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IT at the CIA

neocon writes "The current issue of the CIA's Studies in Intelligence (unclassified edition, natch) has an article on the state of IT within the CIA, titled 'Failing to Keep Up With the Information Revolution', which looks at how the agency has fared in staying up to date both with information security needs and with promising new technologies."

40 of 314 comments (clear)

  1. What the CIA needs: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    less technical assets, more people in the field.

    1. Re:What the CIA needs: by Skyshadow · · Score: 4, Insightful
      I agree that there has been way too much dependance on electronic survailance in the past couple of decades. This has left us in a uniquely bad position to deal with threats from decentralized terrorist-type outfits. That's hard to argue.

      On the other hand, there's a lot more to technical assets than just spy satellites and evesdropping on phone calls. Specifically, the intelligence community needs to concentrate on technologies that will let them "know what they know", especially in the face of an exponential amount of available data.

      Example: Knowing that a terrorist is about to strike and knowing who and where they are is useless if one person knows about the threat, one person knows who the terrorist is and the location is in some obscure database (which is pretty much what happened on 9-11). It's only when that information is brought together that it becomes useful.

      Again, however, the CIA has dropped the ball on human assets in recent years, mostly because they (and the people who fund them) lacked the imagination to envision the new threats in the post-Soviet era. Hopefully, this is something that's being corrected as we speak.

      --
      Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
    2. Re:What the CIA needs: by tha_mink · · Score: 5, Insightful

      less technical assets, more people in the field.

      And you're qualified to make that assessment how exactly?

      --
      You'll have that sometimes...
    3. Re:What the CIA needs: by RobertNotBob · · Score: 4, Interesting
      One of the things I remember most clearly from the morning of 9-11 is the face of a former head of the CIA. He was going from one media outlet to another preaching from the mountaintop that this attack came because of a policy change preventing the CIA from paying known criminals. I don't remember his name off the top of my head, however I do remember he was on every channel saying the exact same thing over and over.

      So there were at least SOME people who recognized the need for Human Intelligence, but it unfortunately seems that they were run out of the organization rather than listened to.

      --
      ___ I don't respond to Anonymous Cowards, and I Never Mod them UP.
    4. Re:What the CIA needs: by kin_korn_karn · · Score: 3, Funny

      Mr. Clancy, there's no need to post as an Anonymous Coward here.

    5. Re:What the CIA needs: by Dr.+Scott · · Score: 3, Insightful
      NATO wanted to know the bore of the gun of a Soviet tank. There was one in East Germany. The US used satellites at a cost of millions of dollars. The British used someone to break into the facility to measure the bore. The cost was to replace the lock but the person who did it risked his life. The French took a Russian officer out to dinner, after having plied him with good food and lots of alcohol and just asked the him what the bore was.

      Not an anecdote, but an old joke, I think. And there's some truth to it. But that truth cuts both ways. Americans and Brits expend great effort to find out what the bore dimension is. The French are satisfied to learn what a drunken Russian officer says it is. That's not the same thing at all.

  2. Sounds like your typical govt agency by esconsult1 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    In my experience, it seems that politics and top down systems design without allowing for filtering up of ideas -- as it typical in most large orgs -- is responsible for this state of affairs.

    What makes an org nimble is when they listen to the people who actually dig the trenches. There is no difference in this case, between the CIA, and say, GM.

    1. Re:Sounds like your typical govt agency by ianscot · · Score: 4, Insightful
      What makes an org nimble is when they listen to the people who actually dig the trenches. There is no difference in this case, between the CIA, and say, GM.

      Working in a big corporate organization, I couldn't agree more wholeheartedly. You can see a million little bureaucratic failings in something like the CIA or the FBI, and they'll remind you of stuff the senior director at your company once did. Colleen Rowley's memo read like my dang diary -- the way they wouldn't even try for a warrant except under the circumstances they were accustomed to was sooo very typical, and the subsequent promotion of the higher-up who wouldn't pursue Moussaui was dead-on corporate America.

      (Makes me wonder why we talk so much about electing people who have business experience leading these enormous companies to public office... The CEO of United Airlines is as out-of-touch with the world of cause and effect as anyone out there.)

      --
      "Fundamentalism" isn't about divine morality. It's about human authority.
  3. biggest problem in the CIA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    TUTMA - They Use Too Many Acronyms

  4. firewall? we don't need no stinkin' firewall! by Black+Copter+Control · · Score: 5, Funny
    A friend of mine was talking to an IT type at CSIS (Canadian Security and Intelligence Service -- equivalent to CIA). He asked them what kind of firewall they used for their secure systems.

    "We don't use a firewall. We use an air gap."

    --
    OS Software is like love: The best way to make it grow is to give it away.
    1. Re:firewall? we don't need no stinkin' firewall! by SirWhoopass · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The US uses the same thing with SIPRNET. It is physically separate from the internet. Script kiddies like to gloat about how insecure military networks are and how they hacked into classified information. Not true. They may certainly have seen some "private" web sites with telephone or social security numbers, but not actual classified information. They'd need to dig a hole and splice fiber first.

    2. Re:firewall? we don't need no stinkin' firewall! by JohnnyCannuk · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Otherwise known as "sneaker net"...

      Seems better than a firewall to me. They can't hack you if you're not on the network. Isolated networks are always more secure than public ones, as long as the location they are at is physically secure and trust me, places like CSIS, CSE (our NSA) and the Mounties are VERY secure.

      Besides, your "friend" could lose his job if he told you what firewall they use on their public facing networks....

      --
      Never by hatred has hatred been appeased, only by kindness - the Buddha
  5. I had a chance to look at the classified edition by IWantMoreSpamPlease · · Score: 3, Funny

    Editing out the more sensitive bits (I'll put periods in for the text), here's what it says:

    "...all.....your......base......are.....not....b el ong....to....us...."

    --
    So rise up, all ye lost ones, as one, we'll claw the clouds.
  6. They are lying by bstadil · · Score: 3, Insightful
    They are lying.

    This is just a plug for more resources. Do you really believe they would publish this if it was true.

    Today Sig at /.

    What upsets me is not that you lied to me, but that from now on I can no longer believe you. -- Nietzsche

    is uncanny prescient.

    --
    Help fight continental drift.
  7. Bah, just a front! by BitwizeGHC · · Score: 4, Funny

    Everybody knows the "declassified" version is just a diversionary tactic to make us THINK the agency is behind the times, IT-wise. In reality, they've slipped nanites into everyone's drinking water to track the populace's movements and habits, beaming the data through the ether to the giant mainframe computers under Mt. Weather (where the CIA also happens to keep its massive drug stash).

    Remember, just because you're paranoid...

    --
    N4st0r, trixx0r h0bb1tz0rz! Th3y st0l3 0ur pr3c10uzz!
  8. /. in trouble? by Vengeance · · Score: 4, Funny

    In the news: Hackers at a web site called 'slash-dot' (we believe it to be a hate-site against Indian developers) have instituted a denial-of-service attack against CIA web servers. Teams are currently raiding several OSDN locations in order to preserve freedom.

    -- John Ashcroft, here to help you

    --
    It was a joke! When you give me that look it was a joke.
  9. Made for OSS.. by i_want_you_to_throw_ · · Score: 5, Interesting

    One reason is that DI offices cannot easily get funding for new software packages. The funding required for the development and testing of such tools--typically, tens of thousands of dollars per year--is small in comparison to the CIA's total budget. But it is enormous in the context of the discretionary funds that an individual office has--let alone an individual analyst.

    Another reason for open source. I'm the lone OSS outpost in my military operation and when the budget cuts came, the OSS got rolled out!

    Previously it was tough as hell but I am bringing in more and more OSS packages all the time that give some great functionality like Post-Nuke, phpESP, etc.

    Now I can damn near get away with murder because I am still bringing some great functionality in with no additional cost.

    This mantra has sold Linux more than anything else: "Services, not platforms".

    Repeat

    1. Re:Made for OSS.. by StandardDeviant · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Yeah, as I was reading that article, I was struck by how handy something like a secure version of LiveJournal would be to an intelligence organization. Each analyst could post things up, works in progress, tidbits of interest, or formal product, which could then be syndicated by other analysts and consumers of analytic content in a fluid manner (NB: obviously would need some additional access, authentication, and authorization infrastructure to regulate who can syndicate what). Further, the LJ codebase would allow feedback on each entry in the analyst's "text stream", or I should say "media stream". And as a bonus, clients exist to talk to LJ servers from pretty much any platform, and most don't require any knowledge of HTML or similar technologies by the end user. The source code for the LJ server system as well as most of the clients is available here but as usual for any outside product, it'd probably be wise to commission a source review of it before putting it into production in a secure environment. (This may be one way to help fund the projects, if possible, by commissioning project developers to contribute to the security process, and allowing the non-agency-specific security changes to be rolled back into the public sphere, analogous to the NSA's SELinux.)

  10. Way off base by mental_telepathy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As far as I can tell, the author's main concern is that the CIA is not keeping up with the private sector due to security constraints. All I can say is, thank God. Any recent security poll will tell you that corporations have multiple security incidents per year, even if they take an active interest in security. Do we really want the CIA to publish a statement saying some script kiddie is publishing the names of suspected terrorists?

  11. more info on In-Q-Tel by ih8apple · · Score: 4, Informative

    Are you guys familiar with In-Q-Tel? (It's mentioned in the article)

    Here's an article.
    and another...
    and another...
    and another...

  12. Not Exactly... by DesScorp · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Again, however, the CIA has dropped the ball on human assets in recent years, mostly because they (and the people who fund them) lacked the imagination to envision the new threats in the post-Soviet era".

    While the intelligence community did indeed have a lack of vision with post-Soviet threats, the biggest reason for the dropoff in human assets was a combonation of over-reliance on gee-whiz technologies, like satellite surveilance, and just plain El-Cheapo budgeting on the part of Congress. Basically, after 1991, the attitude was "what do we need spies for? We've got satellites now". After September 11th, when the media was ravaging the CIA for not preventing the attacks, Tom Clancy was interviewed, and his comments were right on the ball. He basically said "Look, we castrated the CIA, and now you're surprised that the agency is ineffective?". That barb was aimed especially at media members and Congressmen that were in such a hurry to save money by cutting personnel.

    --
    Life is hard, and the world is cruel
  13. It reads like a help desk... by gamgee5273 · · Score: 3, Interesting
    This is a similar tact, though not exact, to the help desk structures that are successful. The DI analyst's job sounds quite a bit like the job my staff has to handle, and many of the suggestions like the ones I am regularly making.

    I would suggest they actually look at those models. ITIL (the IT Infrastructure Library, brought to you by the British government) is an excellent set of guidelines to start off with...

    Then they can hire me. :)

  14. I worked for the navy at the pentagon. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    THe two networks are completely separate. Most people had a classified, and unclassified machine at their desk, completely separate. Once a disk had gone into a classified machine, it could never be used in an unclassified machineagain(In theory) same for hard drives and memory, including printer memory.

    TEh only time i have ever heard of the two networks being connected was a seinor chief plugged two lan cards into one computer, just messing around. Caught unholy hell for it, luckily he was the sharpest guy with the most experience in the office(Never fuck with a chief, they run EVERYTHING) and just got a verbal ass kicking, off the record. At least thats how i heard the story.

  15. Actually, I'm kind of cheered up by this. by kahei · · Score: 4, Funny


    It's nice to know the CIA has lots of people who just sit at desks and do boring stuff and spend their time trying to find pesky documents. I was afraid they *all* spent their time ferrying cocaine around southeast asia and creating military dictatorships.

    Sounds like they need to buy some nice commodity content-management and data mining software and a timesheet system. It's so cosy!

    --
    Whence? Hence. Whither? Thither.
  16. "Military Intelligence" is an oxymoron by djeaux · · Score: 3, Insightful
    I know it's a cliché, but it's true.

    I agree with the poster down the page who opined that what the CIA needs is more people in the field. Look around the typical IT department & ask yourself, "Are these geeks the kind of folks I want providing vital information to the guys who have their fingers on the nuclear button?"

    It's pretty obvious -- regardless of your position on operation Iraqi "Freedom" -- that electronic surveillance is not very reliable without plenty of dirty on-the-ground spying. Another way to put it is "Where are all those WMDs?" We saw the "pictures"...

    --
    "Obviously, I'm not an IBM computer any more than I'm an ashtray" (Bob Dylan)
  17. CIA Humint - Sigint - Remote Sensing by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The CIA's problem isn't a lack of funding, a lack of agents in the field or a lack of IT.

    The problem is that since 1980 it hasn't figured out anything in advance.

    1983 Hezbollah attacks on France/US missed
    1983 Marxist revolt in Granada missed
    1989 Czech border reforms missed
    1989 E. Germany fall missed
    1990 Iraqi invasion of Kuwait missed
    1991 Coup attempt in USSR missed
    1992-94 Islamists in Somalia missed
    1993 Bombing of WTC missed
    1998 African Embassy bombings missed
    1999 Attempt on DDG Sullivans missed
    2000 Bombing of Cole missed
    2001 WTC/Pentagon missed

    Clancy has been a CIA supporter for a long-time even though they don't accomplish anything anymore.

    I read the Hunt for Bin Laden which is about the Green Berets in Afghanistan which doesn't have anything nice to say about CIA either.

    I just don't see how they are relavent anymore.

    1. Re:CIA Humint - Sigint - Remote Sensing by fussman · · Score: 5, Insightful
      1983 Hezbollah attacks on France/US missed
      1983 Marxist revolt in Granada missed
      1989 Czech border reforms missed
      1989 E. Germany fall missed
      1990 Iraqi invasion of Kuwait missed
      1991 Coup attempt in USSR missed
      1992-94 Islamists in Somalia missed
      1993 Bombing of WTC missed
      1998 African Embassy bombings missed
      1999 Attempt on DDG Sullivans missed
      2000 Bombing of Cole missed
      2001 WTC/Pentagon missed

      Of course, it it always easier to look at the flaws of something rather that the strengths in the same area. How many things did they not 'miss' and actually have an unskilled civilian populace know about it?

      --
      Support Israeli punk bands. Man Alive.
    2. Re:CIA Humint - Sigint - Remote Sensing by stratjakt · · Score: 5, Insightful

      And what happened this memorial day weekend?

      What happened at the millenium celebrations?

      You can only compile a list of the misses, not hits. You have absolutely no idea what they've prevented.

      --
      I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
    3. Re:CIA Humint - Sigint - Remote Sensing by banzai51 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      1989 Czech border reforms missed

      1989 E. Germany fall missed

      1991 Coup attempt in USSR missed

      I don't know about the rest of the list, but those listed above were not 'missed'. The CIA was dead on in thier prediction of these events. Wether or not the leaders in charge heeded these assessments is another story.

      Plus, you'll never hear of the successes. CIA foils a bomb plot, bombing never happens, thus news never covers the event. So how sure are you that the CIA is ineffective?

    4. Re:CIA Humint - Sigint - Remote Sensing by f97tosc · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I read the Hunt for Bin Laden which is about the Green Berets in Afghanistan which doesn't have anything nice to say about CIA either.

      The conflict in Afghanistan was revolutionary because of CIA. They were there before any of the armed forces and they basically won the war by bribing/ persuading different fraction to join up against the Taliban.

      Also, has it occured to you that in the set of failed and successful CIA activities there is an extreme bias in which ones you ever hear about?

      Tor

    5. Re:CIA Humint - Sigint - Remote Sensing by the_rev_matt · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I understand that they can't broadcast their successes, but seriously, missing pretty fundamental things NOT perpetrated by a shady loose network of terrorists (like the fall of E Germany, Czech border reforms, Iraqi invasion of Kuwait (esp. considering he ASKED PERMISSION), Coup attempt in USSR, hell they missed the fall of the Soviet Union even though Gorbachev had been broadcasting it for YEARS).

      --
      this is getting old and so are you

      blog

    6. Re:CIA Humint - Sigint - Remote Sensing by EverDense · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The conflict in Afghanistan was revolutionary because of CIA. They were there before any of
      the armed forces and they basically won the war by bribing/ persuading different fraction to
      join up against the Taliban.


      At the end of the day, they were just cleaning up the mess they created in the first place.

      --
      http://jesus.everdense.com/
  18. not clear on the concept by gclef · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The first part of his analysis reads very clearly like someone who didn't bother to understand the business he was advising before spouting off. (This is a common problem with consultants.)

    He dismisses the security concerns that prevent a lot of technology deployment as risk elimination rather than risk management, and says that this attitude hurts IT deployment within the CIA. The thing is, he says this without understanding that the CIA's risk profile is *totally* different from a business risk profile. The CIA can not take risks that a business can, as lives, not dollars, are at stake in the work they do. Any actual security consultant who made that mistake would (should) be fired on the spot.

    Granted, it sounds like his other recommendations (streamlining procurement, merging different IT groups within the CIA) are reasonable, but as a security person, that first paragraph just set me off.

  19. recruiters told me this three years ago by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting
    I went to a job fair and talked with the CIA recruiters. They told me that if I was interested in cutting edge I should stay away. They had hardware and software that was older than dirt and had no budget for anything new and no forceable change in budget status.

    I had them send me the employment forms anyway...

    I then went to a dot.bomb - iCAST.com -
    I should have gone with the CIA::

    questions on the form ( in addition to listing all relatives, frinnds, neighbors, aquaintences, relatives neighbors aquaintences etc.)

    Do you have any issue with being relocated during your tenure with the CIA

    Do you understand that once hired you will remain an employee for a minimum of three years

    Do you understand that at any time you may be relocated to wherever we need your services

  20. e-mail vs. formal message traffic by KD7JZ · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I worked for a large 3 Letter Agency during the late 80's through the mid-90s and one large issue we had was the transition from formal message traffic to e-mail. The military/intel community for years had a network for sending formal message traffic. These were written messages with formal accountability. They could be used to order actions, dispatch personnel, transfer money. When e-mail came along it was a big challenge to figure out if that same accountability could be built into e-mail or not.

  21. Not a fair accounting.... by DesScorp · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Like any govermnet agency, CIA is going to screw up from time to time. But even if they had everything they wanted, they STILL couldn't be omniscient.

    Part of the problem is that CIA can't publicly talk about their successes much, for fear of jeapordizing personnel or methods. And even when they DO publicly make accurate predictions, often they're ignored.

    The perfect example of this happened in 1983. The CIA released a report called "Terminal Giants". It was either ignored or written off as "Reagan-esque right wing propoganda" by the media and leftist politicians. The prediction of the report? That the USSR's economy was dying because of excessive military spending, and that the Soviet Union could collapse within ten years.

    Nobody believed them. And to this day, CIA still doesn't get credit for that prediction.

    --
    Life is hard, and the world is cruel
  22. oh not THAT "It" by zzyzx · · Score: 4, Funny

    Anyone else think at first that this was going to be about the CIA buying some segways?

  23. This is not limited to the CIA by nemaispuke · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Before I retired from the Navy, I worked in an Intelligence facility at the Top Secret level. The equipment that was available to me was several Macs (to produce PowerPoint slides), a Sun Sparc 10 used as a file and print server, a terminal to connect to PROFS (IBM OfficeVision) to read Top Secret e-mail, another Mac to access the Secret LAN and read Secret e-mail. There were no unclassified PC's, Macs, or Unix workstations to "surf the net" despite reading an article in the same command about "open source intelligence". Part of the problem is compartmenting the information which makes it difficult to search for information since not everyone can access all the information based on the compartments an individual is cleared for. This will not go away soon. And let's not get into the politics of it.

  24. I still don't get it by supernova87a · · Score: 4, Funny

    who needs Information Technology at the Culinary Institute of America?

  25. Re:Insider info by dogfart · · Score: 4, Funny

    Didn't you know that the CIA provides a complete fake identity to all its agents? Passports, birth certificates, work history, even a slashdot user name?

    --

    "dope will get you through times of no money better than money will get you through times of no dope"