Black & White - Most Overrated Game Ever?

Following on from our earlier story about GameSpy's 25 Most Overrated Games countdown, the Top 5 have been announced, and Lionhead's PC-based 'god game', Black & White, made it to the top spot, with GameSpy suggesting: "Sometimes... people want to love a game so badly that its reputation runs away with itself." Congratulations to an an anonymous reader for guessing right, before another commenter noticed screenshots for the Top 5 had already been uploaded, doh. Meanwhile, Penny Arcade chime in on the chart, commenting: "When you deny the profound effect of Donkey Kong Country's fully rendered sprites in 1994, making the system a bulwark against the 32-bit revolution, there is no educating you", and illustrating: "If a company that overhypes games does a feature on overhyped games, are they overhyping the game?"

Comments

It was entertaining at least.

[August_zero]

I'm not sure I would call it the most overrated game ever, over dogged on game ever perhaps. I mean yeah it was a mess, and yeah it didn't even come close to what it was supposed to do as described by its creator, the missions were lame yada yada yada.

But despite all that, I did at least have fun with it. Teaching my giant cow to eat children and crap all over my worshipers homes was great fun. Rolling flaming boulders into my own villages entertained me for far longer than it should have I suppose.

Broken, definately, but at least it was fun.

Re:It was entertaining at least.

[Zathrus]

They said several times that some of the games on the list were fun, but still overhyped. I do disagree with their ordering though -- B&W was nowhere near as overhyped as Daikatana. And, as you say, B&W at least managed to deliver on some of its promises while Daikatana delivered pretty much nothing but a waste of HD and CD space.

Re:It was entertaining at least.

[The Evil Couch]

I agree. the game was entirely what you put into it, much like some of the more popular games of more recent history, namely GTA3 and GTA:VC. all three games had plots that were pretty canned and missions that weren't particuarly inventive or engaging. just more of the same old thing that we've seen time and time again.

what set all the games apart, was that they let you roam free and do virtually anything that you wanted to do. for those that didn't have much of an interest in playing with what essentially a digital pet or playing as a god, the immediate gratification of beating someone to a bloody pool on the sidewalk with a bat or picking up a hooker in a sportscar rapidly overshadowed playing with a more in-depth tamagotchi.

I know that black and white was around before GTA3, but I would still rank it right there with the last two grand theft auto games, simply because the draw is the same. if black and white recieved absurdly high marks, it was because they were well-deserved at the time. they still are, really. there are very few games older than a year or so old and black and white is one of them.

personally, I think that gamespy is just trying to throw off their image of being a bunch of corporate sell-outs and yes-men by taking a few potshots at easy targets.

Re:It was entertaining at least.

[Sancho]

But overhyped is ever so slightly different from overrated. After Daikatana shipped (hell, even slightly before it shipped), it started getting negative reviews by the dozens. Everyone was talking about how much it sucked. It took much longer for Black and White to take its lumps. Even after it shipped, it was getting rave reviews about the ingenuity, the interface, etc. In fact, it took quite awhile for the negative reviews to start coming in, particularly ones that didn't involve actual bugs in the software.

Re:It was entertaining at least.

[Moraelin]

You know when a game is _really_ crap?

I was so stumped as to how could some reviewers give high scores to that pile of festering Black & White crap, I decided I'd see what my co-workers say about it. We had quite a few gaming maniacs, including one which had been in drone mode for a year straight, drooling over the upcoming B&W.

So I give them the CD. I even try not to influence them to my negative view of the game. Like I go, "hey, cool, there's this game where you play god, and can train a cow and stuff. wanna try it?"

So they'd take the CD. And bring it back after a day or two. Without exception, none of them liked it. At all. Even the former drooling fanboy all of a sudden tried to avoid talking about the game at all.

E.g.: Only _one_ of them was confortable with those mouse gestures. That one was one of our graphics artists, and very skilled with a mouse indeed. The rest (myself included) just wished that, since the retarded interface already painted the symbols at the bottom of the screen, we'd be allowed to just bloody click on them.

_That_'s how wide the gap was between the hype and Joe Average's impressions about that game. If that's not what overrated means, I don't know what is.

Revolutionary UI, but too few levels...

[jafuser]

Black & White may have had some issues, but I enjoyed it quite a bit. The only flaw I saw with it was that it should have come with 20+ levels instead of only (was it?) 5 levels.

The User Interface for the game had the best "feel" I've ever experienced in a 3D game. It was very easy to get around the world and manipulate the objects within it. It was also amazing how you could seamlessly scroll all the way out.

The "gestures" concept was also quite novel at the time.

It's a shame it did so poorly. I would have loved to see what they could have done with some further refinement to the GUI/3D Engine.

All they would have needed to do was design a few dozen levels and the game would have done so much better...

Gamespy's been smokin some crack.

[Anonymous Coward]

There whole deal the FF7 was over rated because FFT, and FFX were better is just bizarre. I think they've forgotten to consider the time at which it was released.

It's easy to look back 5 years or whatever and say that FF7's graphics are mediocre, etc. But at the time it was released it broke new ground all over the place.

The argument that FF6 had a better story is valid, that's fine, but damn if you can't just rip on it for not comparing up to FFT, or FFX.

Also one of the contributer comments remarked that the story just wasn't as epic. How the hell wasn't it? A genetically engineered super-villain hell bent on destroying the world, and damn near succeeding isn't epic anymore? Ok, ok, sure in FF6 the world was actually nearly destroyed, but as for the other games, the epic level wasn't quite the same.

Was FF7 overrated when it released? Hell no. Is it overrated now? In my opinion no. Is it one of the most overrated games of all time? Not even close.

I bought B&W the day it came out

[slaker]

I loved Syndicate and Populous. I thought I was going to get something fantastic. I did. It was a fantastic piece of shit.

I found showstopping bug after showstopping bug. Complaints in the official forum were being deleted rather than addressed. I literally spent 24 hours trying to get the game to run for more than five minutes at a time, and once it finally did, I found a different bug that prevented me from completing the first scenario.

Add to that the sheer amount of repetitive handholding involved in play (feeding your people, training your beastie), and the obnoxious gesture system, and you have something I wouldn't play even if I was given a salary to do it.

I ultimately wrote to EA and asked for my money back. Wanna know the good part? They gave it to me.

Daikatana overrated ??

[Militant Libertarian]

All the reviews I read were identicle to mine: Daikatana is complete crap..

Maybe they were trying to say that there was not a rating low enough to express the complete crappiness level of Daikatana, so therefore any rating given to it would have been way higher than it deserved.

Re:Daikatana overrated ??

[BrynM]

identicle: adj. The similarity of two testicles

Offtopic, but I couldn't resist.

Who the hell do they think they are...

[s88]

There are so many quotes in that piece that make me upset.

Lets start with Halo.
"Look, I'm glad so many people loved Halo. My beef's not with you."
So you are well aware of the overwhelming popularity of the game, yet you think it is "over rated." Apparently you and I differ greatly on our definition of overrated, as well as your role as a game reviewer. I don't give a crap what your personal opinion is of the game. Your job, as a "professional" reviewer, is to evaluate the game and make a judgment about what most gamers will think about the game. They go on to attach the other reviewers for giving Halo high marks. Well guess what, its STILL fucking popular! If its so overrated, then why can used game stores still charge 50 bucks for it? With the numbers it sold in, the used shelves should be filled with the worthless things if the game was so overrated. Get off your high horse and re-read your job description. Its a good game, its extremely popular, and so within the realm of game reviews, is by definition, deserving of high ratings, and certainly not overrated.

Mortal Kombat:
"The game was an instant hit... Fans persevered, but its popularity was driven more by infamy than quality. "
WTF are you talking about!? Now you are saying it was popular, but for the wrong reasons? People liked it, people played it, people continued to like and play it; where is the problem? Who frickin cares why it was popular... are you honestly going to sit there and type that people dropped countless quarters into Mortal Kombat machines because of "infamy"? Get a clue.

Again, dismount and join society.

Scott

Re:Who the hell do they think they are...

[Alkaiser]

Want to know which game site you can trust?

The one that doesn't presume it knows so much that they can spew out a Top X Games of all time in Category Y.

I seriously hate this make a list journalism. To top it off, Gamespy's retarded.

Look at some of the games that made it. Battlecruiser 3000 A.D. This is highly overrated...by WHO?! I don't know anyone who likes this game...or Daikatana for that matter. I think they started making an Overhyped list and then realized, "Oh wait a second, they advertise WITH US...we can't make fun of them!"

Then Starfleet Command...who here has played this besides me? And I liked the game. If you don't, it's probably because you didn't like Star Fleet Battles, the game it was based off of.

I figured games.slashdot.org was for game news, not the latest crap article someone was spitting out. Hey, when's the next new insertcredit incisive something or other coming out? I need see if there's really something worse than Gamespy out there now.

Re:Who the hell do they think they are...

[ivan256]

If its so overrated, then why can used game stores still charge 50 bucks for it?

Before you read what I'm about to say, just remember: you asked.

There's only one reason why a game can continue to sell for $50 used over a year after release, and this is true regardless of how good the game actually is: It's relative quality compared to all the other games on the (expensive) platform is high. That means that Halo is still popular because there is a decided lack of quality titles for the platform it has been exclusive on since the game was released. Were such quality titles available, Halo's popularity would have passed no matter how good the game was.

Besides, I game has to be highly thought of to be overrated.

Re:Who the hell do they think they are...

[oskillator]

They're called "experts."

A lot of people seem to be under the impression that everyone's opinion is just as valid as anyone elses. This is patently false. Some people are smart, some people are dumb. Some people are well versed in a subject, some people are dilettantes.

When determining the quality of any work of art, the opinion of an expert is worth more than the opinions of a million Joe Sixpacks.

Of course, when determining the amount of money a work makse, this all goes out the window and Joe Sixpack is all that matters. (And I probably shouldn't have to say this, but when you're determining whether or not you like a game or not, your opinion is all that matters.)

They are part of the problem

[marvinx]

I thought this whole countdown was pretty funny. Who better to complain about how games are overhyped than... those who do the hyping!

Let's think about this. GameSpy makes their money from advertising (among other things). Who advertises on their site? The game publishers! So is GameSpy going to publish that a brand new, multi-million dollar games sucks big ones? Nope! The advertisers would leave immediately.

GameSpy, including all the game magazines, can't be relied upon to deliver impartial news and reviews. It just can't happen. All those games are hyped for a reason. The trade press gets their money for doing the hyping.

Never ever trust one of those sites or magazines for impartial initial reviews. I have seen, however, after the game has been out for a while, some impartial reviews. This only happens after the wave of hype has passed. Then, and only then, will you see a game magazine or site say truthful things.

So, to GameSpy and other game press: Stop complaining about the hype, and stop being part of the problem!

Gamespy review

[daVinci1980]

Here.

Score: 91

"The final word: Black and White is one of the most unique -- and enjoyable -- strategy games we've seen this year."

Yeah, ok schmeg.

Words from someone who doesn't like FF7:

[Lendrick]

I don't like FF7 much myself (I prefer 6, 8, and 10), but that doesn't mean it deserved every drop of hype it received. Yes, it lacked a certain amount of polish; but that was largely because at the time it was probably the most ambitious game ever made. In fact, I would go so far as to say that later FF games were slightly less ambitious, if perhaps more polished.

Rough edges aside, though, it certainly wasn't overrated.

The only one that chaffes me is DOA3

[Elwood P Dowd]

The rest of the games I either basically agree with them, or never heard of. (And I'm ignoring their confusion between overhyped and overrated.)

DOA3, however... had *excellent* gameplay. They accuse it of rewarding button mashing. My roomie's girlfriend played it a bunch, and pretty consistently beat the hell out of button mashers. I knew more of the combos and special moves, and I pretty consistently beat the hell out of her. My roomie had a better feel for the timing and range and pretty consistently beat the hell out of me. (And anyone else that ever played the game.)

They bitch about the counter system... what? What is the complaint? Is it too weak? Too powerful? Frustrating? What's frustrating about it? They say it's "flawed" but wasn't really improved in 3. Ok. I still don't know what that means.

The main reason I ask isn't because I'm positive that it's the best fighter ever. I ask because I'm so fucking baffled why more fighter game fans don't play it. Is there some flaw I'm missing? What's so much better in other games? Please, fill me in.

Quake II ?

[The Analog Kid]

They complain that there is no multiplayer in the original product and that it was added later. They also sight it was just Quake with better graphics. For the multiplayer section, I think that's a bit unfair, what did most people have then 28.8k so even if multiplayer did ship it would have been quite laggy. Doom III isn't going to have much in terms of multiplayer either is that going to make it over-hyped? I doubt it. Sure multiplayer offers replay value and you can see in games like STEF2 that the screwed up multiplayer aspect with lack of dev support(took too long to get radiant out and it didn't offer much) ruined the games mod potential. However I always like to think of Id games as a demonstration of graphical talent. Its like a vanilla kernel, and games that use it are like patch sets, still using the underlying tech, with changes to it and additions.

Dumb Idea

[(54)T-Dub]

I think the whole idea of "top 25 overrated games" was a dumb idea for a list. As Tycho pointed out their criteria for "overrated" varied between:
1) over hyped by the publisher
2) over rated by the critics
3) under developed and being rushed to the shelves
4) being a sequel that didn't live up to it's predecessor
With such a wide array of criteria you are sure to piss off most gamers because every gamer has a sacred cow. Maybe that's what they were trying to do to make it a "conversational piece" but I think it alienates their main target audience more.

I've thought of a couple Lists that I think would be much more interesting :
1) Best games to be rushed to market (#1 Tribes 2)
2) Most poorly implemented good ideas (#1 Battlefield 1942)

Who can argue that Tribes 2 wasn't rushed to market 6 months to early *cough* UE *cough* . Or that the interface to BF1942 isn't HORRIBLE (ever tried to kick someone? forget it). I mean i loved t2 and played quite a bit of BF, but that doesn't mean they don't have their faults. Instead of saying a game is "overrated" and thereby invalidating everything about it why not point out its flaws in a way that you can't argue with.

What about Diablo 2?

[Prien715]

Maybe it's just me, but Diablo 2 is the most overhyped game ever made. Game mechanics? Hack'n'slash. Simply hold the mouse over enemies and watch them die. Pick up a cool weapon or two. Rinse lather repeat. The graphics weren't even good. It was kinda like black and white: fun for about a day and then tedium sets in. Black and White at least tried and succeeding in being unique, especially with interface. If anyone can mention one original thing about Diablo 2, I'm all ears.

Re:I'd like to show my rebuttal

[DarkZero]

First up, replace "fully" with "pre" and you'll get a head start on where I'm going. DKC is of no technical merit, nor does it contain any original gameplay. It's a platformer notable only for the fact that rather than being hand-drawn, the sprites, background and sprite animations were rendered on a Silicon Graphics machine. The fact that anyone credits it with extending the lifespan of the SNES is beyond me, especially when some seriously innovative development in the form of the SuperFX in-cart chip actually allowed the SNES to render workable 3D.

Donkey Kong Country introduced pre-rendered 3D graphics to the Super Nintendo and thus shortened the gap between the SNES and the PlayStation. Instead of the difference between the two being "2D versus 3D", it became "beautiful 2D versus ugly, clunky 3D". The PlayStation was all set to be regarded as a huge leap in graphical power until Donkey Kong Country came along and ushered in an brief era of games with beautiful 2D graphics and the sort of refined 2D gameplay that people had come to respect from the SNES, essentially making the two systems six of one and a half dozen of another. Different, but equal.

Without Donkey Kong Country, I really don't think that the Super Nintendo would've lasted until the release of Final Fantasy VII. Games like Donkey Kong Country, its sequels, and Super Mario RPG were what held the PlayStation at bay for all that time, and DKC was obviously their forebear. Also, its sales simply couldn't be denied. The difference in graphical power and variety of gameplay should've kept the SNES from ever having another hit after the PlayStation was released, but instead it released the blockbuster DKC, the nearly-as-successful DKC2, Super Mario RPG, and a few others that I'm sure I'm forgetting about.

I don't think the SuperFX chip was quite as revolutionary simply because the way to preserve the SNES wasn't to do a 3D vs. 3D battle with the 32-bit consoles, but rather to refine and beautify what they already had. I think the games' sales also reflected this, because StarFox was the only truly successful SFX game, but DKC, DKC2, and SMRPG were quite popular.