traffic going way faster than any other traffic (ie, semi trailers, campers, old people in cadillacs, bicycles) unless there just happens to be a cop there. Then EVERYBODY slows down...
Frankly, bikes can travel faster than NEVs can (NEV's, by DEFINITION have a top speed of 25mph - and are speed governed to ensure that speed...) A more useful speed would have been 40mph - that way an NEV could keep up with most traffic in the slowest lane. Unfortunately, I doubt many people want to chance 40mph in a souped up golf cart without doors (yes, I know you can buy doors as an option), and very little in the way of crash-collision engineering.
Ever test drive one of these things? It's incredibly irritating to floor the accelerator and feel like you're on a Disneyland Autotopia car - only slower (although there is noticable absence of motor noise and gasoline exhaust fumes.) The price isn't too shabby if you need a utility cart - $5k. But no, they clearly are not designed to blend in with normal traffic - something that many cyclists (assuming they're obeying traffic laws) can do easily on most city streets.
NEV = Neighborhood Electric Vehicle
So yeah, Segways, those fancy golf carts, the expensive little motorized scooters, and maybe even some metermaid mobiles all fall into this category.
But I have a question for anyone else:
Why are electric vehicles considered zero emission?
You burn fossil fuels to make electricity, then transfer that power into chemical energy in the batteries, then turn that energy back into electricity later to turn an electric motor to drive to the store... how is this not causing emmissions? Oh, and don't forget that according to the 2nd law of thermodynamics, you've lost energy at every step in that process, so you are probably not as efficient as a good gasoline engine (by good, I mean efficient - not a V-12 Dodge monster).
I have always been sceptical of calling electric vehicles "zero-emission." All you're doing is removing yourself a few steps from the emissions. It's like having a really long exhaust pipe, and then claiming that since the exhaust fumes are nowhere near your car, you aren't the one causing them.
If someone's say, charging their electric vehicle via solar panels, that would be completely different.
Woah, that went a little offtopic, didn't it?
Ahh well, as long as I've started, I might as well keep going: Linux is SOOO much better that Windows! Go opensource!
"You burn fossil fuels to make electricity"
Ever hear of this thingy called "solar power"? Oh, you havent?
They're called that because they are zero-emission. What a silly question. You could always replace the dirty burning coal and oil power plants with much more efficient nuclear power. Or in the cases where the idiotic enviro-hippies have brainwashed the population that nuclear power is evvvviiiil you can use solar, hydroelectric, wind, etc. It's much easier to upgrade and replace one central source of something instead of trying to replace 100 million end nodes.
zero emission is probably a bad name, but they still are better for the enviroment than normal cars. when burning fossile fuel, its much more efficient to do it in one big power plant than doing it in thousands of sepperate engines
also, as others have pointed out, you could use alternative power sources
Sure it has an internal combustion engine... but have you considered the enviromental costs of producing all those batteries or solar cells in your electric vehicles? What are their expected life spans? These scooters will still be put-putting along when the apes take over, and they are made from almost all recycled steel and aluminum. The environmental costs over their expected life spans will put almost any electric vehicle to shame.
I just bought one for my wife New Scooter and it's an amazing little vehicle.
The best solution is rarely the highest technology one.
--Mark
But I have a question for anyone else:
:-)
Why are electric vehicles considered zero emission?
Even apart from the fact that the electricity might come from a 'clean' source there is still a reason why zero emission can be considered important: smog. Cities like Athens or New Mexico have become nearly unlivable because of it and smog is a valid consideration for almost any big city (except when you have a windy day in the midwest, then it is dust
If you build neighborhoods correctly, you don't need to rely on any external forces to get you the food you need.
Aye, there's one big source of our dependance on the auto. The U.S. has an *enormous* installed base of poorly-designed neighborhoods. Winding streets with no sidewalks, strict segregation of residential and commercial activities, and sprawling development (single-story houses on 3/4 acre lots. gag!) make it almost a requirement to drive to get any sort of outside input! NEVs are a stopgap solution, what we need in the long term is better urban planning. We need more mixed-use development, more compact residential areas, etc. The guiding principle should be to have everything needed on a daily basis within easy walking (or bicycle) distance from every home.
0 1 - just my two bits
Gasoline engines are around 20% efficient, whereas electric motors are 90+% efficient. You don't need to burn fossil fuels to get electricity either. You can use nuclear, solar, wind, water, or geothermal.
-"I talked to God and here's the deal/ He said to floss between each meal" -- Uninvited
We use more renewable enrgy than you thank,
not nearly enough of course. Besides, there
are two arguments for using electric even
though that energy clearly has to come from
somewhere
1) It is cheaper and easier to make a more
efficient, cleaner single large power plant
than it is to try to make millions of small
efficient clean vehicles
2) electric vehicles are source agnostic,
they don't care what the source of the energy
is and it would make it that much easier to switch the economy over. Only a few key players would
have to change vs. every ignorant or mis-informed
Tom, Dick and Harry.
PS> And for something like an NEV with low
energy requirements it would be quite easy
to setup a photovoltaic system for charging.
Were that I say, pancakes?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."