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Apple Sued Over Unix Trademark
Jerrry writes "CNET News reports The Open Group is suing Apple over unlicensed use of the Unix trademark, after Apple used the term in conjunction with its Mac OS X marketing. Apple, meanwhile, is countersuing to have the Unix trademark declared invalid because the term has become generic."
Unix has become a generic term. Removing trademark status would benefit not only Apple, but the free Unixes, Linux and the BSDs.
Guess they're not so Open about things after all?
Where do they come up with these names?
The problem isn't really the price, but rather the fact that MacOS X doesn't follow the given standards describing what framework a Unix is supposed to be based on. Take the directory tree as an example.
Thus, even if Apple did want to buy a license, they probably couldn't.
the use of "*nix" should pretty much prove their point.
Apple has countersued, asking a judge to declare that the trademark is invalid, because the term Unix has become generic.
And it has. So many companies have been marketing and otherwise throwing around the name "UNIX" for so long now -- what do you think the chances are that The Open Group formally licensed their trademark to each and every one of them?
The timing and selection of this lawsuit reeks of convenience.
The coolest voice ever.
They have also "threatened" to sue mfg'rs of toasters, PC accessories, and other computer mfg'rs for using pastel and bright color schemes on their products.
They really work to protect their brand more than anything else. I saw a cease and desist they sent to wincustomize.com for somebody emulating the OSX desktop look and feel on a PC.
Protecting IP is one thing, but Apple is tops when it comes to protecting their brand.
Personally, I think Apple is in the wrong here. I have seen some of these ads for OSX that basically say "It's just like UNIX" -I mean come-on, at least put a bullet next to the word or something.
what? what I thought we were in the trust tree in the nest, were we not?
(http://catb.org/~esr/writings/unix-koans/unix-nat ure.html)
Master Foo discourses on the Unix Nature
A student said to Master Foo: âoeWe are told that the firm called SCO holds true dominion over Unix.â
Master Foo nodded.
The student continued, âoeYet we are also told that the firm called OpenGroup also holds true dominion over Unix.â
Master Foo nodded.
âoeHow can this be?â asked the student.
Master Foo replied:
âoeSCO indeed has dominion over the code of Unix, but the code of Unix is not Unix. OpenGroup indeed has dominion over the name of Unix, but the name of Unix is not Unix.â
âoeWhat, then, is the Unix-nature?â asked the student.
Master Foo replied:
âoeNot code. Not name. Not mind. Not things. Always changing, yet never changing.â
âoeThe Unix-nature is simple and empty. Because it is simple and empty, it is more powerful than a typhoon.â
âoeMoving in accordance with the law of nature, it unfolds inexorably in the minds of programmers, assimilating designs to its own nature. All software that would compete with it must become like to it; empty, empty, profoundly empty, perfectly void, hail!.â
Upon hearing this, the student was enlightened.
When someone asks you about "UNIX," what's the first thing that comes to mind? BSD? A Class of Operating Systems? Linux? SCO? Sun? IBM? Apple? DOS?
I'll tell you what the answer is NOT: The OPEN GROUP. I don't even have a clue what they do. Most people have never heard of them, even most people who know what unix is.
Also, Apple is accurately describing their OS when they say it is Unix-Based.
The mark should be generic.
FreeBSD doesn't have as much money as Apple does....
Based on what? Are we to understand that frequent use of a trademark renders it generic? That is utterly preposterous. The Unix trademark is as zealously defended as the law requires, and beyond any reasonable doubt it is most certainly not generic. Is "Volkswagen" generic? How about "Coke" when referring to a beverage? Try it out in the marketplace and see how far you get.
Get real, folks.
It seems to me that everyone (and I mean absolutely everyone) who has so far posted here is missing one important aspect of this licensing/evaluation issue.
Unix is a standard. As I understand it, Linux is referred to as "*nix" because it hasn't passed the Open group's Unix standards evaluation. Just as companies are ISO-certified when they meet certain workflow, structural, managerial, and who-knows-what standards according to a very expensive evaluation, an OS will be certified as "Unix" once having been evaluated as specifically matching those standards.
Investors and entities considering contracting a company's services will use the "ISO-whatever" certification as an indicator that that company has been evaluated to have a certain set of qualities, just as those evaluating operating systems for a project will use the "Unix" certification as an indication of the OS's having met a certain set of standards.
Now, I'll have to leave the value and full meaning of the "Unix" standard up to someone else to define for us, but the point is that it is not the simple purchase of the right to use a trademark name.
Starting with Windows NT, there was a "POSIX compatibility layer" in Windows, but I don't believe that Microsoft ever claimed to be offering "Unix." However, if Apple were to win this suit, it is conceivable that the precedent would be set that would allow Microsoft - and anyone else producing an operating system - to claim that their operating systems wer "Unix."
If the term "Unix" is judged to have become as generic as "Kleenex," then there might well be a need to come up with another name, so that there can be a standard for future reference.
Personally, I suspect that Apple is not "upholding a principle" by not paying for a name that should be available to all breeds of "*nix," but rather that they know of something or many somethings that would prevent OS X from meeting the Open Group's Unix standard.
Nowhere on that page does Apple claim that OSX is UNIX, they only say that it is "UNIX-based", and that it has "The power of UNIX".
There are no tiger attacks in my area and it's all because this rock I'm holding keeps the tigers away.
One simple thing. They didn't. Their OS is based on Unix code for certain, it's pretty close to BSD compatible, but it's not Unix(tm) and, as your post shows, they've been marketing it in a way that can be argued to be misleading in that sense.
There's a big difference between Unix-like (Linux), genetic-unix (BSD) and branded Unix(tm) that's been thoroughly tested and certified by the Open Group. The trademark can't stop people from using the word unix in association with the first two, but it is illegal to use it in a way that implies or misleads that something is in the third category when it's not.
I don't know all the details here, but it's entirely possible that Apple has crossed that legal line.
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Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
Thanks
Bruce
Bruce Perens.
Thanks
Bruce
Bruce Perens.
On the other hand, it's not clear to me that Apple has violated the trademark. They are a little sloppy when they talk about OS X's Unix origins -- they really should make it clear that they have no license for the Unix trademark -- but it's perfectly legitimate for them to claim that OS X is derived from Unix.
Really this is about the Open Group struggling to hang onto the shreds of its dwinding relevence. Sun and HP still go through the motions of certifying their right to use the Unix trademark, but they don't make a big thing about it. And Linux continues to eat into the Unix marketplace, even though it isn't certified as compliant with any Unix specification. It probably could be, if anybody were willing to spend the money. But nobody is, and nobody cares -- which is bad for Open Group.
Seriously.
Apple has sued other PC makers for too closely copying the iMac. That's their trade dress and they've every right to it.
However Apple hasn't sued any toaster manufacturers unless you're referring to some of the really bad Compaq designs that ran really hot. Nor blender makers, vacuum manufacturers, not even the George Foreman Grill folks.
Just PC and OS folks too closely infringing on the iMac's trade dress.
Go ahead, rebut me. Find a citation where Apple has sued a non-computer related company for infringing. Apple iMac-identical items aside Apple has and can lay no claim to products with swoopy translucent plastic casings in bright colors. Rowenta irons, vTech phones, PaperMate ballpoint pens, all can be as harmonious as they wish with apple's iMac and remain unharassed.
If you've got a problem with a company go ahead and express it but don't go making things up.
I don't read ACs: If a post isn't worth so much as a nom de plume to its author then I wont bother either.
Slashdot needs a +1, Eloquent moderation for those posts that are, well, eloquent. You know the ones i mean.
Everyone here needs to take a pill and get a fucking clue. Apple and The Open Group included. I'll deal with each individually.
Slashdot Readers:
You guys are fucking unbelieveable. "Go Apple!" and all this shit. You've gotta be fucking kidding me. Learn something about what "UNIX" means, reflect upon it, then think about how destroying the Unix trademark might be a bad thing. For the unenlightened; You're only allowed to use the Unix trademark if you conform to the Unix specification. Why does this matter, and who cares? YOU care because you're posting to Slashdot only because of any number of specifications, a Unix spec probably being one of them. HTML being another. TCP/IP, C, Perl, SQL, 3-Phase Power at 110 or 220 volts, whatever. The point is that standards and specifications are the only way to provide reliable infrastructure. Let me bring it down to earth for your Slashdotted minds: You know that "United Linux" thing (or whatever the fuck they're calling it this week) where a bunch of distribution vendors are getting together to make a Linux specification? It's the same fucking thing as The Open Group! Supporting one but not the other is not only inconsistent, its hypocritical. The only way that Linux will ever be able to rival Microsoft is by providing a common specification for which to program and support. Similarly, this is one of the main reasons the Unix specification and it's accompanying trademark has been around for 20 years or so. This is why big iron almost always runs an implementation of the one true Unix specification. If Linux ever wants to move out of the closet and onto the production floor, it would be wise to follow suit.
So stop being such short-sighted pricks. Yes, trademarks and other IP are misused on a regular basis. However, that doesn't make them inherently evil.
The Open Group:
I can understand that you guys are upset that Apple has been using the word "UNIX" in it's marketing literature; because you probably feel like it diminishes your trademark. Realistically though, Apple has made a reasonable effort to say things like "Unix based..." and crap like that. You couldn't possibly have come to some sort of agreement? I mean, they're only part of the fucking group.
Apple:
I like what you're doing these days, but...
Stop being such hypocritical jackasses. You throw your IP around like Mike Tyson does women. Then when you step on someone's toes, instead of removing your foot; you press down harder so that you can knee them in the balls with your other leg. What an asinine thing to do. Don't forget that you own IP on standards and specs too. I mean shit, if you'd have started "The Firewire Group" as an off-shoot of the IEEE1394 working group, you'd probably be selling more iPods because I could use them as storage for my Sony DV Recorder. By the same token, if you ever want Rendevous to be at all useful to people in the real world, it has to be cross-platform. So either submit it to a standards body, or better yet, make "The Rendevous Group" and licence it out. Then, in 20 years you might understand The Open Group's position when someone else is selling "Rendevous Based" brain implants.
Okay, I think I'm done ranting now.
Remember: umount it before you fsck it.
Thank you all for pointing out the details of Apple's standards activities. I'm much better educated for it, without having to exact the effort to check the facts myself.(/SINCERITY)
The reason I didn't check them is because they are completely tertiary to the point. Perhaps I should have written more hypothetically, but I figured that might have been evident when I mentioned brain implants.
Do any of you have friends (insert obligatory slashdot joke here) that can only respond to one point of a multi-facted email or letter? I do, and I'm reminded of them here. For those who have trouble following, I'll condense my post into a list of points: (with bullets!)
- Standards and specifications are good.
- The Open Group should stop being IP nazis.
- Notwithstanding, Apple are hypocritical assholes for wanting to invalidate the Unix trademark and consequently the specification.
If you will, allow me to clarify a few things. Unfortunately, I didn't state explcitly that whether the standards are, free, open, closed or proprietary, I don't care. When it comes to standards I care about two things:- The quality of the spec, or the implementation of the standard.
- The documentation of said standard or spec.
I apologize to the IP bigots who had to waste their time screaming, "WHAT ABOUT OPEN STANDARDS!?!?" Your cause was never meant to be a part of this discussion. But since you brought it up, I might say a few things. As I mentioned before, IP isn't inherently evil. It just seems that way because it is often times wielded for the wrong reasons. Just as the GPL is a copyright licence, IP can often times work in your favor. The trick is to leverage it effectively and not get caught up in utopian visions of software without ownership. Please, allow me to get all Nash-like on you: What's best for both the group and the individual is what's best for both. Now some Darwinism as paraphrased from Ghost in the Shell: Overspecialize, and you breed in weakness. That is to say homogeneous groups or individuals are more susceptible to failure than a heterogenous group. Applied the world of IP the solution for success becomes quite clear: One must use IP to benefit not only one's self, but others to a proportionate degree. By the same token, if one behaves with only the group in mind; failure is inevitable, as the individual has not paid enough attention to it's own needs to remain viable. I await the responses of both your neighbourhood PHB and Mr. Stallman.Getting back to the point, I think I just gave a good reason why The Open Group might be best to stop hoarding their IP. ;)
As it relates to Apple, whatever they might be doing elsewhere is irrelevant. Similarly, the hypocritical bit is self-evident. What matters is that they are intent on destroying the IP of others for no one's benefit but their own. How would your life, or the life of any given slashdotter improve without a Unix trademark? It wouldn't. In fact, it might get irrevocably worse. This is perhaps the fault of The Open Group, because it seems to me that the Unix specification means very little without the Unix trademark; and vice-versa. I simply don't see the benefit of everyone and his dog being able to call their software "Unix". I do however, see a problem with the loss of the definition of exactly what is Unix and what isn't. Yes, I'm aware that they'd probably just come up with another name/trademark; But that then begs the question, "Why bother?"
Remember: umount it before you fsck it.