White Wolf Sues Sony

etherlad writes "White Wolf, makers of pen-and-paper RPGs such as Vampire: The Masquerade and Werewolf: The Apocalypse, and author Nancy A. Collins, are suing Sony Pictures, Screen Gems and Lakeshore Entertainment for copyright infringement in the upcoming Underworld movie, which they claim not only is blatantly the World of Darkness with the serial numbers (partially) filed off, but that the movie is obviously ripped off Nancy Collins' novel Love of Monsters, also set in the World of Darkness. There's a PDF of the legal brief floating around, and to me (IANAL) it really looks like WW has a case."

Comments

I was talking about this

[Gryftir]

My friends and I are part of a LARP in Santa Cruz, (here if you are interested.) We were discussing the similarities, and this came up.

Interestingly, White Wolf is destroying the World of Darkness as part of a final wrap up of the meta plot.

You notice they aren't trying to stop the movie's release with an injunction, they just want a cut of the profits.

Re:I was talking about this

[Richard]

You notice they aren't trying to stop the movie's release with an injunction, they just want a cut of the profits.

Wrong.

126. White Wolf is therefore entitled to:
(a) A preliminary and permanent injunction preventing the distribution, marketing, release, sale, and rental of Underworld and Underworld: Bloodlines.

And then they repeat that claim, oh, 20 more times at least.

Re:I was talking about this

[thinlineofsanity]

They may be 'destroying' the WoD, but it helps if you read the press release.

For those wondering, here's the relevant snippet:

• May 2004

  Vampire: The Eternal Struggle -- Gehenna (ISBN 1-58846-626-4) -- a new booster set for Vampire: The Eternal Struggle featuring cards based on the Time of Judgment.

  An all-new World of Darkness launches in August of 2004.

In short, it's just a big event leading up to a re-invention of WoD.

White Wolf have a point

[TobascoKid]

From the WW press release:
"The volume of confusion in our marketplace is amazing," observes Tinney, "our fans think they're going to be seeing our film. Of course, if the movie gets released, in a way they will be."

When I first heard about the plot of the film, my first thought was that it was based on the White Wolf world, after all there was that short lived adaptation of VTM, maybe they decided to try the movies instead. I was a bit disappointed when I found out it was a 'clone'.

Tk

Penny Arcade Weighs In

[Decaffeinated Jedi]

Today's Penny Arcade offers a great perspective on this story.

The brief

[etherlad]

Here's the PDF. I urge people to read it befor emaking snap judgments. WW doesn't claim they invented vampires, for example.

As it was explained to me by someone who knows, it's not the individual similarities, it's the total. If there are 10 similarities, it doesn't matter that 1, 3, 4, 5, 7, 8, and 9 can all be found elsewhere, it's the fact that they're all found together which contributes (in this case) to the unique product identity which is the World of Darkness. So vampires have super-strength in both the WoD and Underworld: who cares? What matters is that, in addition to all the other similarites, makes it much much more likely that Underworld is ripping off WW. And if they don't mention everything in the brief, they pretty much can't even talk about it later.

So White Wolf is suing because there are a total of 61 points they've identified. That's a lot, no matter how you look at it.

For the hell of it, here they are:

1. In the World of Darkness, vampires have the ability to disappear from view. In

Underworld, vampires repeatedly vanish from view.

2. In the World of Darkness, some vampires are capable of amazing speed. In Underworld, some vampires move with amazing speed.

3. In the World of Darkness, vampires "have the strength of ten men." In Underworld, vampries "have the strength of ten men."

4. In the World of Darkness, vampires are divided by age distinctions, and older vampires are more powerful and able to rule over younger vampires. In Underworld, vampires are divided by age distinctions, and older vampires are more powerful and are able to rule over younger vampires.

5. In the World of Darkness, the more ancient and powerful vampires are referred to as Elders. In Underworld, the more ancient and powerful vampires are referred to as Elders.

6. In the World of Darkness, vampires, especially Elders, are able to go into a state where they do not rise as normal, but stay alive i nan extended sleep or hibernation. In Underworld, The Elders are in a hibernation state where they do not rise as normal, but stay alive in an extended sleep.

7. In the World of Darkness, vampires in extended sleep lose blood and become more withered and mummified, and return to normal as they feed. In Underworld, Victor (a vampire Elder) awakens from an extended sleep appearing withered and mummified, and returns to normal the more he feeds on blood.

8. In the World of Darkness, a vampire in hibernation remains that way until a vampire provides them with blood. In Underworld, Selene (the main character) rouses Viktor from hibernation using her own blood, just as another Elder (Amelia) was supposed to do.

9. In the World of Darkness, even when in hibernation or when recently roused, elder vampires command a great deal of power and control. In Underworld, Victor, the Elder vampire, "radiates absolute power and control" even when recently roused.

10. In the World of Darkness, vampires are described as "alien." In Underworld, vampires are described as "alien."

11. In the World of Darkness, some vampire groups ("Sabbat") refer to themselves as Covens, and divide into Old World and New World Covens. In Underworld, the vampries divide into Old World and New World Covens.

12. In the World of Darkness, many North African or Middle Eastern vampires belong to a clan of assassins and warriors (called "Assamites"). In the Underworld movie trailer, Kahn, the leader of the Death Dealers, a group of assassins and warriors, appears to be of Northern African or Middle Eastern descent.

13. In the World of Darkness, vampires sometimes call each other "Vee," short for vampire. In Underworld, there is a vampire character named Vee.

14. In the World of Darkness, vampires are organized into Bloodlines. In Underw

Re:The brief

[PainKilleR-CE]

I would say that #35 was the first one that really caught me off guard.

Still, it also reminded me that I have to go back and re-read my Necroscope books, because I don't remember if Lumley's vampires/werewolves cast reflections or not (and if they didn't, whether it was a physical property or simply something they manifested in the minds of humans).

Oh well, just a good reason to get off my ass and find the last couple of books I don't have in the series and read the one or two I haven't read yet that are on my shelf.

Re:blah

[theghost]

Preface: WW = White Wolf, WoD = World of Darkness

Wow. Sounds like you have more than a few grudges against WW and you're allowing them to cloud your judgement on this issue.

I'll address them in no particular order:

WW didn't "steal" the mythos of Ars Magica. They had permission to adapt it into a modern game set in the WoD. Ars Magica, while it may have been great for many reasons was never a popular, money-making game. That's why it was abandoned by WW. To their credit, they did allow others to continue supporting it even though it could be considered a competitor to their Mage line. That alone should clue you in to their assessment of its economic viability.

Tolkien was an early contributor to the fantasy genre, but he was not the first, nor (imo) even the best. D&D readily acknowledges its inspirations. This includes Tolkien and a great many other fantasy authors. D&D has been smacked down by the Tolkien estate on at least one occasion where they got a little too close to the source material, just like WW is doing to Sony.

Anne Rice could very likely have won a similar lawsuit against WW when Vampire came out. She didn't try and so WW now has legitimate claim to their stuff and is entitled to defend it. They have not been frivolously attacking other vampire/werewolf movies. This one is special.

Read the similarities that are listed. They are numerous and not common to vampire/werewolf mythology. There is significant confusion among consumers. Almost everyone i know who is familiar with the WoD, hears about this movie and thinks it's either produced or endorsed by WW.

I thin there are generally too many lawsuits of this kind (one-click, Fair and Balanced, etc.) but that does not mean that all of them are frivolous. This one seems to have some merit.

I'm not sure about the outcome of this either. Let's think of this in extreme situations.

Scenario 1: WW wins and gains all rights to the movie + damages. Probable outcome: they release the film with some changes to make it more WoD compliant. They try to make nice with the actors and get them onboard for promotion, etc. and now have the start of a WoD movie franchise. If the movie does well then they try to make more movies, possibly sequels or just other WoD stories. Chances are good that they'll make a deal with some established company to do this, with the best bet being Sony itself.

Scenario 2: WW loses, the movie goes ahead as planned. The only press they get is negative, plus they probably have to pay court costs and maybe countersuit damages. They even risk losing the rights to their own trademarked properties. Ouch.

The middle ground involves WW settling for a share of the profits and/or a mandatory ad for the Vampire/Werewolf games at the beginning of the film. If the movie does well then chances are good that Sony & WW will be teaming up for more WoD-themed projects.

IMO WW has more to gain than to lose here and they have a better than 50-50 shot of winning. Most likely result: settlement.