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Microsoft Taking Over the BIOS
dtjohnson writes "According to this story,
Microsoft has entered into an agreement with BIOS maker Phoenix
Technologies to integrate the BIOS with Windows. This has the
potential to turn PCs into Windows-only machines and also could result
in widespread incorporation of Digital Rights Management (DRM)
technology into new PCs. It looks like Microsoft is beginning to
flex their marketplace monopoly muscles again, after taking a couple of
years off."
Say hello to Linux on PPC. Or, for that matter, some BSD flavor on PPC. Speaking of BSD, there's always the Mac OSX option.
Apple uses Open Firmware, the same as Sun, possibly IBM, and others. You can easily boot Linux on a Mac if you want.
Apple has no BIOS on a chip anyware. Yes, there's Open Firmware, which is an open standard -- you're NOT locked into any type of control by Apple. You can run Linux on them. You have full control. THAT'S how it's different than Apple.
Oh, you mean the old "Apple ROMs"? That's been ancient history for at least four years, maybe more. There's no more Mac ToolBox on ROM -- it's all loaded into memory from the hard drive.
I am very, very concerned about this move. I run Linux on my Intel box with the current motherboard. Anyone got a good supply of fast PPC motherboards? I could do Linux that way, I guess....
--Jim (me)
Could you explain to me exactly who the lot of companies are? It is my belief that corporations as a whole will either not care at all or will regard this as a very good and important feature that will allow their operating system of choice(Windows) to operate more reliably and securely thanks to DRM and Trusted Computing blah blah blah
Most corporations will welcome this with open arms.
Years of lobby work finally pay off - in the USA like in Europe.
Is there a definitive point in time, a single event that started this all?
DRM this, RIAA that, MPAA my freakin head is spinning. When did DRM become so damn vital to companies like these? Was it napster that freaked everyone?
Because of all this crap, A friends ISP got shut down because someone complained to his upstream provider that one of his users was sharing software, no warning, no proof, no due process...crazy.
I spend $6000 on an HDTV last year that is already obsolete because it doesnt have the flavor of the month DVI copyrite protection connector. Hey man, check out this bad ass new DVD player that upconverts to 1080i, oh what you dont have DVI with HDCP, oh im sorry youre fucked. We had the 15pin RGB connector, then component video, then firewire, then DVI, then DVI with HDCP, and now we have HDMI. make up your freakin minds.
Or how about a cd I bought that would play in my high end REGA Jupiter cd player because it had copywrite protection.
I upgraded my video card and had to reactivate Windows XP on my workstation at work. What a pain in the a$$ I paid for the windows license.
This shit makes physically ill to the point where I want to start firebombing some of these companies.
I obviously blame these corporations and industry groups, but what started it all? Why are they so convinced that anyone using a computer is out to ruin them.
Why am I being affected by all this crap, I dont fileshare, I dont rip CDs for friend, I dont steal cable. Im a somewhat honest consumer, why am I getting nailed with all this crap that really isnt going to make ANY dent in actual piracy?
Are you listening to me Microsoft, RIAA, MPAA, Sony, Adobe, Disney and all you other fuckers. You cant stop piracy, all youre doing is driving me freakin nutts, and Im your paying customer!!!
For DRM to have any measure of success, both hardware and software must be closely joined. A software only DRM solution will fail due to the ability to take the storage media to another software (OS). A hardware DRM solution would work, but updating for new file formats would allow a back-door for hackers.
Taking over the BIOS should be just one step toward implementing a total DRM solution. The next step is securing storage media - maybe a 'smart' drive that handles file interaction for the OS and whose internals are hidden (for example - OS/user doesn't need to know/control format on drive).
Of course. Because this Justice Department has shown itself to be the ever-vigilant foe of monopolies, Microsoft in particular. It only took a six-year, multimillion dollar lawsuit among a dozen states and the federal government to end up causing Microsoft to do exactly nothing...
Don't look to the DoJ to fix these wrongs -- Microsoft has the $$.
The Mongrel Dogs Who Teach
Oh, yeah, I'm sure Dell and HP and Gateway and all the rest are going to LOVE a requirement to pay a Phoenix tax as well as the Microsoft tax! Not to mention what AMI and Award will think of this.
If all this should have a reason, we would be the last to know.
[...]
have the option of allowing users to turn it off.
Unless *large number* of users do this, it won't help. Because what will happen is that more and more you will find media that refuses to run unless you have it turned on, and so your choice will be to leave it turned on, or never display any media again. And no amount of explaining the situation to the public will ever work. You'll say, "This sucks because it means I have to run only approved Windows software and I don't even want to run Windows" - and people will hear "Hi, I'm into piracy." And in the battle of public opinion, you can't beat the 500 pound elephant willing to lie.
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
The BIOS OS integration on the Mac has always been a thing of beauty, and it makes sense that M$ would (after 20 years) start to catch up by now.
Except Apple sells PCs and Microsoft doesn't. Apple also used a customized version of OpenFirmware (stripped down version of Sun's OF, IIRC), while Microsoft is making it's own BIOS. Microsoft isn't catching up, they're trying to drag the whole PC market into their realm of control.
Ah, I may have misread.
:)
However, I think we'd be at least 5-7 years, and more likely 10 years, from that happening. It certianly won't be part of the Longhorn release. Here's my reasoning:
1) The Longhorn release is nearly to the Beta stage, and we are likely more then a year off from seeing the first motherboards with this particular type of BIOS.
2) Even if they wanted to try and lock people down into "You can only use Windows if you use MS-BIOS," there's still going to be the problem of backwards compatibility. Historically, Microsoft has wanted to push out OS upgrades to as many people as possible as quickly as possible. This means that it needs to be able to run on hardware manufactured during the lifetime of the previous incarnation of windows, if not the last two incarnations. For example, you can run Windows XP on hardware that ran Windows 98 SE, Windows ME, and Windows 2000...You may not be terribly happy with it, but you can do it.
Yeah, there are ways around both of those, and they aren't the only reasons why I don't think we'll see that tight of required integration anytime soon.
However, I do think now is the time to start looking at alternitives. LinuxBIOS is an option, however, it has quite a bit of work to go, and it doesn't have the corporate backing to make it happen that Phoenix and Microsoft can lever behind this.
Much like with DRM, I am interested to see where this will go, and am avidly watching for more news, but until there are some more definate answers, that's all I'm going to do. I'm a network engineer. I don't have the technical skills to design an alternate technology, nor am I in a position where I can affect things politically (other then writing to my representives). I will continue to watch, learn, and comment where appropriate.
Unless/until Microsoft pulls a Microsoft and switches vendors.
If all this should have a reason, we would be the last to know.
Maybe a few years ago, this would be frightening, but as it stands, it is far too late to fear the PC industry being locked into Windows. Even if you think the home user base is unimportant, IBM, Dell, HPaq, Sun, Racksaver, and others have a significant investment in Linux in particular, and even if MS managed to get all the current independent motherboard companies on board for this, most any of those players would easily overcome it to keep the Linux revenue stream going.
You have Clustering, server farms, web hosting, and a not so insignificant workstation and desktop market that is heavily leaning in the direction of linux (dominating the first three, and making very serious inroads into workstations and power user desktops). That's a whole lot of revenue for the likes of the big companies to just shrug and give up at Microsoft's whim.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
One only has to wonder how long before TCPA chip will refuse to load Linux BIOS loading only "trusted" Windows BIOS which will of course never load "untrusted" GNU OS. Truely scary perspective especially considering the fact that back in 1997 we all thought The Right to Read was a huge overexeggaration. I think it is time to renew my EFF membership. I believe everyone should do that instead of just complaining on Slashdot.
Sincerely,
Pan Tarhei Hosé, PhD.
"Homo sum et cogito ergo odi profanum vulgus et libido."
This in turn means that Dell et al will either
Yeah, DRM will be optional for a while. But when 90% of users are switched over to Windows2007, then banks will start to require DRM enabled computers to do your financial transactions over the web (balance transfers, checking the mortage status, etc.). Then the Powers-That-Be(TM) will decide that in order to crack down on terrorists, all on-line banking transactions will have to use a computer with DRM (and it just so happens that all transactions will also be simulatneously logged on IRS computers). Then on-line retailers will get in the act. First the Amazon's and E-Bay's will start to require it to reduce fraud. Then the banks will stiff-arm *all* merchants to only allow credit card transactions from DRM enabled machines. Of course on-line bill paying will go the same way. And now since the majority of people have these computers, other web-site operators will start to think "What kind of 'hacker' is visiting my site without a properly 'secured' browser? And what kind of data mining can I do now that I have a guarenteed identity behind the computer that I can sell to someone else!" So as more companies start to jump on the bandwagon, Grandma complains, "Some ladies in my knitting circle can't see my blog!" So the blogging software companies have to also incorporate DRM. Finally, the only people left using non DRM computer will be linux enthusiasts and criminals/terrorists. And since these two groups are about equal in size it'll be about a 50% chance that any web-surfer using a non-DRM computer is a criminal. Finally, DRM will be mandated by law and all objectors will be (secretly) rounded up and quitely disposed of (via the Patriot VI Act). So I know that I sleep sound at night knowing that DRM is *optional*.
"Then again, some upstart company may do the same to Phoenix as they did to IBM when they 'made' BIOS :-)"
One Problem with that, the DMCA. If the DMCA would have existed 20 Years ago, IBM would have sued Phoenix & Compaq under the DMCA, and PCs today would still cost over $5000, because IBM would be the only PC manufacturer around. In other words, if someone reverse Engineers the new M$ BIOS, they would have Phoenix & Microsoft suing them under the DMCA.
I can see all the thick-skulled cops now..
"Sonny, you clearly circumvented technological security mechanisms by using illegal software (MS didn't give it a run-license) to install Linux. You clearly broke the law and now it's federal pound-me-in-the-ass prison for you. Don't drop the soap, sucker! I despise scum like you."
I hope people will keep in mind what legislation of technology does when they whine to their congressmen about spam. When you beg the government to make certain emails illegal, they have to define "illegal email". Now are you sure you would like the US Congress to define "illegal email" _for you_?
"Most of slashdot is disillusioned, thinking windows is 100% shitty."
There's some truth to that. I'm sitting here using Windows 2000, but most of the Slashdotters stopped using Windows back at 95 or 98. Those OS's were 100% shitty. I will never defend either of them (or ME) because they really were incredibly unstable.
Then the switch to Linux happens, and nobody has sat down and used Windows 2000. So they have no idea that the stability is a hell of a lot greater (it's based on NT instead of DOS) or that work can actually be done about it.
I can't say I blame a lot of the peeps here who think the BSOD jokes are funny. I wish they'd understand that Windows development didn't suddenly stop in 1998, though.
"Derp de derp."
We'll still be able to hack away on our (ever increasingly) obsolete computers.
Also, take a look at the 8-bit computer enthusiasts. These guys know every inch of their 8-bit computers, and can make them sing. You can probably build one from scratch from common chip parts. The 80886? (err...i'm drunk) Assembly is out there forever, and we can always program on that.
My point is, that even though our dual 3 GHz machines will become obsolete by the time your prediction comes true, we can always hobble along on our own computers. What it takes engineers at Intel to make today, they'll be teaching high schoolers in 20 years. (see 8-bit paragraph above)
Due to saving money for a house, I have been hobbling along on my 400mhz AMD computer since I built it in '98. Can't play the new games on it, but I can still rip & encode [my] CD's and DVD movies on it. Just what the RIAA and MPAA wouldn't want me to do today.
All I'm saying is that your prediction of comptuer armageddon isn't going to happen so quickly or overnight. Blu-ray discs are coming out 'real-soon-now' for the last 2 years. Your 3 years? 5 years? is probably more like 8 years, 10 years. Scared of the BIOS market being stolen by M$? I envision Open-BIOS becoming a reality. Chip burners are becoming cheaper and more common. We can make our own. Or know someone that does. Also marketplace ca$h is what's going to drive all this. China/Malaysia pirate capital of the world will be the last place that moves to DRM. They'll continue to fill the market with non-DRM bios because there WILL be a market for that for a while. Thus add another 2-3 years to your armaggedon date.
Why are there only 19 people folding@home for slashdot?