Final Fantasy X-2 - Travesty Or Welcome Change?

Thanks to GameSpot for their hands-on preview of the English-language Final Fantasy X-2, ahead of the RPG's release on PS2 in early December. Early buzz on the title was mixed for fans of the normally staid Final Fantasy series, when "...rejoicing changed to bewilderment as more information and assets appeared - assets that had Yuna kickin' it in a pair of hot pants and packin' a pair of pistols." But the article suggests that mixing things up may be a good idea after all: "While we thought Final Fantasy X-2 would end up being viewed as an aberration in the Final Fantasy franchise, we're not so sure anymore. The localized story stays true to a lot of the classic themes the Final Fantasy games are known for, silliness notwithstanding."

Comments

Evolution of a franchise

[neostorm]

A lot of people had similar reactions when Final Fantasy 7 was released. Though 7 had much more groundbreaking additions to bring to the RPG scene, there were a lot of mixed reviews because it changed the formula that the series had held for several generations of products.

FFX-2 can be seen in a similar light, though I don't think anyone can argue it's brining anything new to the scene at all, in fact it has a good amount of backwards momentum for some existing Final Fantasy mechanics; the class change system existing in X-2 is severly crippled when compared to FF 5 or FF Tactics.
However this iteration just goes to show that Square does not fear change to their flagship product. Personaly I'm not going to touch this game with a 100-foot-pole, I think it's horrible as far as my tastes are concerned, but I have to give them respect for not falling into a repetitious churning of the "what works" formula(examples to this would be EASports and Disney entertainment), and continuing to experiment in the medium.
You have to have a lot of balls to display such extreme experimentation with your multi-million selling franchise as square has in recent years.

Re:Evolution of a franchise

[incubusnb]

Thats whats missing in Modern Gaming Companies nowadays, no other company is willing to take a risk on anything to intruduce new and unique gameplay enhancements. even to their B titles, thats whay there are so many clones out there.

for example, Rockstar took a risk and introduced a whole new gameplay enviroment to the world and it took off, now what are we seeing? GTA Clone upon GTA Clone. Why is this happening? Profit, thats all, take a great idea and run with it and you'll make money, even if the game sucks

Companies like Square have always been inovators and i give them full props for going the extra mile.

Bah!

[Anonymous Coward]

That's right, Bah! I say. They really didn't need to do X-2. One thing I've loved about the series, is in each incarnation, there's always something new/different to learn.

FF2 had a different way of increasing stats.
FF4 introduced summons
FF5 had the job system
FF6 had the equipping of Espers to learn magic
FF7 had materia and materia linking
FF8 had the equipping of certain items to learn certain spells
FF9 had a similar system, but introduced special abilities in to the mix as well.
FFX had the sphere system which was an interesting take on the job system

(I haven't played FF3 yet.) From what I understand FFX-2 uses near the same sphere system as before, and I can't help but feel the story is going to be a let down. After a big epic clash in FFX, it's gonna be real difficult for FFX-2 to live up to that.

Of course that's just my opinion, I could be right.

Re:Bah!

[Anonymous Coward]

"FF8 had the equipping of certain items to learn certain spells"

In FF8 you drew the spells out of the enemies you fought, you didn't gain them from items.

Re:Bah!

[brkello]

I always find this funny. FF8, by most people's accounts, was the worst of them all. FF8 is my personal favorite though. I really enjoyed having a character that wasn't a team player. He was independant and strong, but learned and developed along the way. I just found him to be more interesting than the normal good guy, team player, save the world type character. Ahh, all this talk of FF...makes me want to do the whole series over again...good memories.

Re:Bah!

[Wildfire Darkstar]

You've got your progression a little off there....

FF2 was the first mainstream console RPG to eliminate traditional experience-based level building. It's difficult to describe in one sentence, but the basic premise was that stats increased as you made use of them: your HP went up if, after a battle, your HP had been rendered critical. Your weapon proficiency went up when you used a particular weapon type a specific number of times. This system was essentially adopted by Square's other major franchise, the Final Fantasy Legend/SaGa series. This was also the first game in the series with a rotating party: three of your party members were with you for the entire game, but the fourth position changed multiple times throughout. Chocobos and Cid also appeared here for the first time....

FF3 was the first game in the series with a non-static job system: you could swap characters in and out of various different jobs during the game itself. It was also the first game to introduce summoned monsters, the ability to steal items, jump attacks, Moogles, and a rather startling variety of concepts and themes that would recur many times over the rest of the series. Personally, I'd consider FF3 to be the first game that truly resembles what the series was to become, and also probably the greatest RPG available for the NES/Famicom.

FF4's two big contributions were to go back to the static alignment of FF2 with a more or less completely revolving party (only the main character, Cecil, stayed in the party throughout), and to eliminate the traditional turn-based battle approach in favor of the new Active Time Battle system, which would be used through FF9, is being revisited for FFX-2, and in a few random other Square games, including Chrono Trigger.

FF5 brought FF3's job system back, but added a new wrinkle in the form of abilities. Sticking with a job for a length of time earned you specific skills from that job which could be carried over between jobs (and give you, for instance, a Knight who could cast Black magic, or whatever). It was also the last FF game before FFX-2 to have a completely static party lineup.

FF6, as you point out, had the Esper system for magic, but also for statistic adjustments: Espers not only taught you magic, but, on level advancement, would provide bonuses to affiliated statistics. This is, in some respects, a refinement of FF5's ability system, where AP earns you magic as opposed to battle abilities.

In FF8, while technically keeping experience points in place, you gained the bulk of statistical advances and the like through the junctioning system. Magic was treated as an item which could be drawn from monsters or from specific points on the world map. This magic could then be junctioned to specific stats on each of your characters, and would provide a bonus based on a number of factors, including strength of the spell, number of spells in your inventory, and nature of the spell (elemental junctioning a fire spell to your weapon would give your physical attacks a fire attribute, for instance).

FF9's system was actually something of a cross between FF6 and FF7's. In this, you learned abilities from your equipment through the accumulation of AP points. This system has recently been adopted, more or less, for the recently released Final Fantasy Tactics Advance.

FFX did have the sphere system, but it also deserves note for being the first FF game since FF2 to eliminate experience-based levelling entirely in favor of grid points, which would unlock new abilities on the aforementioned sphere grid. The game also dropped the ATB system in place since FF4 in favor of a more streamlined Charge Time Battle system which allowed for such things as swapping characters in and out of your party in the middle of battle.

Also, FFX-2 does not use anything resembling the sphere grid. It reintroduces the job system, but adds a number of new wrinkles, such as the ability to change jobs during battle. Plus, it drops FFX's CTB system in favor of a return to the old ATB standard, and brings back experience points. Gameplay-wise, FFX-2 seems to have little in common with the original FFX.

Proven success

[Anonymous Coward]

Square has always changed things for each FF game. They've always created good games. Some stories are weaker than others, but the gameplay's been rock solid.

One of the biggest complaints in FFX was how linear it was. It felt like watching a movie rather than playing a game. So in addition to the normal Square gameplay changes, they addressed this key complaint.

It's about as non-linear as it could be. Almost like it's a collection of side quests. The changes in jobs/classes may seem strange but Square's done well in the past with those changes so I'd expect it not to hurt the gameplay. It's been pretty successful in Japan so I'll have to pick it up and try it when it comes out here.

Re:Proven success

[Ondo]

Square has always changed things for each FF game. They've always created good games. Some stories are weaker than others, but the gameplay's been rock solid.

I disagree. I think the gameplay has been between bad and mediocre, but the stories are rock solid. However, they certaintly are a proven success.

Welcome change?

[feidaykin]

How about a look at the past so as to better understand the future? OK, let's try this...

POLL: What was your favorite FF game of all time? And please be sure you mention which numbering system you are using ( for example FF3 US is FF6 JAP).

I would have to say my favorite is the one I just mentioned. FF3/6 may have been the easiest of the games, but it was still enjoyable. It pushed the SNES graphics at the time, and had an excellent story with memorable characters.

So, what do the rest of you think?

Re:Welcome change?

[neostorm]

Probably Final Fantasy 6 as well. I have great memories of all three 16-bit Final Fantasies and have had a hard time chosing a favorite.
FF4 had a great story and characters (albeit cliche in many areas), FF5 had some incredible gameplay with the job system and there was a fantastic amount of exploration in the later parts. Final Fantasy 6 is the one that jumps to mind when I think of my favorite though. I guess I'd have to go with 6. So long, so much backstory for all the characters, so many sidequests and discoveries, so much exploration, and such groundbreaking plot for a 16-bit RPG (suicide?! The OPERA!? World destruction?!).
While the prior two carry great nostalgia for several overall advancements, the latter has so many individually significant memories of enjoyment that I can't not call it my favorite.

Re:Welcome change?

[LordLucless]

Using the Japanese System:

VI: Comes in at the all-round favorite. It totally trumped all previous NES/SNES titles. Graphics were as good as they got, the story was incredibly large in scope, the characters were well developed, distinct and likable. I also love fantasy and post-apocalyptic stuff. Here I get the best of both :)

VIII: I know everyone hates 8, and for many good reasons, but I just had to stick it in here. I loved the fact that the driving force behind the story was the romance. The weapon system was flawed (I could get 3 of the best weapons before I became a Seed through playing Triple Triad and modding cards), the skill system (Guardian Forces) I thought was terrible, the epic overstory was cliched and forced, but the characters and their inter-relationships were wonderful.

VII was good, I loved the materia system, and Sephiroth was an awesome bad guy, but it just didn't hit me hard enough.

More linear?!

[Palshife]

The game's structure may initially appear to be much more linear than FFX, due to a pretty standard mission-based structure.

MORE linear? How?!

Re:Sadly...

[sweetooth]

While I'm not a huge star trek fan by any stretch I have to admit the theme song for the new tv series was absolutely horrible. The show wasn't much better the couple of times I watched it, but I don't think the best theme song in the world would have changed that ;)

Final Fantasy on the other hand is something I'm a pretty big fan of. The main concern I have with the most recent FF games is the feeling that they have added more cut scenes that cause the game to feel linear more like a movie than a game. Other than that changes couldn't hurt too much could they? I mean if this one is a flop you could always go back to the tried and true FF style.

Kingdom Hearts: New Flagship?

[superultra]

Good points, all, neostorm. Although I'd suggest that for Square, Kingdom Hearts represented the about shift that you refer to, not FFX-2 (although, to be fair, I haven't played FFX-2)

Re:Sellout

[neostorm]

Actually, if Final Fantasy fans could make a (wise) choice in the matter we would have chosen that NONE of the games received a sequel. The majority of the time sequels are a tired way of recycling existing properties for profit. The only reason that Final Fantasy X received a sequel is because Square had already put so much production into the existing characters and groundwork that it was simple for them to lay down an extension of the pre-existing world. That is to say, it took the least amount of effort for this particular game.
Final Fantasy 7 may get a sequel in the future depending on how well Final Fantasy X does, but as soon as Square starts cranking out direct sequels then they will have truly lost their experimental edge. The Final Fantasy games have always been built on a single, self-structured story that begins and completes it's particular arc within the given title. Generally by the time you are complete with these games there should really be nothing left to see in it's universe, which is why it's so great that we continue to receive unique properties year-after-year in this series.
I agree that Final Fantasy X-2 is for the media-brainwashed masses who crave their pop-culture, but frankly I don't want to see a sequel to Final Fantasy 7 either because, as much as it brought to the genre in the first place, it change too much that was good about the series to begin with.

Good points

[Vaevictis666]

FFX already had the engine, models, structure, etc. ready on the same platform.

For an FF7 (or 8 or 9) sequel on the PS2, in order to get up to snuff quality-wise, they'd need to practically rewrite the entire thing - all the models/texturing would need to be redone, music possibly rescored, graphics engine rewritten (maybe not too bad if they could gut the FFX engine, but still).

Confused by change of costumes?

[Daetrin]

"...rejoicing changed to bewilderment as more information and assets appeared - assets that had Yuna kickin' it in a pair of hot pants and packin' a pair of pistols."

They specifically mention FF5 and Tactics in the review, why did they think the characters putting on funky costumes is so strange? FF5 certainly had some very odd looks when certain characters equiped certain jobs, so it's not really anything new.

I'm glad that the review says that "new skills and abilities that can be earned and mastered," although I'm unsure how any skills you learn will be worked in given the "change job class on the fly" system. I'd really like to see a full fledged job class system in the mainline FF series again though.

Re:Kingdom Hearts: New Flagship?

[Maserati]

Go rent Kingdom Hearts, or pick up a used copy. It's not formulaic at all. The familiar settings and characters help the game and add charm to a game that would have worked if cut from whole cloth and released as FF XI. The Gummy ship works like the airship in FF X2, and you can customize them with stuff you find or buy. The TGCs all work very well in the story. The cheese level is amazingly low. It's a fairly straightforward "kid from nowhere saves the universe and the girl" story, but not offensively so. Given the intensity the themes of despair, doubt and loneliness are presented with this is not a "kid game".

Adventuring with Donald and Goofy was actually pretty cool. And useful in combat, they're very good about hitting you with potions and saving your butt. The other characters you run into, some of whom you can bring into your party, are interesting. Well, Merlin and the Fairy Godmother got old fast, but the main story characters worked well. The Beast played in very well. And he kicks ass.

The original material in this is very good. The Heartless make a great enemy, there's enough whimsy in the character design that they aren't creepy, just scary 'cause you know their tough. The environments at the end stages are fantastic, rivaling or exceeding anything in FF X. The big bad boss you fight several times at the end bears a striking resemblance to Seymour. The stages of his transformation into progressively more dangerous forms is, however, executed much better. The sense that FF X was the rough draft of the design for KH is never more present than in how much more polished the Big Baddie is in KH.

Gameplay is just like FF X, except except for, well everything. KH plays like a 3D platformer, and a good one. Plus it has an RPG side that's nearly as deep as FFX. Most of the simplification is in the experience system, and in the fact that you only have one PC. It's an outstanding blend of RPG and platformer, in no way did it feel as if one element was tacked-on to the other.

I played KH before FF X (gonna defeat Sin this weekend !) and the renowned FF X looked much less sophisticated at first. The interaction with the environment in FF X just wasn't that great. Just walking around could be frustrating because there are places in the scene that look like you can jump up on easily, and they just aren't available. In KH you're fully in the environment, just as much as in Ratchet & Clank or Sly Cooper.

Puzzles are more varied in KH, which balances the more repetitive enemy selection. Boss battles in KH rule. Pretty much all the bosses are tough, and fun to beat. The Wicked Witch has a dragon form that is simply gorgeous. I walked into that fight with an odd spell selection loaded ("Stop" I consider to be a specialized spell). She looked at me with one head, open her mouth to breath fire, and I said "Stop !" *wham*wham*wham*. Put her down fast, taking very little damage. Others were brutal killing matches against enemiesI know I can beat, but can't pull off the timing the firs (several) tries.

Best of all, KH has no situations whatsoever in which you view a cutscene, return to gameplay and walk forward two steps to the next cutscene. Number two on my list of reasons to try it if you liked FF X is the ability to save anywhere. Except in between a series of three tough boss fights about 90% of the way through. What a pisser that was. I *knew* I was on the final track and could taste the end, but I had to break off and finish the Hades Cup to level my party just a bit.