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Telemarketers Sue Over "Do Not Call" List
Joey Patterson writes "CNN reports that 'Telemarketers expanded their legal challenge to the government's do-not-call list, suing a second federal agency over the call-blocking service for consumers that the industry says will devastate business and cost as many as two million jobs.'"
Was there a constitutional right to profit that I missed?
Wow, a lucrative publishing contract! I don't have to be evil anymore. --Meteor
one could argue that they never had a viable industry in the first place. I mean sure they were born during the gee-whiz days of telephone technology, but yesterdays novelties are today's nuisances.
Another industry with a doomed business model resorting to litigation to address its (short-term) problems.
.
If I were a telemarketer, I'd be overjoyed at the prospect of a national do-not-call list. It should be seen as a list of people who aren't likely to buy anything from me, thus reducing the time I waste calling people who probably won't buy. The feds even pay to maintain it!
Also . .
The suit's argument that jobs will be lost is worthless. If they were motivated by providing jobs, I wouldn't get so many pre-recorded solicitations. I'm sure the industry would eliminate almost all their employees if they thought it would bring them more profit.
'I ain't a liar, baby, and I ain't proud I just want what I'm not allowed.' -- Violent Femmes, 36-24-36
They finally have to find a more dignified job.
The message on the other side of this sig is false.
If the RIAA can get their continued existance legislated, it's only fair the telemarketing field gets the same treatment...
-insert a witty something-
Cry me a river.
If they (the Telemarketers) hadn't been so pushy uptil now, then the List wouldn't be necessary.
But they were, and so it is.
So 2 million high school&college kids/temp workers with no invested education for their job are out of work. They can go work anywhere else that doesn't require training.
Now how about the IT industry planning to fire 8% of it's US work force and move 3.3 million jobs to India and other Asian countries?
We need to sue/pass legislature/whatever to secure our jobs, damnit!
no comment
I'm confused. This means that half the people that buy products from telemarketers will sign up and therefore prevent themselves from buying new products?
Someone's being really stupid here. Is it the people that buy products & prevent themselves from buying more? Is it the telemarketers making this up? Or is it just me?
Practice Kind Randomness and Beautiful Acts of Nonsense.
You'd really think they'd notice the overwhelming response to the DNC registry and think "hey wait, maybe people really dont want to hear from us"...no such luck
If you can't see the value in jet powered ants you should turn in your nerd card. - Dunbal (464142)
It beats me why the telemarketers are complaining. Currently about 28 million numbers have been registered on the national Do Not Call list, of around 313 million phone numbers in the US - that's less than 10%.
Until 100% of numbers are registered I would have thought the telemarketers would have loved this. A tool that lets them to avoid wasting time calling people who don't want their services. This should make their operation much more efficient - in other words profitable.
If they really believe they offer a valuable service, then clearly 100% of numbers won't be registered and they can continue to operate a profitable business serving those who do want their calls. Those who don't want to be called aren't. Win-win.
Sailing over the event horizon
how many of those 2 million jobs that they claim will be MIA are located in the US?
Uh...I'm pretty sure they pay the phone company for the calls...
Not that I think the do-not-call list is a bad thing...I'm registered. I think this is the death of an industry, but a death that I want to happen. An industry's right to profit should end the moment it interfers with my rights.
Warning: Opinions known to be heavily biased.
Caller ID works as well.
The question then becomes *why* we should have to pay a service fee and do manual filtering to avoid being harassed in our own homes.
Heck, I can't figure out *why* we have to pay extra to have an unlisted number.
May we never see th
I live in Missouri where I have enjoyed the protection of a State Do Not Call List. I have received two calls in the (2 or 3?) years the list has been in operation.
Having a state do-not-call registry, I do not see how a national list will reduce the number of unsolicited calls.
You would think the national list will make it easier on telemarketers. It must be easier to deal with one list rather than 50.
You know, technically, the Federal government is for the people, by the people.
So if telemarketers are sueing the Federal government, then they are sueing both the people who buy their products, and those that do not wish even to consider them. In effect, we are looking at companies sueing consumers to force them to hear free speech. Fortunately, freedom of speech grants the right to say something; not the right to force others to listen.
It appears Ockham lost his razor and grew a beard.
Before everyone adds me to their Foes list, I want to say that I didn't last long: I quit. I was desperate for a summer job as a college student and thought that working indoors making a good wage was better than the crap jobs my buddies were getting pitching tar or whatever the hell they were doing in the heat. Funny thing is that I was selling premium television channels and I, personally, thought (still do) that TV was largely a waste. It took me a few weeks to develop my ability to sell something that I didn't believe in but pretty soon I was starting the heavy-sell over the phone. I was a hypocrite -- I personally thought what we were selling was crap.
Finally, one day I made a call and a very elderly woman answered the phone. I started into my sales pitch when she finally sobbed "Please, please, just leave me alone. My husband has died and I don't know how I'm going to pay my bills." And by god if I didn't have to bite my lip to stop myself from replying "You need some entertainment to distract you from your problems. Can I sign you up for the comedy channel?" Man, I was so programmed to try to turn a bad situation into a sale that it was just automatic! Fortunately, I still had some decency left and told her that I wished her best of luck and hung up. I quit the very next day. I still remember the look on the boss' face when I told him why I was quitting. I don't think he had ever had someone quit for moral reasons before. He was stunned that someone would voluntarily quit a high-paying, cushy job solely because of moral qualms. Because I had left before my shift was up, my ride wasn't there to pick me up. I walked all the way home in the rain. But I was happy. I had done the right thing.
Whenever I hear about the sob-stories of telemarketers, I simply remember back to those awful, awful people who I worked with those few weeks. Screw 'em.
GMD
watch this
you know i would like to sell crack on my corner, i hear it's quite lucrative
however, there is the small matter of the quality of life effect on my neighborhood, and my conscience about pushing an evil drug on people
where is the telemarketer's concern over the quality of life of the people they harass over the phone? and where is their conscience about wasting people's time?
who cares if it is 20 million jobs that are lost? telemarketing is an industry whose best place in the world is crumbling in the historical dustbin of defunct business models
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
To offset the revenue the telco loses from not being able to sell it...
Karma: Chameleon (mostly affected when you come and go, you come and go)
No, it doesn't. Caller ID does not stop the assholes who call and play prerecorded messages into my answering machine, making me waste time trying to find any real messages, nor does it prevent the phone from ringing. And I'll point out that those assholes who play the messages NEVER identify themselves as required by law -- they are required to tell me who they are and that they are selling something within the first 30 seconds, and they don't. Unfortunately, because the phone company has sold them service which deliberately shows up as "unavailable" on the caller ID, I can't sic the Attorney General on them.
Telemarketers have no first amendment right to harass me in my own home, period.
Since we got call waiting ALL of it has been eliminated!
Call waiting has nothing to do with stopping telemarketing.
If there are jobs that we don't want done, then they should be lost!
-Rob
We've had a "Do Not Call List", called the "telephone preference list", in the UK for over 3 years now. It works a treat. I haven't had a telemarketing call for over a year and if someone does call you just tell them you are on the list and they leave you alone sharpish.
Has it been devastating to companies in the UK? I don't think so. Maybe just to the shady ones that can only sell stuff over the phone because no advertisers will deal with them. I don't know about you but I think this is a good thing.
Consider this to be a "popular vote," as opposed to one that requires representation. I have cast my vote, and it says "go away."
It's kind of like having a speed limit on the highway. Yes, it restricts your ability to go fast, whenever you want. And yes, it places a restriction on how fast you can deliver material goods - which can be translated directly into "lost potential money" because it takes longer to deliver your wares.
Safety requirements "cost jobs" for manufacturers of toasters. Sound level restrictions on cars "cost jobs" for manufacturers of glass-pack mufflers. Telemarketing is an industry that is subject to federal/state/local regulations, just like all the rest.
So cry me a river. Deal with it.
Having to tell EVERY BUSINESS IN AMERICA that I don't want them to call me during dinner is foolish.
These companies do not have a right to profit. I do have a right to control access to myself.
What, do you think that anybody who puts their name on the DNC list would actually buy something from a telemarketer? If anything, this is going to increase their hit percentage.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
Heck, I can't figure out *why* we have to pay extra to have an unlisted number.
Ya know, that's a good point. Doesn't it make more sense to pay to get your listed? Not listing your number saves ink and paper, right?
Whereof we cannot speak, thereof we must be silent. --Ludwig Wittgenstein
Are you a frigging moron? If you were in arms reach I would just bitchslap you. If you feed your brood by calling me at home when I didnt ask you to in an innane attempt to sell me something I dont want, then you can all starve. Or you can quit being a frigging moron and get a real job. For the intellectually impared: You do NOT have the RIGHT to call me when I didnt ask you. If thats the only job you can get, then starve. Heartless? No, absolutely tired of bullshit telemarketing calls.
Simple method, works for me:
On caller ID, most telemarketers (and some businesses) show up as "out of area". Don't answer those, let 'em go to Answering machine / voicemail. If they leave a message (and you care), answer, if not, don't.
Remember, the phone is a convenience. It's there for your convienence, not necessarily for the other person's needs.
As a friend of mine's father said (about why he wasn't happy they were getting a phone) - "People call when it's convenient for them".
Of course, having worked telephone support for a software company, I can sit there and watch the phone ring, and not feel any need to answer it. But I'm just weird like that.
Alternately, you can listen to the entire telemarketer's proposal, act interested, and when they ask to transfer you to the "business manager" to complete the sale, say you're not interested, and hang up. It's rather rude to the telemarketer, but think of how many people you saved having to listen to their spiel...
I am dyslexia of borg - your ass will be laminated.
I take it a step further. I would never buy anything from these people because I wouldn't want to perpetuate the process. Even if someone called me this evening to offer a great deal on a product I've been hoping to buy, I'll gladly spend a little more money and inconvience just to break the cycle.
Who knows, maybe the poor soul on the other end of the line will finally get the picture and go out and find true employment.
They claim that they will lose money by not calling people who have indicated that they do not wish to be called?
So they are really saying that people who signed up do not know what is good for them, and they really would like to buy what the telemarketers are selling? What an insult. The overwhelming response to the do-not-call list makes it difficult for these people to continue to pretend that they are not leeches.
That's hours of my time spent doing something that serves me no purpose and waste's someone else's time as well. I think that second part is prtty important too. Why should telemarketers want to call people who obviously have no interest in buying their products? If their products are legit and they do have interested buyers somewhere, then they shouldn't be worrying about all the people who are going to hang up on them anyway. Every call they make that doesn't lead to a sale is lost money. Weeding out the futile calls should save them a lot of money.
If, on the other hand, their products are crap and NO ONE will want to buy it, save for the morons who can be talked into anything, then who cares if they can't sell them? I certainly don't. They need a better product, and a better marketing system.
This is just like the problem with internet ads. People spend so much time and effor (and money) on stupid methods of getting your attention (popups, animation, blinking, ads scrolling across the page, sounds, etc, etc, etc) because they know their products won't sell. They have no market, so they try to force their way into everyone's view hoping someone will bite. That's not how it works. Good businesses make products designed for a specific market and target their advertising to that market. I don't mind seeing an ad on slashdot for a compiler, and I'm likely to even click on that ad. That's good marketing. It's targeted well and it's a valuable product. There's no need for a popup there. However, I do mind seeing an ad (popup or otherwise) for a product completely unrelated to what I'm doing. An X10 ad popping up on my screen while I'm looking up programming references isn't going to lead to a sale. That's just ridiculous.
In summary, these people need to fire their marketing people (or maybe hire some if they don't have any) and try to actually sell a product instead of just throwing it out there hoping someone will see value in it.
if(!cool) exit(-1);
You should have every right to call me if you want to. Just as I have every right to put up a fence to prevent you.
Companies don't have rights. The constitution and the amendments, and for that matter most laws that govern human behavior don't apply to corporations. When did we get such a silly notion?
A telemarketer wants to sue me or the person who administrates the DNC for blocking his free speech? Go ahead. Just make sure you make your lawsuit personal.
Mr.Iwannabeabitch vs Mr.Bitchslapper.
Not
Telenagger Inc. vs MrBitchslapper.
Nor
Telenagger Inc. vs DNC.org
"Last one in is a rotten goblin!" - Kepp
Ah, and there is the holy grail of all telemarketing. You see, they realize that the majority of people want them drawn and quartered. However, the few people who can be talked into anything need to be reached at all costs. Guess what, many of said people are aware of their tendency to do this, so they would be some of the first people to get on the DNC registry along with the people who just hate telemarketing. They do this because they don't want their vulnerability targeted.
I apologize for not being able to find the study, but I once read one stating that if a telemarketer 'breaks the rules' and calls people who are on their company held DNC list, they make more sales than the people who are not on the list.
Aside from that, yes, it does make sense that they don't want to reach people who are not interested and never will be. But there is a group of people who may not be interested who can most certainly be talked into buying, and those are the ones they're gunning for.
Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
Which just goes to show who is really profiting from telemarketers: the phone companies. They've never had it so good. On the one hand, they're making a lot of money renting phone lines and dialing equipment to the telemarketers so they can bother you during dinner. Then that forces you to pay them extra to get caller ID (how many people would give up their caller ID if they weren't worried about telemarketers?) which has to be one of their highest margin services. Then they turn around and charge the telemarketers more money for the service that lets them block your caller ID, and you more money for the service that blocks people who block their caller ID. It's an arms race, and the phone companies are getting rich selling to both sides.
There's no point in questioning authority if you aren't going to listen to the answers.