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Vancouver Bars Network Together to Track Patrons
Tortured Potato writes "The Vancouver Sun reports
that bar owners in the area will soon start
tracking patrons by photo and driver's license. 'John Teti, chairman of the coalition,
said the vote is merely a formality. "We have
full backing from our members," Teti said
Monday....Once the system is in place, patrons
will be asked to stand in front of a camera to
have their picture taken and will then swipe
their drivers' licence, or possibly show some
other form of identification, that will
automatically give the establishment the patron's
name and age and show if he or she has caused
trouble at any other bar on the network.' I'm
glad to see that Big Brother is alive and well on
the left coast." This is the next step past merely swiping licenses.
OTOH, what frickin' business is it of theirs to know where I've been? It's only someone else's business if I endanger someone else, dangit!
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy
I guess the US alcohol culture is different to that in Britain, but if that were tried here the thing that immediately strikes me as problematic is when (say, just before a big soccer match) a big crowd of 50 or so people enter the pub. Queues in that kind of situation tend to be bad enough, with people 3 deep at the bar, but if they had to muck about with swipe cards (and there'll always be the odd 10% who haven't been to the bar before and need their photo and details entering onto the system) the queues would be appalling. Besides which, what happens when the system crashes? Either the pubs lose a lot of business or they make do without the system; and if they can make do without it, why bother in the first place?
"'I pass the test,' she said. 'I will diminish, and go into the West, and remain Galadriel.'"
- JRR Tolkien.
Ever since I was 18 (1998) in Winnipeg (its in Canada, for those educated in the US) they have been doing this.
For all of the bars affiliated with the CanadInns Corp (www.canadinns.com) this was the standard routine for getting into a bar.
- empty pockets into a basket
- walk through metal detector
- pick up belongings
- hand bouncer your ID
- bouncer photographs the license
- pay cover
And if you happen to be male they also check your name against their database to see if you have been banned from the bar or caused problems on an earlier occasion.
This is really nothing new other than the fact that different owners are now sharing the information.
In Winnipeg Manitoba(Which for you who dont know is in Canada), almost 90% of our bars have had this system in place for years and hasnt had any reportings of being abused.
Here is how our system works. You walk through a metal detector, get patted down, they put your drivers license under a magnifier/camera, and take your picture, both are saved in their system.
Now, if you do cause trouble, or the cops come looking for you, they simply say "yes he's here" and point you out. If you do something dumb at the bar, their computer is then programmed to ban you for a pre determined time..
I have no problem with this system at all, Im not doing anything bad, so I have nothing to worry about, as for photo identification, I think its a great idea, I have photo ID at work, School, when I goto the bar, etc... I feel alot safer knowing the establishments I patron know who is in their facilities
not that i would anyways, since vancouver's bars really suck pole...
they fought the smoking ban. i actually enjoy going to a pub and not inhaling second hand smoke.
so "business is down" because of the smoking ban, but now they voluntarily shoot themselves in the foot with this crap? it was bad enough the post office swiped my DL to get my registered letters (they used to just look at it to see if i was me), but this is rediculous. and to the "kill the magnetic stripe" kiddies, BC DLs have bar codes too. my DL has a nice crease down the middle of it, rendering both the mag stripe and bar code useless.
Reminds me when I was in college, and the local 7-11 scanned your california driver's license when you buy cigarettes. My friend, who wanted to buy cigs, didn't want them to scan his license, so he handed them his military ID. Of course, you can't scan this, and as such, wouldn't sell him cigs. (even tho he was old enough to buy liquor)... After a bunch of yelling, they sold him his cigs without scanning anthing...
...use your passport instead. They won't have a swiper for it, but it proves your Date of Birth and has a picture, so they'd have to let you in.
Mais non?
I live downtown Vancouver, 2 blocks from the "granville row" that they refer to in the article.
I've played in the house band of one of these clubs, and know a LOT of people that work and play in these clubs.
I think this is a GOOD thing.
Even as we speak, a friend of mine is STILL recuperating from a severe shit-kicking that happened within one of the bars over 2 months ago.
She (yes, SHE) was minding her own business, when 2 guys bumped into her boyfriend, who turned around with the typical "WTF!?", and the 2 guys almost killed him. I wish I were being over-dramatic, but they literally ALMOST KILLED HIM. They knew how to fight, and they went at it. One of them even pulled out a collapsable baton and hit him while he was down. It should be mentioned that the guy who got shit-kicked was knocked down and unconscious before he even finished the "WTF!?".
At this point, his girlfriend jumped in and tried to get them to stop, so they started beating her with the baton.
This happened in less than 30 seconds, in front of a horrified bartender, and the guys were gone before any bouncers could arrive... and they weren't slow to get there.
Even now the bar-scene staff, Vancouver Police, and RCMP (Royal Canadian Mounted Police), are trying to figure out who the guys were and how to find them.
The sad part is that it's not an isolated incedent. In-bar muggings and shootings are on the rise, with a number of East Indian and Asian gangs going nuts on each other.
My whole philosophy is that it's private property, it's reasonable for the bars to ask you to do this to get in, and at the end of the day, you don't HAVE to go there. You don't like their policies, don't go.
If anything, I'd rather see this story being discussed from a "technology-based solution to a problem" angle rather than a knee-jerk "oh my God they're coming to get us, put on your tinfoil hats!" angle.
$0.02 (CDN)
It still is because I probably don't go to bars there that will implement this type silliness. Vancouver is an awesome city. You can get drunk off of really strong beer and smoke all the pot you want.
As for bars taking pictures of people, that's just stupid. I don't know about in Canada, but in Washington it's illegal to serve people that are visibly drunk. Rather than treating all your customers like criminals the bars should be hiring better bartenders and waitresses that can tell when someone is drinking too much. You are supposed observe the person's personality and when they start acting like assholes toss them out with the garbage, that's how it supposed to work. If they are just an asshole to begin with toss them out too, who needs 'em. If you can't handle your liquor don't drink with the big boys.
I have spent a considerable portion of my life in bars, and not always nice ones, and I have rarely ever seen a barfight. I know they happen but the fact is that the vast majority of people, probably over 95%, have never been involved in a bar fight. It doesn't take an expert to figure out who the troublemakers are - they are probably the same ones from last night.
LoRider
Entering and leaving the bar *ARE* our everyday movements.
paintball
Ok, so they're expecting the bartender or some dedicated person to watch for you. How about two days from now? A month?
Photo recognition software can't even get 90% right in the tests I've seen reported.
Well, the license swipe might help, but what happens when it fails to read? Type it in right? No big deal. What happens when 50% of your customers purposefully scratch barcode on the license or de-magnetize it? Give yourself about sixty seconds to process that customer. Big club with say, 60 people an hour ane gonna have their hands VERY full in a hurry.
I think this will probably work, but I would expect the cost to be quite significant to implement.
When I went to ICBC to change my address, they taped a white piece of paper with my new address to the back of the card, obscuring both the bar code and magnetic strip.............
Good lord, they lobbied for late night bus service? Those bastards!
I'm not going to try and defend them on anything else, but Vancouver really needs late night bus service... if they contributed to getting the hours extended, I'm happy about that.
~ Leilah
Sorry, but i dont buy the 'its for the kids' sort of attitude.
There is NO reason to give up your freedom and privacy for false security.
You would think people would have learned that by now..
Anyone here remember Hitler? Stalin?
---- Booth was a patriot ----