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Slashback: Card, Fortran, Legibility

Slashback tonight brings you more on recent RIAA madness, the readability of scrambled words, word of the return of Nullsoft's WASTE, another decision against the FTC's do-not-call list, and more -- read on for the details. The issue is greyer than you might think. SirFozzie writes "A Denver, Colorado judge has blocked the implementation of the Do-Not-Call List for a 2nd time, hours after the House and Senate passed the bill overwhelmingly, claiming that telemarketer's free speech rights would be infringed if this was to take affect. In the MSNBC story, judge Edward Nottingham ruled that "The Federal Trade Commission has chosen to entangle itself too much in the consumers' decision by manipulating consumer choice and favoring speech by charitable (organizations) over commercial speech." What's next? Constitutional Amendment?"

Follow-up: Can You Raed Tihs? meal worms writes "A Slashdot article appearing last Monday, which reported on the claim that scrambled words are legible as long as first and last letters are in place, was circulated to the University of British Columbia's Linguistics department. An interesting counter-example resulted:

"Anidroccg to crad cniyrrag lcitsiugnis planoissefors at an uemannd, utisreviny in Bsitirh Cibmuloa, and crartnoy to the duoibus cmials of the ueticnd rcraeseh, a slpmie, macinahcel ioisrevnn of ianretnl cretcarahs araepps sneiciffut to csufnoe the eadyrevy oekoolnr."
As demonstrated, a simple inversion of the internal characters results in a text which is relatively hard to decipher."

Addendum to Tough California Anti-Spam Law Signed On September 23, we mentioned California's new spam-ban law; srmalloy writes "The text of the new law, added by S.B. 186, is here."

Now you can WASTE away again in Margaritaville. adamsmith_uk writes "WASTE is open source small P2P network software supporting IM, group chat, file browsing/searching, and file transfer. It was released by Nullsoft and then removed by AOL, its parent company, in matter of hours. WASTE is now up to version 1.1 and back on Sourceforge. Get it while you can!"

Next time, Gadget Grandmother ... next time! FrankBama writes "The RIAA sued a grandmother for sharing over 2,000 songs (including 'I'm A Thug' by Trick Daddy). The EFF got involved and RIAA dropped the suit. This was done as a 'gesture of good faith' but the record industry spokesperson says they still think it's the right account.

260 other defendants still outstanding."

More of Orson Scott Card on Net music sharing. happy_place writes "FYI, you reported the first part earlier, here's the PART 2 of Orson Scott Card's political discussion on the stupidity of the record industry subpeona frenzy."

This part of the agenda is not supposed to be hidden. Stealthgirl writes "Note to everyone on the Hidden Agenda Contest that was mentioned over the weekend: There was a lot of feedback about only undergrads being eligible for the $25,000 prize. The rules have been clarified and full time grad students are welcome as well."

Update: Ah, yes: The Fortran bit. Thomas Beuthe writes "With regards to your slashdot Fortran article of the 16 Sept 2003 entitled 'Is GNU g77 Killing Fortran?,' I just wanted to make you aware of a fully featured alternative to g77 that perhaps everyone should consider using. Please go to Walt Brainerd's site: www.fortran.com (yes, he was the one who got *that* site!) and have a look at the "F" compiler.

I discussed the problem of the lack of a good freeware compiler and its influence on the lack of Fortran education and propagation of the language with him personally when he was here giving a Fortran course. He pointed out the "F" compiler to me. This is a fully compliant compiler which he put together himself.

The source code is actually the NAG compiler, I believe, except that he's hobbled it a bit to allow it to go out for free. This means that he has restricted the syntax a little, but not the functionality. So what you get is a fully funtional compiler which is restricted to what Walt considers to be the 'best' syntax for Fortran! This makes perfect sense for education, but also allows full useage for big projects as well!

Neat eh?"

93 of 544 comments (clear)

  1. WASTE is coming back....? by afxgrin · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This is new? Look at the dates those files were released.... July 5th.

    I haven't seen any real updates coming from the sourceforge site. It's mostly people hacking at it independently. It seems development for it has been going rather slow.

  2. Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The Federal Trade Commission has chosen to entangle itself too much in the consumers' decision by manipulating consumer choice and favoring speech by charitable (organizations) over commercial speech

    By doing what?? You mean, they're entangling themselves too much by enforcing the consumers' decision???

    1. Re:Huh? by meta-monkey · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's not saying that there shall be no exclusion of politcal fundraising or religious speech...it's just giving people the option of avoiding commercial speech.

      Firstly, I'm a Libertarian, and I think there is absolutely nothing wrong with enforcing a person's decision to not be bothered by commercial phone calls to their home. It's the same thing as putting up a "No trespassing" sign on your property, and then calling the cops when somebody bangs on the door anyway. I don't want salesmen on my property, physically or otherwise.

      Second, this bill is not meant to address problems associated with unwanted political or religious speech. It doesn't say that there won't be any such program in the future, or that any such program would be illegal. It simply doesn't address it. So, let's get rid of laws against grand theft auto (not the game, the crime of stealing a car) because it doesn't also protect us against purse snatchers. This program protects us against commercial telemarketers. If people get pissed off enough in the future, maybe we'll see programs to protects us from Senators and Jehovah's Witnesses.

      --
      We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
    2. Re:Huh? by kfg · · Score: 3, Informative

      No, what I am saying, and what the judge said, is that the law cannot make distinctions between solicitous speech because such distinctions are reserved to the citizen.

      The reason some such law, when properly drafted, will ultimately pass Constitutional muster is that it is an "opt out" law. The law as written opts you in to certain calls whether you want them or not.

      The judge's decision stands in of your rights actually, not the rights of the callers.

      If you are a Jehovah's Witness, or a Congressman running for reelection, you may find the fact that people have the right to choose not listen to you offensive.

      At the risk of being selfserving myself here is a link to a post I made earlier today explaining my views on the legality of the do not call list:

      http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=79968&cid=70 57 852

      If the do not call list had made a distinction between various kinds of speech, but had allowed the citizen to opt out of each seperately this law might have met the Constitutional challenge.

      "Press One if you don't want religous fanatics bothering you at dinner.

      Press Two if you think your Congressman is a religous fanatic.

      If you've simply had it up to here press Three, and then cancel your phone service.

      Have nice, quiet day."

      KFG

    3. Re:Huh? by kfg · · Score: 2, Informative


      "Nottingham agreed with the telemarketers' claims that allowing charitable solicitations but banning commercial calls "borrows from the reasoning of the pigs in George Orwell's 'Animal Farm.' ... 'Some animals are more equal than others.'"
      The judge granted a summary judgment to the telemarketing firms, and barred the FTC from launching the registry next week.
      "The Federal Trade Commission has chosen to entangle itself too much in the consumers' decision by manipulating consumer choice and favoring speech by charitable (organizations) over commercial speech," the judge wrote."


      From the article, quoting the judge.

      I think you'll find it line with my original post.

      KFG

    4. Re:Huh? by pla · · Score: 4, Insightful

      allowing charitable solicitations but banning commercial calls "borrows from the reasoning of the pigs in George Orwell's 'Animal Farm.' ... 'Some animals are more equal than others.'"

      Yep. Humans should have rights, corporations should not.

      We can debate all day over whether a 3rd world factory worker has a "right" to the same wage as an American one, or whether I have the "right" to not have my job outsourced to India, or whether immigration counts as a natural "right". But corporations? No. No debate at all. Corporations, which do not suffer from the same weaknesses as humans (don't naturally die, can't imprison the entire corporation, they wave off massive fines that would destroy a human as nothing more than an annoynace, their opinion carries FAR more weight with politicians than a "mere" human), do not deserve the same freedoms as humans.


      More importantly, I agree that in this situation, we have differential enforcement of "rights", just not in the same way that you see it. If I placed ten million automated calls a day to the ATA or DMA, Officer Friendly would show up at my door to tell me to cut it out. Yet, when the ATA makes those same ten million calls to equally unwilling recipients, it somehow becomes a first amendment issue?

      No. This entire mess involves nothing more than a well-placed judge acting as the lackey of Corporate America, no doubt for some shady-but-technically-legal compensation. Regardless of the charitable and political exclusions to the federal DNC, this registry takes an important step in taking back one portion of the lives of HUMANS from "the machine".

    5. Re:Huh? by kfg · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Churchs and governments are corporations.

      I wish protection from them just as much as I want protection from MCI.

      Why should the corporation of Sun Myung Moon have the right to ignore my "No Trespassing" sign?

      This bill gives them explicit right to do so.

      It is vile.

      I am a human. My rights exceed those of any church, particularly those to which I do not belong. Make my "No Trespassing" sign mean "No Trespassing," instead of "No Trespassing unless you're selling The Watchtower" and I'll be all for it.

      KFG

    6. Re:Huh? by AJWM · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The law as written opts you in to certain calls whether you want them or not.

      No, it doesn't. You currently already get those calls, and commercial calls besides (unless you're in a state with a no-call law). No option.

      What this law does is provide you with a way to opt out of getting commercial calls, while not changing the current status of you vis-a-vis political or charitable calls.

      --
      -- Alastair
    7. Re:Huh? by Shalda · · Score: 2, Insightful

      First, let me simply say, you're wrong. Now let me explain why:

      The reason some such law, when properly drafted, will ultimately pass Constitutional muster is that it is an "opt out" law
      This law is an "opt out" law. It allows you to opt out of a certain selected type of phone call. It does not opt me in to certain calls. It just doesn't include them in the list.

      the law cannot make distinctions between solicitous speech because such distinctions are reserved to the citizen
      What this law calls for is an explicit declaration from the citizens that they individually do not want to hear this speech. It intrudes on their time, their property and their rights.

      The judge's decision stands in of your rights actually, not the rights of the callers.
      If you are a Jehovah's Witness, or a Congressman running for reelection, you may find the fact that people have the right to choose not listen to you offensive.

      You are right in that the law does not go far enough. I should be able to opt out of all solicitous phone calls. The judge's decision, however, directly confilcts my right to publicly tell telemarketers to bugger off.

      It is for these reasons that I confidently predict the Apellete and Supreme courts will swiftly overturn this fool's decision.

    8. Re:Huh? by William+Tanksley · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I think free speech rights are too damned important to allow any cracks in the ediface,

      I have a hard time figuring out your logic, but this really hits me hard. The DNC law is _not_ about free speech. Saying it is doesn't make it so. Making a phone call into someone else's private residence isn't free speech. It's something that every person has a right to forbid! There are already laws that allow this for individuals (stalking, restraining orders, etc); this law simply extends it to an entire class of calls which are especially annoying.

      particularly when they allow the government and churchs to drive wedges into those cracks.

      I don't think you meant what I'm reading, but I'm at a loss to guess what you actually meant. It looks like you're first saying that this DNCL puts cracks in the edifice of free speech, then you say that it allows churches and the gov't to drive wedges into the cracks. Huh?

      If, for the sake of argument, the DNCL is breaking free speech, then surely its exemption of churches and politicians is its one *good* thing (or at least the one crack in its overall badness). If, on the other hand, the exemption of churches and politicians is a bad thing, surely the DNCL isn't breaking free speech. I don't see how you can have it both ways.

      I also have to point out that the first amendment explicitly mentions only two types of expression: religious and political. In other words, it was explicitly intended to protect speech in order to allow those freedoms. Now, I'm not saying that this is at the expense of other types of speech, but I do have to point out that other types don't have the same explicit purposeful protection.

      -Billy

  3. CNN... by wo1verin3 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It's interesting that CNN's main page still shows the top story as:
    Senate OKs no-call list
    The Senate approved legislation that would grant authority to the Federal Trade Commission to maintain a do not call registry for telemarketers. The House approved similar.....

    1. Re:CNN... by ArsonPerBuilding · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Then the President signs it into law. As soon as that happens a lawsuit will happen and likely make its way to the SC with great haste, considering there have been two federal courts already rule against the do not call list. As nice as a DNC list might be, it _does_ create two classes of speech, something the government cannot regulate.

      --
      1 tequila 2 tequila 3 tequila floor
    2. Re:CNN... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      considering there have been two federal courts already rule against the do not call list

      No, that is inaccurate. One federal court has ruled against the Do-Not-Call list. The other federal court merely ruled against an implementation detail of the Do-Not-Call list, or more specifically ruled against the ability of the FTC to implement the Do-Not-Call list without a mandate to do so from Congress or from the FCC.

      it _does_ create two classes of speech, something the government cannot regulate.

      It does not create a class of speech. It simply uses the existing two classes of speech, commercial and non-commercial, that already exist as a fixture of law and have for a long time.

    3. Re:CNN... by zerocool^ · · Score: 2, Insightful

      As nice as a DNC list might be, it _does_ create two classes of speech, something the government cannot regulate.


      We have multiple kinds of speech already. Hate speech isn't protected, nor is speech specifically designed to incite violence.

      This is covered under the right to privacy. Now, granted, there is no right to privacy guaranteed in the constitution, but through precedent, it is a *well* established right.

      Yes, marketing companies have the right to share their message with me. They can display it on my TV, which I have to voluntarily turn on and upon which I expect there to be commercials. They can put their message up on a bulliten board.

      The should NOT, however, have the right to call my telephone. Turning the TV is basically acceptance of the existance of commercials. Having your phone line plugged in is *not* conceeding that you will get calls that you don't want.

      Telemarketing calls are annoying. Period. I did not want, nor was I expecting them.

      When a marketing company puts up an advertisment on a bulliten board, they have to pay the owner of the bulliten board. When they call me, they don't have to pay me for the privilage of using *my* property to advertise to me? Why not?

      It's a democracy (roughly). It's perfectly legal for the majority to oppress and condemn the actions of the minority, especially when the minority is not any specific culturally or racially defined block of people.

      --
      sig?
    4. Re:CNN... by Dun+Malg · · Score: 4, Informative
      Now, granted, there is no right to privacy guaranteed in the constitution, but through precedent, it is a *well* established right.

      Excellent post. I should like to add that those who would claim that the "right to privacy" isn't a real right because the US Constitution doesn't mention it, well they need to refer to the 9th amendment:

      Amendment IX

      The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

      In other words, just because they didn't put it on their "top ten list", that doesn't mean it don't exist.

      --
      If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
  4. Do not call ammendment by Zeinfeld · · Score: 5, Insightful
    The idea that free speech gives a punk the right to have an automated telephone dialer call me and try to sell me a fraudulent prize is completely bogus.

    The idea that anyone can call me up on my telephone line to annoy me with a sales pitch when I have asked them not to is equally bogus.

    I don't care how many lothesome creeps loose their jobs as a result.

    --
    Looking for an Information Security student project suggestion?
    Try http://dotcrimeManifesto.com/
    1. Re:Do not call ammendment by MrLint · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Well perhaps this will get it thru people heads once and for all that a corporation having rights is a *fallacy*, Only living breathing people have rights. And in this case a judge doesn't want your right to privacy and the right to not be harassed protected.

      I want everyone to think that Corps have right to take a strong hard look at the issue and *think* about all the implications there of.

    2. Re:Do not call ammendment by cpt+kangarooski · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Is there no case law on this situation? It appears that the whole "rights" system can be twisted to anyone's favour.

      Well, I don't think we can really call rights a mere system. That said, there is case law on the subject. Personally I think it comes out on the side of the government in the case of at least a properly enacted do-not-call list, but I admit that there is room for people to debate the subject, and that we should always tread very cautiously when there is a hint of limiting the broad guarantee of free speech in the first amendment.

      Take the heated debate over the displaying of the Ten Commandments (lookup Justice Ray Moore). It was taken down because it offended some people. But, it made other's proud. Why do those who stand for nothing get their way?

      So, in the above example, someone's free speech rights *and* religious rights get trounced.


      The funny thing is, the government has no guarantee of free speech, and the government is explicitly forbidden by the highest authority from endorsing religion, which the Ten Commandments in the context of the example above certainly did and were intended to do. So no one's free speech rights or right of free exercise were 'trounced' and by removing the statute, numerous people's right to not suffer an establishment of religion was affirmed.

      Alright, now we're talking about a telemarketer's right to free speech. Almost ZERO people want to hear from telemarketers and almost nobody cares about the leeching bastards. Yet time after time their "rights" are being upheld. What gives!?

      Well, there's little point in protecting speech that everyone does want to hear. If everyone is for it, it'll surely be heard anyway. Speech that is unpopular, on the other hand, is precisely what the first amendment is intended to protect; as so many people will be against it, such speech would surely be silenced otherwise. It's important that we not allow that to happen.

      --
      -- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
    3. Re:Do not call ammendment by aborchers · · Score: 2, Funny

      I don't give a flying you-know-what about the legal status of the Do Not Call list at this time. I signed up for it and I know that the telemarketers have already downloaded it in the event that it does prove legal, therefore I consider them forewarned. No more polite refusals and waiting for the 800 number. They've been warned, so if they call now I have my license to be as vicous as the moment possesses me to be.

      --
      Trouble making decisions? Just flip for it.
    4. Re:Do not call ammendment by whereiswaldo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You need to spend some time thinking about your phrase "religious rights." You seem to be a little confused about a very, very important American ideal.

      You're right, I am confused. But the issue doesn't seem to be very cut and dried to me. For example, why does American paper money say "In God We Trust" on it?
      Why does the American government refer to God when tragedies happen?
      Why do you swear on a bible in court?

      Doesn't sound separate to me. That's what I mean by "twisting" the laws to ones own advantage.

    5. Re:Do not call ammendment by SEE · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The people who claim corporations don't have rights never seem to remember that, for example, the New York Times is a corporation. Does this mean that the New York Times should not have freedom of the press? How about the ACLU, another corporation? Or political parties, which are also corporate in form? Should they all be outside Constitutional protection? Should the government be able to ban the Democratic Party from campaigning against George Bush?

    6. Re:Do not call ammendment by t · · Score: 2, Insightful
      There's the bit I posted in the other article. I've reproduced the relevant section here:

      Read this article by Glenn Reynolds on malls. The key bit is:

      The downside is that the traditional "downtown" has been replaced by corporate-controlled space. What's wrong with that? Well, in the traditional downtown, things like the First Amendment's guarantee of free speech apply. In malls, they generally don't. (One of my former students has written an interesting law review article [uwyo.edu] on this subject).
      The summary is that if you own a mall, you can restrict what people say at your mall. You ever see those signs that say solicting on these premises is prohibited? No one screams "free speech" in that situation.
    7. Re:Do not call ammendment by Geek+of+Tech · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Technically, couldn't the marketers get sued for a form of DOS attack? Technically, as long as they keep you on the phone, no one else can use it.

      --
      Stop the Slashdot effect! Don't read the articles!
    8. Re:Do not call ammendment by Jerf · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Perhaps saying that "corporations have no rights" is going too far; corporations do consist of people which have rights and so inevitably they must have some as well. For instance, even if "a corporation" does not have "the right to free speech", they can simply pay an employee to use their right to free speech on their behalf. Which is in fact how they "speak", since no speech can occur without somebody finally giving the final go-ahead to "speak" it (where "speak" is some domain-specific action, like "publish", "answer question", etc.).

      But there is the need to recognize that corporations are inherently larger then individuals and as a result there is an inherent asymmetry in the power, and it is unjust to translate that directly into more legal power.

      The problem is quite simply one of man power. Today, I have roughly 16 hours of wakefulness, assuming an 8-hour sleep cycle. Every workday, a corporation receives on average slightly more then eight man-hours from each employee. That is to say, for a 10,000 person company, for my 16 hours today, that company received 80,000 man-hours of life, 5000 times more then me.

      Now suppose this company sues me, and we get into a protracted, drawn out lawsuit that occurs over the course of a year, and consumes roughly a quarter of my year meeting with lawyers, rotting in jail, preparing defense, worrying such that I can't productively do anything else, etc. (That's probably conservative on my part; it could easily completely destroy my year.) If I live a nearly-average (and conviently rounded) 75 years, that's a third of a percent of my entire life. (If you're willing to call it the entire year, that's one and a third of a percent of my life! If I died tommorow, that would be a full 4% of my life, as I'm near a rounded-by-luck 25.)

      Let us suppose this lawsuit also eats four lawyers and the equivalent of one administrator year, for a total of 50 * 5 (fifty weeks, five days a week) * 40 (forty hours a week) * 5 (five people) = 50,000 thousand man-hours. Now, that may sound like a lot... ... but it's only 62.5% of ONE single day for the aforementioned 10,000 person company (of which there are many).

      Corporations shouldn't necessarily be held "rightless", and probably can't be, but they certainly should not be considered "people". If they really were people, they'd be some pretty strange, and pretty powerful, people. One might even call them "superhuman"... correctly.

    9. Re:Do not call ammendment by whereiswaldo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Excellent, thanks.

      Which bible do they use when people take an oath in court?

      If you do lie in court, what is the significance in the statement "so help you God" if the god mentioned is ambiguous? Maybe it's the Greek god of Love, for all that is said.

      What god is responsible for "acts of God"?

  5. Counter-example Typos explained? by JojoLinkyBob · · Score: 4, Interesting
    I think we are somewhat subliminally "trained" to recognize typos as we see them more and mroe. At some point our brains recognize a pattern forming, and helps fill in the gaps.

    I would argue that the counterexample given is not realistic, in that the letter switching is too consistent. Our brains may be in a mode of trying to find "randomness" and as a result, filter out any intentional pattern subconsciously.

    Another counterexample to consider is using the normally scrambled method but have the words in the sentence jumbled around. Context plays a huge part in comprehension, not just the first and last letter, switched.

    --
    -jc
    1. Re:Counter-example Typos explained? by squiggleslash · · Score: 2, Interesting
      A collegue and I spent a while with Python and C scripts/programs (he likes Python, go figure ;-) experimenting with jumbling words and finding, as the quote above says, that some words are more readable than others. What we ended up finding was that if the consonants are in the same order as they are in the original word, or they're very close, the words remain easily decypherable to our jumbled minds.

      This is, of course, a completely unscientific test. I'll have to see if I can garner a research grant on the subject...

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
    2. Re:Counter-example Typos explained? by Esion+Modnar · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This reminds me of the Jumbles puzzle some newspapers carry. Usually the five-word jumbles are pretty easy, but the six-word jumbles are much harder, even if you have an extended vocabulary. Thing is, msot people have no problem skipping over the shorter jumblings, but the longer ones take considerably more processing since there are more preumttaions that have to be evaulated and rejected. Also, since shorter words tend to be more common, the meaning of a word can be determined from context.

      --

      They say the first thing to go is your penis. Well, it's either that or your brain. I forget which...
    3. Re:Counter-example Typos explained? by joepeg · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Keeping with the first/last letter scheme, it appears that when the letters close to the beginning are moved all the way to the end, and vice versa, it tends to become much more confusing. If you keep the letters in proximity to their origional location, it becomes much easier. Using the quote from the post, if you keep the letters from the first half in the first half but scrambled and the letters in the latter half in the latter half but scrambled it becomes much easier to decipher. This is keeping with how most people create typos, such as accidentally reversing letters. It would be rather strange for someone to accidentally type the second character in the word second to last.


      Example: telephone == tleepnohe == t[lee]p[noh]e


      notice 'p' is in the center so unmoved. The quote from the post would be as follows:


      "Acocrnidg to crad crraniyg lguniitscis peorsfsoalnis at an unnaemd, ueivnitsry in Birtsih Cuolmiba, and ctonrray to the dbuiuos clamis of the ucnietd reesrcah, a smilpe, mheacicnal ivneirson of ietnnral caahrtcers apperas sfufineict to cnofsue the erevadyy oonlkoer."

      --

      ZEN is a prime number in base-36

    4. Re:Counter-example Typos explained? by zerocool^ · · Score: 2, Informative

      but the longer ones take considerably more processing since there are more preumttaions that have to be evaulated and rejected

      26 times more, in fact.

      11,881,376 versus 308,915,776

      --
      sig?
  6. How are you going to enforce this? by NightSpots · · Score: 5, Insightful

    17529.2.(b) Initiate or advertise in an unsolicited commercial e-mail advertisement to a California electronic mail address, or advertise in an unsolicited commercial e-mail advertisement sent to a California electronic mail address.

    So when I get spam through my work email, which is a LLC in California, and it was sent through a relay in Korea, how is the Attorney General going to collect?

    Oh, you're going to go around suing every company in Asia and Europe? This simply isn't ever going to be enforced.

    There was a company in California (Trevor Law Group, search google) that was basically scaring small businesses into settling for $5,00-$10,000 on nonsensical lawsuits, and it took the Bar Association to step forward and stop them, because the Attorney General simply has too many cases on his desk. The number of lawsuits in this state are silly as it is, and I don't see anyone going to enforce this.

    1. Re:How are you going to enforce this? by Captain+Galactic · · Score: 2, Funny

      Oh, you're going to go around suing every company in Asia and Europe? This simply isn't ever going to be enforced.

      Tell that to the RIAA.

    2. Re:How are you going to enforce this? by ljavelin · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Ah, you missed the point:

      Initiate or advertise in an unsolicited commercial e-mail advertisement to a California electronic mail address, or advertise in an unsolicited commercial e-mail advertisement sent to a California electronic mail address.

      So when Discover Card ads fill your spambox, you can sue the advertiser - Discover Card - no matter where the source server is and no matter how they disguise the money trail.

      Of course, after they lose their suit with me, they can sue their "marketing partner" all they want - and for good reason.

      I don't care where the email comes from. I care about who is paying for it - directly or indirectly. Chances are, if they're selling a product, there is an easy-to-follow trail right back to the good old USA.

    3. Re:How are you going to enforce this? by mcc · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I have stated this in a couple discussions similar to this one, but:

      Spam laws do not have to stop all spam. If they can simply stop all local spam, they have still won a mighty battle.

      The reasoning for this is that while the law will have no effect against foreign spammers, isolating spam-- even in a limited way-- drastically assists in every form of nonlegal spam combat available today.

      In other words, if laws cause all spam to originate from sources outside of the U.S., or from outside of the current state, that makes it easier and more effective to administrate a blacklist, to administrate a whitelist, or to administrate a spam filter. This will, indeed, result in a dramatic impact on the spam problem.

      Moreover, one would hope that if an american company hired a korean spammer, the american company would be subject to the spam laws even though they acted through a foreign agent. Is this accurate?

    4. Re:How are you going to enforce this? by qtp · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Spam laws do not have to stop all spam. If they can simply stop all local spam, they have still won a mighty battle.

      It's still the wrong way to handle the spam problem. If more users were to use effective filters, and if all ISPs were to implement reasonable filters that were able to determine most forged headers and dropped mail from all open proxies and unsecured relays, the spam business would not be nearly so lucrative as it would be more difficult for the spammers to find addresses that actually viewed the spam, much less responded to it.

      I am very wary of inviting government to regulate email, partially because of the likelyhood of exceptions (ala Do Not Call list), but more because it might be inviting more intrusive regulation later by legitimizing a "right" for the government to monitor and ban forms of electronic communication. If we allow the government to ban a class of email based on advertising, how long would it be before there is a proposal to ban a class of email based on encryption.

      --
      Read, L
  7. Re:Phone calls by magarity · · Score: 4, Informative

    That's the address of the US Court building, whose occupants are unlikely to take kindly to crank calls.

  8. Do not call... by dbc · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "manipulating consumer choice"??????

    I don't feel the least bit manipulated. I knew full well what I wanted to happen when I went to that web site and entered my do-not-call information.

  9. Translation by BuffJoe · · Score: 5, Informative

    "Anidroccg to crad cniyrrag lcitsiugnis planoissefors at an uemannd, utisreviny in Bsitirh Cibmuloa, and crartnoy to the duoibus cmials of the ueticnd rcraeseh, a slpmie, macinahcel ioisrevnn of ianretnl cretcarahs araepps sneiciffut to csufnoe the eadyrevy oekoolnr."

    "According to card carrying linguistics professionals at an unnamed, university in British Columbia, and contrary to the dubious claims of the uncited research, a simple, mechanical inversion of internal characters appears sufficient to confuse the everyday onlooker."

    1. Re:Translation by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 5, Funny
      That's too readable. Translations posted here are supposed to be compter-generated. Here it is again after English -> German -> English courtesy of Google:

      Like opinion of the basic linguistics specialists of the map at a nameless, university looks sufficient in British Colombia and oppositely to the doubtful requirements of the not quoted research, a simple, mechanical conversion of the internal letters to confuse the daily Onlooker.

  10. fortran? by Davorama · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Ummm.... what does fortran have to do with any of this?

    --

    Davo -- Free speech, free software, AND free beer.

    1. Re:fortran? by slavemowgli · · Score: 4, Funny

      Maybe WASTE is currently being rewritten in fortran...

      --
      quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur.
  11. Re:Fortran?? by nucal · · Score: 2, Funny

    It must be in the scrambled sentence ...

  12. Linux port? by daserver · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I wonder when WASTE will be ported to Linux & gcc. It fails to compile here with gcc 3.2.3

  13. Judge's tortured interpretation of the First by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful
    ... that telemarketer's free speech rights would be infringed if this was to take affect. ... judge Edward Nottingham ruled that "The Federal Trade Commission has chosen to entangle itself too much in the consumers' decision ..."

    BULLSHIT!

    The consumer has already made their decision by signing up for the DNC list! The Gummint is just enforcing that decision with some teeth. The Gummint is not preemptively suppressing speech based on content or source, it is telling them to leave us the hell alone when they won't listen to us asking them to do that ourselves.

    The self-enforced "opt out" lists are an abysmal failure; what the hell do the direct marketers expect??
    1. Re:Judge's tortured interpretation of the First by SuperBanana · · Score: 2
      The Gummint is not preemptively suppressing speech based on content or source, it is telling them to leave us the hell alone when they won't listen to us asking them to do that ourselves.

      Popular opinion is not law, nor does it override the constitution- that's explicitly clear right down to the way in which our senate+house are elected- in stages, so that government policy is not radically affected by a sudden change in public opinion. In a way, a slow moving government is a good one; look at the knee-jerk reaction from just -one- terrorist event that killed 1/10th of the # of people killed every year in car collisions(1/100th of the # of people killed every year by heart disease).

      However, the supreme court has made it clear that the private citizen has a reasonable expectation of privacy, and free speech does not entitle one to PUSH your speech onto others by ringing their phone; I wish I could find the case history, but IANAL. I wouldn't expect the free-speech argument to last past another appeal or two(if it makes it far enough, the US SC will undoubtably refuse it, pointing to their existing decision).

  14. Judge's finding in the Denver DNC-list case by Goonie · · Score: 2, Informative
    The finding is available as this PDF document.

    Haven't had a chance to read it yet...

    --

    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
    --Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
    1. Re:Judge's finding in the Denver DNC-list case by parliboy · · Score: 2

      Here are the saliant points as I can read it. IANAL, but I probably could be, so this shouldn't totally suck:

      a) The judge tries to use as precedent rulings concerning the ability of people to have their name removed from a snail mail list. In the case of that, it requires a specific recipient of the request. That is, you have to tell the postmaster who it is you want to stop calling. Here, we're relying on governmental determination of who is and isn't a telemarketer as defined by the regulation. The feds make that decision, instead of you or me. That's a line that the judge believes crosses into undue restriction on free speech. That the government is exluding charities from restrictions is doubly worse (remember that many charities are filed as corporations, just as their money-hording counterparts are, so you're essentially going to be exempting one class of charity while condemning others.)

      b) The judge sides with the FTC in regards to the idea of "A man's home is his castle". That is, he agrees that a person has the right to restrict speech in his own home, and that the government can be involved in helping him restrict it, provided you fix the problems in point (a).

      c) The judge goes back again to pointing out that the government can't distinguish between commercial and non-commercial speech in something like this. That the FTC does this to curb abusive practices doesn't hold because, as observed here, charity cold-calls can be abusive, too. The policy as written just assumes that one class is abusive and the other isn't, and we know that isn't true. (Remember, though, it says the government isn't allowed to distingish, not that you and me aren't.)

      d) The judge specifically states that the FTC does have the authority to do what it's doing. (Given that, of course, the now conflicting decisions we have will be moot once Bush signs the law.)

      So, the only part where the the law was overturned was over the idea that commercial speech was unfairly singled out, and the compaines speech would be limited specifically by the government, not by the individuals. The FTC won as much as it lost, but it only needed to lose one to get sent back to the drawing board.

      --
      "You're never ready, just less unprepared."
  15. Not very well hidden agenda by SuperBanana · · Score: 4, Informative

    From the "technical requirements" section:

    The Hidden Agenda team reserves the right to build your game for a platform other than the one for whichyou designed your game. We also reserve the right to, or not to distribute and/or sell your game through whatever distribution channel or method we see fit.

    Translation:

    "We'll give you $25,000 for what would have cost us ten to a hundred times that to produce ourselves. Have fun splitting with your team half of what we would have had to pay just one full time developer for an annual salary. You slave away, we profit."

    Nice to see that slashdot editors are still getting suckered into giving people free advertising. It all seems very clever, until you realized just how quickly you figured out The Catch.

    1. Re:Not very well hidden agenda by CrackHappy · · Score: 2, Informative

      No crap! I was reading the rules, and the fact that you completely sign away EVERYTHING related to the game you make, in return for $25,000 IF YOU WIN. WHAT about all the OTHER people who enter with good games but don't win? Guess what? You just slaved away to create a good game that someone else is going to sell, and you don't get a damned penny!

      What a load of bull, and I really hope you aspiring developers don't fall for this baloney.

      --
      1f u c4n r34d th1s u r34lly n33d t0 g37 l41d Capitalization really works: i helped my uncle jack off a horse
  16. The counter example for readability--old hat. by RenderMonkey · · Score: 4, Interesting

    is part of the problem with the "scrambled text" claim. It is a neat trick and it does work as long as the majority of the words do not have the internal word shape destroyed by major shifting of letters. But then again this is old hat to most typographers (IANAT)...in fact just using all italics in a long section of text is enough of a word shape change to slow down most readers, and has often been used by typographers for a long time to great effect.

  17. PHONE CALLS ARE NOT FREE SPEECH by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You pay the phone company for the phone line. This costs me about $20 a month for basic service. Likewise, my email address costs me money because I had to pay for that.

    I PAY FOR IT.

    ME.

    As in "NOT THEM."

    Telemarketing assholes DO NOT PAY FOR MY PHONE LINE. If I do not want them to call me, THEY SHOULD NOT FUCKING CALL ME.

    They can fuck off back to whatever hole they came from and die.

    I'm sick of getting home and my answering machine being full of robots trying to sell me a loan, car or that I've "won" a holiday (for the low, low price of only $200). I stopped watching television because of the advertising plague - I'm on the verge of unplugging the phone now.

    And since when did a commercial entity qualify for "free speech?" It's not a human being and shouldn't have those rights.

  18. Linguists will suck the life out of the party.... by dodongo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Those folks who basically say that we as humans don't miss the forest for the trees, but that we see a forest where there are *only* trees.

    To elaborate:

    Cat the green over jumped fence the.

    Your internalized grammar can sort that out into an intelligible (though not necessarily what I meant--"green" could modify "cat" or "fence, for example) string of words; you *can* comprehend it, even though it's wrong. Linguistically, we do this a lot, especially with the example from U of BC.

    Something that I've not seen discussed in conjunction with this, though, are the studies that show that, even though vowels and other sonorants are the parts of speech we prolong while talking or singing, the semantic content of language is carried primarily in the consonants:

    Tr t yrslf--s hw mn wrds y cn ndrstnd, vn whn y dnt wrt dwn vwls n th pg.

    (Try it yourself--see how many words you can understand, even when you don't write down vowels on the page).

    Chew on that, just please don't destroy my good karma.

  19. DNC list by Compuser · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I like the judge's reasoning. I don't see why
    charities and politicians should be exempt from
    this list. Hopefully we will finally have a way
    to put a universal "do not disturb" sign on our
    email accounts. IOW, I like the all or nothing
    approach to this.

  20. F is not Fortran by BigFootApe · · Score: 5, Insightful

    From the SAL website:
    F is a carefully crafted subset of the most recent version of Fortran, the world's most powerful numeric language. F retains the modern features of Fortran--modules and data abstraction, for example--but discards facilities such as EQUIVALENCE, which are difficult to teach, use, or debug.

    Backwards compatibility is extremely important for the Fortran crowd (who tend to be a very conservative bunch). Having to rewrite source code is not going to make them happy.

    1. Re:F is not Fortran by tony_gardner · · Score: 2, Informative

      Except that you wasted two days essentially redoing what was already a finished project. The staples of FORTRAN are longitivity, usability and speed. Think about this: pretty much every FORTRAN code ever written can be compiled with a current complient f90 or f95 compiler. And this includes the pre fortran 66 stuff which is still amazingly abundant in the scientific world.

      If you want FORTRAN without the bad habits use Pascal.

  21. FORTRAN, and about that scrambled text.. by JusTyler · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Is that like the 'evil bit' we spoke about last April 1st? ;-) But on the scrambled text issue..

    As demonstrated, a simple inversion of the internal characters results in a text which is relatively hard to decipher.

    This is what I attempted to argue a few months ago. I studied linguistics at college (although I dropped out) and we did some studies into obscuring language. It was particularly interesting, as I was also studying a module on encryption and ciphers.

    What I learned was that recognition of words comes from several variables, and recognition of LETTERS from yet more. For example, if you write a line of text, and cover the top half of every letter with a ruler, it's hard to read the LETTERS. Cover the bottom half, it's easy to read the LETTERS.

    WORDS work in a similar way. People can recognize words merely from basic patterns. These patterns do NOT have to correlate with the spoken word. What's more, the use of CONTEXT can mean words can be obscured even further, yet still be recognized.

    For example..

    I drve my cr t wrk.

    People are very good at skimming over vowels, simply because they serve as the 'flow' of our language, and have little content in-and-of themselves. Compare to this:

    I dr my ca to wo

    Using the prefixes destroys any sense of context. No longer have we 'obscured' the words by removing their vowel glue, we've actually lopped half their bodies off, destroying any attempt at fathoming a reason.

    1. Re:FORTRAN, and about that scrambled text.. by squiggleslash · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Back in the late seventies and early eighties, the predominant version of the programming language FORTH was PolyFORTH, from Chuck Moore's FORTH Inc. It had one major peculiarity, which ties into Moore's fetish for memory conservation, though at that time, that was a concern to most programmers: all words (that is, all identifiers) were stored as the first three characters, and a count. For example, FORTH would be stored as 5FOR. The advantage was that all identifiers ended up being four bytes long, which was programmatically simple to store and compare, and in memory terms very efficient. Of course, it also meant defining a word "WORLD" would overwrite (well, sort of) the definition for the word "WORDS", etc.

      As memory got cheaper, Moore was prevailed upon by the FORTH community to introduce a more flexible naming system, say, one where the whole names of FORTH words were stored, not just their first three letters. Finally, the magazine FORTH DIMENSIONS posted letters which lampooned the idea by wri---- lik- thi-.

      I can't find the originals, but Moore responded in kind:

      DEA- EDI---

      I AM AFR--- THA- THE LET--- IN THE LAS- ISS-- ABO-- FOR-- INC-- USI-- ONL- THR-- LET--- NAM- FIE--- HAS HAD THE OPP----- EFF--- FRO- WHA- THE WRI--- WAN--. HIS LET--- ( LIK- THI- ONE ) SHO-- THA- SAV--- ONL- THR-- LET---- AND COU-- IS JUS- ABO-- OPT---- IN TER-- OF A TRA-- OFF BET---- SAV--- MEM--- AND KEE---- LEG----. WE STI-- DON- SEE THE NEE- FOR 31 CHA------ NAM-- IN THE GEN---- CAS-.

      YOU-- TRU--

      CHU-- MOO--

      FOR-- INC-

      The scary thing is that it's completely readable.
      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  22. More of Orson Scott Card on Net music sharing by zenpiglet · · Score: 5, Funny

    When friends can say, "Have you heard Eva Cassidy's music? Here, I'll send you a couple of songs, you won't believe how good she is," that's called "word of mouth," and what you'll get is more and more people who attend her live performances and buy her CDs.

    Wow! File sharing can raise the dead ... how can anyone be against this great technology?

  23. Ban charitable too by rhysweatherley · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Fine. So ban the calls from charitable organisations as well. It's pretty much impossible to tell the difference between a real charitable organisation and a scam over the phone, so I hang up on all such calls as a matter of policy.

    If they turn up at the door wearing a badge, during a widely publicised door knock appeal, they might get a few bucks. But not if they call me out of the blue claiming to represent an organisation I cannot verify the identity of.

  24. Wow... by PipianJ · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I never knew that unwanted harassment on a system I pay to be a part of was "free" speech...

  25. Just one pesky little detail... by Mr_Huber · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Suprisingly, a corporation's right to free speech is not on as solid a legal ground as the telemarketers think. It seems that the interpretation of the 14th Amendment as granting corporations the same rights as flesh and blood people is actually only found in the headnotes of a Supreme Court decision on Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad in 1886, not in the decision itself. The courts have built upon this shaky foundation, expanding corporate rights to include freedom of speech and rights to privacy. Unfortunately, it has never really been decided that corporations are entitled to those rights.

    Oops.

    Let's hope they sue. It should provide quite a bit of entertainment watching the courts try to uphold the wildly popular telemarketing bill while not accidentally stripping corporations of their rights of free speech. Remember, if corporations do not have freedom of speech, their political contributions would not be protected.

    1. Re:Just one pesky little detail... by SEE · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yep, and if corporations don't have the right to free speech, it's within Ashcroft's power to muzzle the ACLU, Democratic Party, and New York Times, all incorporated entities. Ooops!

  26. Fortran is dying? Not here by ishmaelflood · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Most of my analysis programs and add-ins are written in Fortran. I've just had to buy an up to date compiler so that we can incorporate some new code into the models. I'm intrigued by the Fortran to C converters, but can't imagine trying to debug the code that would be produced.

    Let's face it, for well structured problems like engineering analysis, the basic number crunching is best done in a simple language that is easy to read and somewhat resistant to programming tricks.

    The basic task is
    several enormous matrices->crunch-> more enormous matrices.

    Sounds like Fortran to me.

  27. Re:Linguists will suck the life out of the party.. by phraktyl · · Score: 3, Funny

    Tr t yrslf--s hw mn wrds y cn ndrstnd, vn whn y dnt wrt dwn vwls n th pg.

    Us /. users may have an unfair advantage over people new to computers here. Removing unneeded letters is how we fit everything into DOS 8.3 filenames!

    --
    Karma: Marginal (mostly due to the border around the website)
  28. Open source Fortran by mjc_w · · Score: 4, Informative

    There is another open source Fortran. Look at

    http://www.openwatcom.org/

    To quote the site,

    Open Watcom is a joint effort between SciTech Software Inc, Sybase(R), and the Open Source development community to maintain and enhance the Sybase Watcom C/C++ and Fortran compiler products. Plans for Open Watcom include porting the compiler to the Linux and FreeBSD platforms, as well as updating the compilers to support the latest C and C++ ANSI standards.

    The Open Watcom development team has released version 1.1. You can download the source and binaries here.

    --
    This is the Constitution.This is the Constitution under the Bush administration. Any questions?
    1. Re:Open source Fortran by tiohero · · Score: 3, Informative

      Intel's Fortran compiler for Linux is FREE for non-commerical use (not open-source). I'm told that it is very good. Its about time that there was a free F90/F95 compiler available. Intel F90 Compiler. I think that this will go a long way in promoting LINUX as a base for advanced scientific computing.

    2. Re:Open source Fortran by tiohero · · Score: 2, Informative
      Here's a low cost alternative: The old MICROSOFT F90 Fortran Developer Studio (Fortran PowerStation 4.0) makes an EXCELLENT development platform for Fortran on WIN32. MS sold the product line to Digital/Compaq several years ago. The compiler is very robust and seems to be the most compatible with external source libraries compared with other Win32 F90/F95 compilers that I've tried.

      You should be able to locate a copy of the developer suite from ~1995 on Ebay for very cheap. I typically write/debug my F90 code on the MS compiler amd then recompile it on a UNIX workstation for problems that require a large memory domain.(Computational fluids problems)

  29. Fortran and F by khb · · Score: 4, Informative

    While Walt was certainly a major part of the F effort, it was not his work alone. Dick Hendrickson, David Epstein, Michael Metcalf, John Reid and Loren Meissner all had hands in it (working from memory).

    In it's early days, it was a preprocessor which enforced restrictions, and relied upon a full compiler behind it to actually do the compilation. It used to be mated to more than one compiler as a backend.

  30. Stuff by Annatar2 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I fail to see how anyone can claim that calling me at 5:00 pm while I'm eating dinner to sell me life insurance or ask if I REALLY want to change phone companies for the umpteenth time is 'free speech'.

    As a wise man once said, 'Your right to swing your arms back and forth, ends where my face begins.'

    Just as standing on a suburban corner with a bullhorn at 4:00 am yelling out my political agenda for world domination isn't protected by free speech (as it violates noise ordinances), stopping telemarketers from calling my house is not violating their free speech rights. Their are perfectly allowed to have their views on which phone company the average American should be using, they can even publish, or state them, they just shouldn't be allowed to call me and personally bug me about it.

  31. Nah.. IT's better when you add Japanese to it! by Genjurosan · · Score: 5, Funny

    Now it's from English -> German -> English -> Japanese -> English aka ALL YOUR BASE!!!!

    Like opinion of the specialist of basic language study in the nameless map, and the everyday onlooker of the research namely internal letter which is not quoted on opposite side it is easy to confuse in the English Colombia, the sufficient university to the condition machine conversion being doubtful at first glance.

  32. HERE YOU GO - Plaintiffs' lawyers' contact info by MobileDude · · Score: 5, Informative

    Sean R.-Gallagher, Esq.
    Marianne N. Hallinan, Esq.
    Hogan & Hartson
    1200 17d1 Street, Suite 1500
    Denver, CO 80202
    Attorneys for Plaintiffs

    DENVER OFFICE
    One Tabor Center
    1200 Seventeenth Street, Suite 1500
    Denver, CO 80202
    Tel: (303) 899-7300
    Fax: (303) 899-7333
    Contact: Ty Cobb
    Niki Tuttle

    Send SEAN an email:
    http://www.hhlaw.com/site/directory/contac t.asp?at t_id=2410&att_nm=Sean+R%2E+Gallagher

    Say "Hello!" to Marianne:
    http://www.hhlaw.com/site/photos/5509.j pg

    Or, perhaps, call their Washington, DC home office:
    WASHINGTON, D.C. OFFICE
    555 Thirteenth Street, NW
    Washington, DC 20004
    Tel: (202) 637-5600
    Fax: (202) 637-5910
    Contact: Warren Gorrell

    Robert Com-Revere, Esq.
    Ronald G. London, Esq.
    Davis Wright Tremaine, LLP
    1500 K Street, N. W., Suite 450
    Washington, D.C. 20005
    Attorneys for Plaintiffs

    Washington, D.C. Office
    Suite 450
    1500 K Street NW
    Washington, D.C. 20005-1272
    Main: (202) 508-6600
    Fax: (202) 508-6699
    Email: washingtondc@dwt.com

    Robbie's personal page with phone, email, and !!! Outlook VCard!
    http://www.dwt.com/lawdir/attorneys/CornRe vereRobe rt.cfm

    Ronnie's 'neck-o' the woods' with the same
    http://www.dwt.com/lawdir/attorneys/LondonRo nald.c fm

    I'm sure they'll enjoy citizens using their published information as much as we love telemarkets using ours....

    ENJOY!

    --
    10 MD .\crash 20 CD .\crash 30 GOTO 10
  33. it is a good ruling by fermion · · Score: 2, Interesting
    favoring speech by charitable (organizations) over commercial speech

    I have to say that i believed the first ruling to be a contrived technicality, while I see this ruling as having some merit. I mean look at the two big reasons why tele-marketers are considered such a scourge. Calling at inopportune time and deceitful statements.

    The first applies to any tele-marketer. If I am macking my date, do I care if the person calling me is from 'chaney gas guzzler rewards program' or the 'bush drunk driver defense fund'. Hell no.

    The second is not direct, but really applies to both as well. I do not know how things are now, but it was not so long ago that charities were getting in trouble for spending significant percentages of their income on non-serve items. It was also not so long ago when the tele-markets were keeping significant percentages of their take, allegedly up to 90%, for their own profits. Both of these made the charities non-profit in name only. This non-profit status was beneficial because it allowed the officer to run corrupt organizations without getting in trouble with the IRS or shareholdes, both whom would otherwise would require profit to made every once in a while.

    Furthermore what would stop tele-markets from combining non-profit and commercial customers. For a donation of X you get a premium and a handy coupon book for further purchases. The non-profit part of the telemarketing company becomes a loss leader, with the telemarketing firm keeping their traditional 85%, but using it to pay for the comical customer for the premium. The commercial customers pays a higher rate for each commercial call in order to pay for the sale through the non-profit channel, and the telemarketing gets further kickbacks if the coupon book is used.

    Which is just to say I think the non-profit exemption was a hack to appease certain parties, like the religious right, the public employee unions (most of the calls I get come from the policeman funds) and the powerful medical lobby. It really has no legal basis and quite frankly I think the bill will be much more useful it the exemption is struck. I was kind of thinking that the tele-marketers would use the exemption as an opportunity, like I have shown above, but they obviously are not that smart.

    --
    "She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
  34. The way we read by eagle486 · · Score: 2, Interesting
    The way we learn to read is not reading one letter at a time, but by recognising the pattern/shape/outline a word makes.

    This is why text in all CAPS is more difficult to read.
    If you rearrange letters so the shape of the word stays the same then we can read it.

  35. About F by exp(pi*sqrt(163)) · · Score: 2, Funny

    but discards facilities such as EQUIVALENCE, which are difficult to teach, use, or debug Eh? EQUIVALENCE is the substitute for the lack of pointers that makes FORTRAN usable. Sheesh! Next these people will be telling us that GOTOs are bad for your health.

    --
    Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
  36. How the FUCK by TexVex · · Score: 3, Insightful
    ...claiming that telemarketer's free speech rights would be infringed if this was to take affect...
    How the fuck is someone calling me on my telephone that I paid for and that requires monthly fees for it to work, protected free speech????????

    This must mean it would also be free speech for me to call the home of these idiot judges and tell them how utterly retarded that is. Over and over again. Even if the judge asked me to not call again.

    Oh, and by the way, it's "take effect".
    --
    Fun with Anagarams! LADS HOST, SHALT DOS. HAS DOLTS. AD SLOTHS, HATS SOLD. ASS HO, LTD.
  37. The fortran bit - WATFIV by earthforce_1 · · Score: 2, Informative

    My dream compiler, back in the days when I was doing high school CS assignments using mark sense cards on an IBM 370. (Aaah, those were the days)

    I quick google search revealed that a native 8086 version of it is now freely available at:

    http://digilander.libero.it/saracos/Download/utl il ty.htm

    Funny how a University of Waterloo compiler would wind up in Italy. Now, if I can just spark up an old PC-XT somewhere...

    --
    My rights don't need management.
  38. Nobody has mentioned ... by emkman · · Score: 2, Informative

    One of the best features of WASTE is that it is fully secure, using link-level encryption and public key authentication.

    "Security: WASTE uses link-level encryption to secure links, and public keys for authentication. RSA is used for session key exchange and authentication, and the links are encrypted using Blowfish in PCBC mode."

    Also, it should be noted that waste is only for small scale use, around 50 nodes at most.

    --
    Moderation Totals: Flamebait=2, Troll=1, Redundant=1, Insightful=6, Overrated=1, Underrated=1, Total=12. (not mine)
  39. you evaluated the wrong problem by pwarf · · Score: 2, Informative

    The problem at hand is the number of ways of arranging five or six particular letters (as is the case for the Jumbles(R) puzzles in some newspapers).

    Your numbers are those for the number of distinct six- and five-letter orderings from all 26 letters, allowing repetition.

    As noted by a burried AC post, the numbers for the problem at hand are 6! and 5!, giving an increase in the number of permutations of a factor of six (assuming all the letters are distinct, which is less likely with the longer jumbles, but whatever).

  40. Still Unimpressed by cpt+kangarooski · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Well, back when the first part of Card's article on copyright was posted I found myself to be rather unimpressed by what he had written. My posting regarding that can be found here.

    This part is somewhat better. I agree with his position that it's rather weird to pursue music fans for music piracy and that the increasingly hostile efforts of copyright holders are going to result in a backlash.

    Nevertheless his proposals for reform are laughable.

    When a corporation is listed as the "author" of a copyrighted work, then what does lifetime-plus-twenty or lifetime-plus-fifty really mean? Whose lifetime?

    Well, when a corporation is listed as the author of a work, this only ever happens in the case of works for hire. Assignments of copyright don't change the authorship. The funny thing is, the law is awfully clear in 17 USC 302(c), that the term for works for hire are NOT based on the life of the author, it is a flat "95 years from the year of its first publication, or a term of 120 years from the year of its creation, whichever expires first."

    This is awfully easy stuff -- if he's looked at copyrights he shouldn't be screwing this up.

    And extending copyright to ludicrous lengths of time is against the public interest.

    I totally agree with this. One hundred percent.

    Twenty years after the author's death or the author's hundredth birthday, whichever comes last -- that's a workable standard to provide for the author and his or her immediate heirs.

    Sadly, Card is merely reducing an insanely ludicrous length that we have now, to a mere ludicrous length. It's still ludicrous, though.

    Copyright isn't intended to provide for authors and especially not to provide for their heirs. Which, incidentally, copyright is very BAD at doing, since few authors make enough money, or for enough time, to ever support themselves or their heirs. Many creative works have no economic value and most have no economic value after a short period of time. Card is making the mistake of thinking that his experiences as a successful author are anything at all other than atypical.

    If Card wants authors to make money, he should encourage them to go out and get jobs. If Card wants authors' heirs to be provided for, he should support social welfare systems. What Card cannot do is he cannot force people to buy books, which is the basically the way that an author makes money from his copyrights, and while he wants to make up for that by making terms last for a long time, that still won't make people buy books.

    Like it or not, most authors do not make money by dint of being authors. Art is not a lucrative pursuit for the vast majority of artists. Some artists are lucky, but that alone shouldn't dictate our policy.

    And let's eliminate this nonsense about corporate authorship.

    Here, Card has a reasonable point at least, though I disagree with him. There's a place for works for hire, first of all, and besides which, I see no rational way of preventing the common practice of copyright assignments anyway, which means that there's really no point. An author might not experience this normally, but how many people might be said to be authors of a movie? It's potentially hundreds of people -- ownership by so many is exactly why we don't have certain forms of commons. It just isn't feasible.

    If a corporation claims to be the "author" for copyright purposes, then the whole life of the copyright should be twenty years, period.

    I think the whole life of a copyright ought to be twenty years period no matter what. Why stop with only works for hire?

    Frankly, I think FIVE years is enough, with some types of creative works (read: not software) being eligible for five year extensions up to a maximum of twenty to twenty-five years. Copyrights should be no longer than necessary; if an author can't be bothered to frequently reassert his de

    --
    -- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
  41. WASTE WASTE WASTE fork fork fork by Master+Controll+Prog · · Score: 3, Informative
    this vesrion of waste is better. do not use the other version. it is not as secure. it is not as stable.
    For those of you running the SourceForge version, I HIGHLY recommend you stop running it. Were you aware that all of your chats are logged by default? Does it not seem odd that your ENCRYPTED application logs all of your chat in plain text? That is NOT good. This is a change that will be added back in later as a preference, but is disabled in the GDA version. It also has several crash symptoms in various configurations. It also logs your downloads to your first SHARED directory, that's not good. You can download the WASTE.exe available on the GDA ( http://waste.globaldisarray.org) website and copy it directly over your existing one. The libraries in use are identical.
  42. Re:Nah.. IT's better when you add Korean to it! by _LFTL_ · · Score: 2, Funny

    Added -> Korean -> English

    Inside British Colombia soul wavering inside the nameless map basic specialist together opinion of language study, with by a research from the namely inside which it does not refer in easy opposition side is doubtful everyday in the onlooker and and the first flash the college which is sufficient in the situation machine conversion which is.

  43. Fortran has hobbled itself by penguin7of9 · · Score: 2

    While it's a vast improvement over Fortran 77, I suspect most modernprogrammers Fortran 9x is not a particularly pleasant language to program in compared to many other languages; most developers probably wouldn't use it even if it had decent Linux support.

    The "F" compiler breaks the one thing that makes Fortran 9x still somewhat attractive: fairly seamless backwards compatibility with Fortran 77. With Fortran 9x, at least you can take dusty deck Fortran 77 programs and without too much work add "advanced" features like dynamic memory allocation to them.

    However, the fact that there are no open source Fortran 9x compilers for Linux is probably an additional problem for its adoption. People who might otherwise try to port Fortran 77 programs to Fortran 9x now just rewrite the stuff in C++. But, hey, overall, we are probably better off because of that.

    1. Re:Fortran has hobbled itself by Aardpig · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Bollocks -- big, sweaty, steaming bollocks. F9x is an absolute joy to program in -- just the array syntax alone makes it so. And, despite what some C++ advocates may claim, it still holds the edge in terms of efficiency, when it comes to numerical simulations.

      As for the lack of open source Fortran 9x compilers, that I agree with. However, there are two projects in SourceForge which are addressing this problem, and my current project (c. 50,000 lines of F95 code for simulating spectral emission from pulsating stars, due to be released under the GPL) is relying on the fact that there will be free compilers around when it is released.

      In any case, the fact that there is no current open source compiler is not that much of a deterrent to most Fortran users. Think about it: most people who program in Fortran are actually using the language to solve numerical problems in some other discipline (such as engineering, or in my case astrophysics); they're not CS students looking for a free (beer or speech) compiler to do their linked list assignment on. Since these typical users are either embedded in a university department or a corporation, there are ample funds to buy whatever F9X compiler they might need. Lack of free (as in beer) compilers is just not a factor for most Fortran users, and most are too pragmatic to worry about free as in speech.

      --
      Tubal-Cain smokes the white owl.
  44. Re:Corporations Are Legal Persons by MrLint · · Score: 2, Informative

    indeed sir indeed. However i recall seeing about a book a while back that claims that that was not the actual decision.

    There is a book called "Unequal Protection" by Thom Hartmann about this topic. I haven't yet had a chance to read it.

    However your insight is valuable, so as of 1886 corporations had no rights.. what a terrible police state disaster that must have been.. Govt censoring the press and all sorts of bad stuff like that. I mean if you look at some of the other comments in this thread. That how people assume it must have been. Right? (add sarcasm liberally)

  45. What a wuss of a reason by jmichaelg · · Score: 2, Insightful
    You don't need protection from telemarketers. You can just hang up the phone. But no, that's not enough. You want the right to call a cop to enforce your view of the world on someone else. Even if it means violating the first amendment.

    If that's what being a liberterian is, you can keep it.

  46. What kind of protected speech is this? by jettoblack · · Score: 2, Interesting

    My friend, an ex-terrormarketer, writes:

    "I once worked for one of the most evil telemarketing companies ever. We would call people and ask them all kinds of personal questions. Things like where they worked, how many children they had, and so on. Then we would call their neighbors and have them confirm what they just told us.

    More often than not, people would tell me to fuck off. Then I'd call their neighbors, and their neighbors would sell them out and tell me everything I wanted to know in a heartbeat. "Bob still works at Sears? Thanks. Two kids living at home? Thanks. I appreciate your help, Mister."

    Muahahahaha.

    We were allowed to do anything we wanted to get that data -- anything at all. I lied about my identity a lot. Sometimes I was a detective for the local police department. Sometimes I worked for the Social Security Agency. Sometimes I was confirming entries for that sweepstakes company. Anything to get the data. If that didn't work, I would harass people until they cracked. I had neighbors ratting on each other. I'd swap project books with a co-worker and we'd call each other's contacts, pretending to be "supervisors."

    I was working in the belly of evil, and I became evil. I reveled in my evilness. I laughed and laughed at the things I did. I was like an evil god with a phone and a license to harass. I couldn't get fired because I got results. Nothing I did was too outrageous. It was a good time to be alive.

    So now, when telemarketers call me, I know exactly where they are coming from, and I cut them no slack whatsoever."

  47. scrnabled letetrs by Pope+Raymond+Lama · · Score: 2, Informative

    Actually,as soon as I got the meme mail with the news on the "scrambled letters are readable", I've put together this script to do it.

    As I noted that a large text could become hard to read, I choose to limit the scrambling only to the 2nd-5th letters of each word...gives out great readability.

    To get the source, go one directory up.

    --
    -><- no .sig is good sig.
  48. Re:Er, That's "FORTRAN"... by khb · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Actually back in the 1980's the Standards Committee formally changed the name to Fortran. Of course, it only "took effect" in 1991 when that revision of the Standard was formally adopted.

    For what it's worth, the orignal IBM paper used a capital F and small caps for the ORTRAN. The choice of all capitals after that time was driven, to some extent, by the lack of lower case characters in early computer character sets (12 5-bit "bytes" in a CDC 60-bit word for example).

  49. gadget grandmother and typos by tommten · · Score: 2, Interesting

    the first thing that got to my mind reading todays slashback is the movie Brazil.. where a man gets taken away by government agencies for being a suspected terrorist because of a typo..
    (a bug gets squshed in a teleprinter and the name tuttle becomes buttle)
    I wonder if someone at RIAA did read the wrong ip-adress?

    --
    - I choked on the red pill and now I'm stuck in limbo
  50. Judge Nottingham's Phone Number by dmarx · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Does anyone know Judge Nottingham's phone number? Because I think we should call him tonight during dinner and tell him what we think of his ruling. He shouldn't mind. After all, we have a Constitutional right to free speach, right?!

    --
    "Do I dare disturb the universe?"
  51. Even randomised letters are hard enough by Alien+Conspiracy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Try reading the jumbled web and you'll see.

  52. Language Counter Example Blows Your Buffers by Elwood+P+Dowd · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Many of our internal language comprehension algorithms seem to be ruled by stacks.

    No, I'm not trying to say that we're a giant push-down-automata. There are various intermediaries between a push-down-automata and a full Turing machine. Some of the observable bottlenecks in human speech seem to suggest that we've got some kind of stack-based automata doing our language processing. Something like the "Bottom-up embedded push-down automata."

    It would make plenty of sense that due to our habit of reading left to right, when reading a long word with reversed internal letters, we'd have to push every single letter. By the time we get to the second to last letter, we have some hope of popping and interpretting the word, but all our buffers are blown already. Too much of our language processing logic is occupied.

    If it's a simple jumble, then there's fewer letters we need to push into the stack before we can start popping and understanding the words. If you have trouble with the whole word, you can start working on the next word, interpret that, and then keep popping use that information to guide your interpretation of the first word.

    This makes sense, really. I swear. Someone tell me they follow what I'm saying.

    --

    There are no trails. There are no trees out here.
  53. Re:Free speech or discrimination? by Steve+B · · Score: 2, Insightful
    If free speech was allowed in every form then it would be legal to deface the White House website to sell Viagra.

    If one accepted the rejection of property rights implicit in these two decisions, it would be legal to deface the White House itself to sell Viagra.

    --
    /. If the government wants us to respect the law, it should set a better example.