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Postal Wins Court Case Brought by USPS

Thanks to an anonymous reader for pointing out a press release announcing Postal developer Running With Scissors has been ruled victorious in a court case brought by the United States Postal Service. This seems to be the culmination of a trademark suit which began in 1997 after the release of the original Postal, as the USPS commented "All of us at the Postal Service have a sense of humor, but there is nothing funny about your game 'Postal'", and then tried to prove the Postal Service has a proprietary use of the word 'Postal'. Running With Scissors have fun with this legal resolution: "With unlimited financial resources comes unlimited ego. POSTAL and POSTAL 2 represent everything the USPS isn't: a successful private enterprise that will never have to rely on an irrevocable government contract to keep its pockets perpetually lined with cash."

54 comments

  1. Postal2? by redune45 · · Score: 2, Informative

    successful private enterprise
    Now I don't think anyone that has looked into Postal 2 at all would call it successful, (Read this review
    But I suppose it is successful at being a simulation of the USPS, that is ... crap

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    redune.com: The World 3.2 Megapixels at a time
    1. Re:Postal2? by redune45 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Woops missed the link

      --
      redune.com: The World 3.2 Megapixels at a time
  2. Lame. by Gizzmonic · · Score: 3, Funny

    I don't know which is lamer, the game Postal or the US Postal Service for trying to bring a lawsuit...

    Although I would like to point out that the US postal service has much more utility. You can use any mailbox, and they'll get it there for you.

    It's kind of like a game in itself, like you know, you try not to use the same mailbox for any letter. Like you could just put your bills in the mailbox in front of your house, but that's boring! For fun, how about mailing your gas bill in the one in the mailbox in front of the supermarket, your electric bill in the mailbox in front of the bank, etc etc. The fun never stops! And the mail still gets there, incredibly, no matter which box you choose!

    Once you've done that around your town for a few weeks, you're ready for the big fun. It's time to take a road trip...where? It doesn't matter! North, South, East, West....drive 900 miles and mail a different bill in every town you come across! Why, last Christmas, I mailed my utility bills (due in Texas) from Washington State! And they got there! Amazing, and just a testament to the hardworking men and women who work hard to bring you the absolute uniformity of those true-blue boxes, all marked with "US Mail" and just a sprinkle of magic.

    Thanks, US postal service, for making us laugh about love.

    --
    (-1, Raw and Uncut is the only way to read)
    1. Re:Lame. by coed.jpg · · Score: 0, Interesting

      Is it really a sprinkle of magic? Or is is a RAIN OF TERROR?

      You play it safe with your true-blue boxes, but let me tell you. Inside the post office is a whole other world. Nobody is safe. Tell me you feel comfortable when the clerk stares you down coldly while throwing your expensive laserdisc player on the ground and motioning for his cohort to park a forklift on it, and I'll tell you that you're as evil as they are. Their eyes don't move while they print our your postage stickers. Their face is frozen in gray, pasty lack of emotion while they tell you "This isn't the form you fill out to get insurance. Get the right one and get back in line. Next." Their souls are icy and unmoving.

      In the back, the part you DON'T see, the weapons are not of mass destruction, but the carcasses of once-healthy shipments are testament to the damage that is as well-hidden from the rest of the world as any Iraqi WMD. Ripped boxes, shattered electronics, trampled gifts from Grandma in Florida, mutilated rare finds on eBay. It's a death bed back there. Why do you think there's no way to get from the front of the building to the back? Why do you think they put all the barriers up between you and your mail? For efficiency and automation? Hardly. You're waiting in line for death. And you don't even have to take a number.

      The USPS filed suit because they know that each and every post office is a steaming, frothy cauldron of bitterness and contempt. Games like Postal make it seem like a joke, but to them it's serious... DEADLY serious. This ruling is only bad news for postal customers worldwide... don't think they aren't paying *close* attention. This is not the end of the battle. It's the start of a war.

      --

      Pictures |

    2. Re:Lame. by Gizzmonic · · Score: 1

      I enjoyed your quote. It's my sig now, check it out.

      --
      (-1, Raw and Uncut is the only way to read)
    3. Re:Lame. by macdaddy357 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The fact that the expression, "going postal," meaning losing your mind and going on a killing spree even exists indicates serious problems at the USPS. Their time and money would be better spent trying to improve workplace conditions so that no one ever goes "postal" again than bringing SLAPP suits against video game producers.

      --
      How ya like dat?
    4. Re:Lame. by couch_potato · · Score: 2, Informative

      My experience being a contract letter carrier has exposed me to some of the 'behind-the-scenes' action at the USPS. What good times there are, tossing around packages labelled FRAGILE (hey, they weren't insured!) and opening your Playboy magazines before they get into your grabby little hands.
      But in all seriousness, postal workers are generally more than happy to let you know that the Post Office is, statistically, one of the safer jobs in America. The fact that they are the largest employer in the country, second to the Armed Forces, explains the prevalence of 'going postal'. Postal workers don't flip out more than normal people, there's just so many of them. And when one goes and wipes out a whole zip codes worth of mailmen, it causes a sensation and suddenly all of those boys in those snappy blue suits are hellbent on destruction and mayhem. In the eyes of the media anyways. But we all know that it's the postmaster who you have to watch out for.
      Fun fact: postmasters are all issued M16 assault rifles and flak jackets which they keep in their lockers, just in case.

  3. Has anyone bought this? by Unknown+Poltroon · · Score: 1

    Is it worth it? I saw it in the store yesterday and was wondering.

    --
    All Troll + "offtopic" mods are meta moderated as "Unfair", because you abused the system.
    1. Re:Has anyone bought this? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      could you buy it, then set up some bit torrent files.

    2. Re:Has anyone bought this? by Meat+Blaster · · Score: 2, Informative
      A friend picked up the game. It isn't worth it. A chuckle here or there at off-color humor, a gasp or two at being able to set somebody on fire then urinate on them to put it out, etc.

      It's like the 2 Live Crew of video games. While greatly appreciative of the fact that they've fought on behalf of free speech, I have to say that neither is all that great once you actually get a chance to purchase it. GTA3 is probably the 'edgiest' game that has managed to provide a good gaming experience (although I'm open to hearing about others).

    3. Re:Has anyone bought this? by JavaLord · · Score: 1

      Yeah, it's fun. It's not a hardcore gaming experence. If you play an hour a day you will get about a week or two out of it. It's more fun to just randomly kill things though.

    4. Re:Has anyone bought this? by ronfar · · Score: 1
      a gasp or two at being able to set somebody on fire then urinate on them to put it out, etc.
      Damn, who does he think he is, Kaiser Soze? Actually, that's the game I want, when are they going to come out with that one. The Usual Suspects could be a hit...

      Oh well, hopefully I won't be disappointed by Killer 7.

      --
      All the creatures will die, And all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai. (Jubai, 1605)
    5. Re:Has anyone bought this? by Anonvmous+Coward · · Score: 1

      " GTA3 is probably the 'edgiest' game that has managed to provide a good gaming experience (although I'm open to hearing about others)."

      Vice City!

  4. Maybe TNN could use RWS's lawyers... by SniperPuppy · · Score: 1

    Perhaps they could show that The New TNN (SpikeTV) has no connection to Spike Lee, and that would help move the case along.

    And, yes, I know that Spike Jonez has joined the fray on TNN's side, which is also good news for the "good" folks at Viacom.

    I guess Mr. Lee needs something to do during the Knicks' offseason (wait a minute, it looks like the offseason even when the Knicks are playing!...)

    1. Re:Maybe TNN could use RWS's lawyers... by imitier · · Score: 1

      I believe that the Spike Jones who has joined TNN's side in this fray is not the Spike Jonze who directed "Being John Malkovich" and numerous music videos. Instead, it's Spike Jones Jr., son of the musician and comedian Spike Jones (who is, I suppose, the musical precursor to Weird 'Al' Yankovic.) I'd be curious to see where Spike Jonze (with a "z") is on this one. I can't believe a court gave Spike Lee a temporary injunction, but I'm pretty sure he will not succeed in the end. It's a generic word with common usage, it's not like his name is some fanciful word that he created himself.

    2. Re:Maybe TNN could use RWS's lawyers... by SniperPuppy · · Score: 1

      I'm hoping that TNN's lawyers use the ruling against the musician named Sting, in which the judge stated that "sting" is a common English work (as is spike), and as such cannot be copyrighted. The trial's a long way off, from what I've read, which is a shame, because Viacom really deserves to be able to go about its business and get their new name going, rather than be held up with some bogus lawsuit.

  5. successful private enterprise? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    With unlimited financial resources comes unlimited ego. POSTAL and POSTAL 2 represent everything the USPS isn't: a successful private enterprise that will never have to rely on an irrevocable government contract to keep its pockets perpetually lined with cash.

    christ, this is a little over-the-top isn't it? For one thing, I have no idea what this piss-ant company is or what Postal is.. apparently it's a game? I do know what the US postal service is. Mailboxes on every corner, daily mail delivery, decent prices, and decent service (in my experience anyway).

    The USPS' pockets are not "perpetually lined with cash". The USPS is having problems with cash in fact. Congress has been very unwilling to do anything to help them because of the current "private enterprise trumps all" mentality.

    Oh well, gotta do something to draw attention to yourself I guess. PS: be sure to thank the government for the government-enforced copyright monopoly that let's you have that successful private enterprise in the first place.

  6. umm by mrpuffypants · · Score: 2, Interesting

    as anybody who works for the post office can tell you there's not a lot of arrogant pride around there. Our current president wantts to take the USPS and turrn it into a private business, effectively killing the perpetuation of consistent and federally mandated service at regulated prices.

    As for a shitty company that makes even shittier games....well......

    1. Re:umm by PainKilleR-CE · · Score: 1

      Our current president wantts to take the USPS and turrn it into a private business, effectively killing the perpetuation of consistent and federally mandated service at regulated prices.

      How much is a stamp again? I lost track when I ran out of the 1 cent mark-up stamps and started doubling up to finally get rid of the roll of stamps I bought two years ago. I know they've raised the price of stamps at least twice since I did that. Regulated? Maybe, but not very well, and last time I checked to see what the price hike paid for, about 75+% of it was to reduce the cost of bulk mail, which I would pay you not to deliver thank you very much.

      --
      -PainKilleR-[CE]
    2. Re:umm by lmsig · · Score: 1

      The united states has one of the most efficient and well priced postal systems in the world. Bulk mail is what keeps the prices DOWN! Think economics of scale. It wouldn't be worth delivering mail if people only recieved a few items a week (really... think about how much mail you get that is truly your mail and not just junk). Without the junk/bulk mail it would cost you a fortune to mail anything because the infrastructure would be so expensive.

      --
      .plan!! what plan?
    3. Re:umm by PainKilleR-CE · · Score: 1

      Without the junk/bulk mail it would cost you a fortune to mail anything because the infrastructure would be so expensive

      OK, keep the junk mail, force people to pay more to mail me stuff. Maybe then they'll let me pay my bills online instead of sending me a statement every month and expecting me to send them a check (considering I write maybe 2 checks a month and pay everything else online...).

      --
      -PainKilleR-[CE]
    4. Re:umm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you capitalist/conservitiev/republican losers should fuck off.

    5. Re:umm by indead · · Score: 1

      OK, keep the junk mail, force people to pay more to mail me stuff.

      Weren't you complaining one comment above about the rate increases?

    6. Re:umm by PainKilleR-CE · · Score: 1

      yes. Wonderful how that works, isn't it? I complain about rate increases when people bitch about wanting the mail to remain regulated (to keep prices down), but when it comes right down to it, I'd pay more money to send the few things I do mail out if they would stop delivering crap to my mailbox.

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      -PainKilleR-[CE]
    7. Re:umm by indead · · Score: 1

      I really don't care about junk snail mail, myself.

      You can just drop in the trash can, which I keep right by the door for just such a purpose.

  7. Who's Fault? by Schnapple · · Score: 4, Informative
    Right, so let's get to the root of this, shall we?

    The game Postal was named such so as to be like the phrase "going postal", which generically refers to getting angry to the point of snapping, sometimes resulting in violence.

    The term stemmed from a rash of violent incidents in which postal workers came into their office (their post office) and would shoot up the place - sometimes due to inane stress levels and buracracy, other times because of being fired.

    Why this happened mostly in post offices is anyone's guess, but the aforementioned buracracy, the pre-email volumes of mail causing stress, and the fact that since it was a government institution, striking was illegal.

    Ergo, the game Postal took its name from a slang term, which took its name from the office where workplace violence was more or less common, and the reasons stemmed from the USPS themselves.

    In short, it's the USPS' fault that the game got named that way. This is no different than Google trying to sue for the use of the slang term "google", except that Google's repsonse time is quicker. Oh, and no one gets killed when you go google.

    1. Re:Who's Fault? by mrpuffypants · · Score: 1

      except altavista, of course :)

    2. Re:Who's Fault? by gmhowell · · Score: 1

      It happened because the USPS is a firm believer in 'time motion' studies. They stated exactly where employees were to stand, exactly how to move their bodies, etc. They used to have yellow boxes and such painted around. Except for breaks, you stay in that spot for 8 hours. To call it maddening is insufficient.

      --
      Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
    3. Re:Who's Fault? by ruprechtjones · · Score: 1

      Fuzzy memory of a Cheers episode:

      Norm: "What is it with postal workers going postal, anyway?"

      Cliff: (With a crazed look in his eyes) "Because it never stops. The mail never stops coming! You think you're done, then there's more, and more, and more, and..."

      Norm: "Okay Cliff, it's okay, have another beer..."

      couldn't find the actual verbage on Google.

      --
      Kip Hawley is an idiot.
    4. Re:Who's Fault? by ruprechtjones · · Score: 1

      Found it, it was Newman's line:

      "Newman had a simple explanation for why mail carriers might go crazy. Because the mail never stops. It just keeps coming and coming."

      from lot's of google-digging for such a small point to be made...

      --
      Kip Hawley is an idiot.
  8. Karma to burn by analog_line · · Score: 0

    Running With Scissors...

    OK, here's the real unvarnished truth. Your games suck ass. Really. If you picked 20 random postal workers from the thousands that the USPS employs, they could figure out a better way to make the "games" you call Postal and Postal 2. They're crap. Get over yourselves.

    You're right about you guys and gals being everything the USPS isn't. They do a job you whiny, pasty faced, losers wouldn't EVER want to do, and do it better than just about every other organization on the PLANET that does what they do. Get a life, get a clue, and get over yourselves.

    No one likes you. Go home.

    1. Re:Karma to burn by JavaLord · · Score: 1

      OK, here's the real unvarnished truth. Your games suck ass. Really. If you picked 20 random postal workers from the thousands that the USPS employs, they could figure out a better way to make the "games" you call Postal and Postal 2. They're crap. Get over yourselves. Funny, I saw someone walking around the other day with a "postal" T-Shirt on. Also, I like postal 2, as well as 3 other people I know who bought it after seeing me play it. Here is the real truth, just because you think a game "sucks" it doesn't mean they all do.

    2. Re:Karma to burn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, he was pretty much right on. Those games were terrible...embarrasing even. I wouldn't recommend them to anyone. There are too many other good games out there actually worth spending money on.

  9. one of the overlooked ironies of this case by jdvernon1976 · · Score: 2, Informative

    does anyone remember the fact that only months after this suit was filed, more(CNN December 1997) than (CNN September 1997) one postal worker opened fire on his co-workers?

    1. Re:one of the overlooked ironies of this case by Anonvmous+Coward · · Score: 1

      "does anyone remember the fact that only months after this suit was filed, more(CNN December 1997) than (CNN September 1997) one postal worker opened fire on his co-workers?"

      It's overlooked because it's doubtful any of those dudes are playing the games.

      Maybe I'm just a little too close to it, but I don't really see a correlation here. My dad works for the post office, and from what he tells me, it's basically a breeding ground for this type of behaviour. He tells me a LOT of stories of management really making life tough for employees.

      For example, they switched to a metric time system that everybody has a hard time reading. Despite this, you still have to clock in within so many seconds of the start of your shift. The margin of error was like 90 seconds. So if your start time was 9 am, you had to clock in between 9:00 am and 9:01:30 am. You cannot clock in early because they're not going to pay you to work longer, and they're not going to let you leave before the time you're scheduled to leave.

      It sounds Dilbertian, right? The problem is that we're not talking about dimwittedness here, we're talking about flat-out hostility. It doesn't help that they typically attract job applicants who are fascinated with guns.

  10. Here's the test I would use... by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 1

    If "going postal" has made it into the dictionary, like "D'Oh!" has, and presumably "blog" will, if it already hasn't. The the USPS's trademark is already too diluted for them to complain.

    Of course, the reason for the name choice in the first place is ironic. I guess the USPS thought it was time to "go postal" on RwS.

    The USPS does a good job overall, but as the article said, they are financed as much as necessary no matter how efficient they are.

    --
    You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
    1. Re:Here's the test I would use... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      I think that fact that they call themselves a postal service makes it pretty clear that postal is a word, not a trademark.

      They also have no sence of humor, because making a video game called postal is very funny.

    2. Re:Here's the test I would use... by PainKilleR-CE · · Score: 1

      Idiom:
      go postal

      Slang To become extremely angry or deranged, especially in an outburst of violence.


      from Dictionary.com, with a quick search for the word postal.

      The other important point is that the USPS derived their name from their function, rather than making up the word post or postal in regards to mail and mail delivery. Their name is generic, just like that of most other government services, and the USPS moniker that they've started using/advertising more recently is simply a response to UPS and FedEx being much more common-usage than United Parcel Service or Federal Express.

      Besides, if the court upheld the USPS' claim, what would happen to the Japanese Postal Service, the Military Postal Service Agency, and most other postal services around the world? ;)

      --
      -PainKilleR-[CE]
  11. SCO by AtariAmarok · · Score: 1

    They could change the name of this game to "Unix". Or even Linux. No one ever sues over anything called Linux or Unix, do they?

    --
    Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
  12. Yep, and it is terrible! by Colonel+Blimp · · Score: 1
    I bought a copy off the street in Asia in April, and this game is beyond bad. Crappy game play, crappy load times (get up and make some tea in the two minutes it takes to load when you cross into another area of the town).

    Forget what they say about it being vile and violent and all that, its just a very poorly designed piece of crap game. Not worth the 2 dollars I paid for it. Not even worth its value as a coaster.

  13. Re:Frivolous lawsuit, like McDonald's suit by mstorer3772 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Every time some (half) wit chimes in with that comparison, it pisses me off.

    See, McDonnolds used to keep their coffee just below boiling. REALLY FUCKING HOT. No where near a temperature where you could actually drink it. This was policy. Their thinking was that people at the drive through were less likely to drink the coffee right away, so the hotter it was, the better.

    Okay, but see, people tend to hold their drinks in their croches. I've done it. And when nearly boiling coffee is spilled on your pink parts it can do you serious, long term damage. Mr Happy doesn't like second and third degree burns.

    So McDonnalds had already lost Many of these cases (no, I don't know how many). There was a legal precedent that had been set. Burn yourself, McDonnalds gives you some money.

    The point of the price tag on that particlar lawsuit is that the only way to get McDonnalds to actually change their policy was to make it too expensive to keep things as they were.

    So you jack the suit into the roof just to get the attention of this corporate monolith.

    From what I heard (and it's just a rumor) the lady took most of the money and handed to some burn victim charity.

    A little poking around revealed that some of what I read was right, some was not:

    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8& oe =UTF-8&q=coffee+spill+lawsuit+mcdonalds&spell= 1

    None of the linked pages say what happened to the money that was awarded, though the two I looked at agreed that the final sum was far less than the 2.7 million dollars of the original decision.

    Potential 3rd degree burns on your crotch, as company policy. To hell with that.

    --
    Fooz Meister
  14. Re:successful private enterprise? HA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Let's talk about monopoly:
    US postal service can only deliver 1st class mail,
    exempt from property taxes, federal gas taxes,
    state taxes, management gets bonuses. And if
    business is bad, well just raise the rate.
    Exactly what other company can you go to if you want to mail your letter
    F-ing nowhere!

  15. Re:Frivolous lawsuit, like McDonald's suit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So coffee temperature should be regulated by the govermnemt? Coffee is SUPPOSED to be hot. People like it that way. How many lawsuits will it take to bring coffee down another 20 degrees just so irresponsible people can be reckless and not worry about spilling dead cold coffee on their lap?

    Our precious liberties are going down the drain lawsuit by lawsuit..

  16. Going to get flamed but... by evil-osm · · Score: 1

    This is offtopic, but others seem to want to express how crappy Postal 2 was, so I will add in my $.02 and offer a differnt opinion.

    I kinda liked Postal and Postal 2. Now I am not saying by any means that they were fantastic games, but I do like them. Honestly playing Postal 2 was some pretty decent stress relief. I do have to say that the game got a bit boring and repetative after Wed (each level in the game is based on days of the week). Postal and Postal 2 are for people who don't really care about a story line, don't really care about why your doing it. Its for those who want some dark humor and some stress relief.

    If I had some recommondations for RWS's next Postal based game. Try to do a bit more than just a mod of a current game (Postal 2 was based off the Unreal 2 engine IIRC). It seemed rather limited in the violence (been covered in slashdot). Take Sodier of Fortune (the first one), plenty voilence in that, shoot someone in the head with a shotgun, their head explodes (sometimes half of it). Postal 2, shoot a guy in the head and he still stands, finally kill him and he is still intact (yeah yeah, "too much violence in the world", blah blah). Its the minor details with this stuff. It just felt like Postal 2 was a mod done by some professional programmers in about 4-5 months.

    RWS, just remember for the next game... details, details, details. Other than that, it was fun, good graphics, lots of dark humor (still have to laugh at how much quicker people would puke when you pee'd on them with Gonorrhea, as opposed to when you didn't have Gonorrhea).

    So mod me down, do what ever, just remember that this is my opionon, and I am in no way trying to inflict it on others.

    BTW, Gary Coleman kicks ass!

    --


    E.

    Never rub another man's rhubarb - The Joker
  17. Re:Frivolous lawsuit, like McDonald's suit by mstorer3772 · · Score: 1

    Well I don't know about you, but I'm not sure 2.7 million would be enough to cover 3rd degree burns to Mr. Happy.

    Makes me cringe just thinking about it.

    --
    Fooz Meister
  18. Re:successful private enterprise? HA by indead · · Score: 1

    US postal service can only deliver 1st class mail

    Huh? No, they have many types of mail they can deliver.

    Exactly what other company can you go to if you want to mail your letter
    F-ing nowhere!


    No, you can use Fed Ex, UPS, or any private courier. However, you will pay much, much more. I know, I've had letters fed-exed before.

  19. Re:Frivolous lawsuit, like McDonald's suit by indead · · Score: 1

    So coffee temperature should be regulated by the govermnemt?

    The government didn't regulate anything. McDonalds lost a civil lawsuit.

    You might also like dumping large amounts of salt on your backyard, but if that salt ruins my lawn, I can sue you. This doesn't mean the government is regulating anything. It simply means I can sue you if I feel you are fucking up my yard.

  20. As said another poster.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    Coffee is SUPPOSED to be hot.

    You are hereby awarded a 20,000 degree cup of coffee plasma for being too stupid to understand the difference between hot-enough-to-taste-good and hot-enough-to-give-3rd-degree-burns (and note that there are two unmentioned degrees in the middle).