Vancouver Bars Network Together to Track Patrons

Tortured Potato writes "The Vancouver Sun reports that bar owners in the area will soon start tracking patrons by photo and driver's license. 'John Teti, chairman of the coalition, said the vote is merely a formality. "We have full backing from our members," Teti said Monday....Once the system is in place, patrons will be asked to stand in front of a camera to have their picture taken and will then swipe their drivers' licence, or possibly show some other form of identification, that will automatically give the establishment the patron's name and age and show if he or she has caused trouble at any other bar on the network.' I'm glad to see that Big Brother is alive and well on the left coast." This is the next step past merely swiping licenses.

Comments

Will it help with drunk driving?

[turbotalon]

Drunk driving is (and has been for a while) one the great problems of our society. Will this help the bars track the heavy drinkers, perhaps so they can call a cab for the drunk?

OTOH, what frickin' business is it of theirs to know where I've been? It's only someone else's business if I endanger someone else, dangit!

This has been going on in Winnipeg for years...

[sputnikid]

Ever since I was 18 (1998) in Winnipeg (its in Canada, for those educated in the US) they have been doing this.

For all of the bars affiliated with the CanadInns Corp (www.canadinns.com) this was the standard routine for getting into a bar.

- empty pockets into a basket
- walk through metal detector
- pick up belongings
- hand bouncer your ID
- bouncer photographs the license
- pay cover

And if you happen to be male they also check your name against their database to see if you have been banned from the bar or caused problems on an earlier occasion.

This is really nothing new other than the fact that different owners are now sharing the information.

Living Downtown Vancouver...

[nettdata]

I live downtown Vancouver, 2 blocks from the "granville row" that they refer to in the article.

I've played in the house band of one of these clubs, and know a LOT of people that work and play in these clubs.

I think this is a GOOD thing.

Even as we speak, a friend of mine is STILL recuperating from a severe shit-kicking that happened within one of the bars over 2 months ago.

She (yes, SHE) was minding her own business, when 2 guys bumped into her boyfriend, who turned around with the typical "WTF!?", and the 2 guys almost killed him. I wish I were being over-dramatic, but they literally ALMOST KILLED HIM. They knew how to fight, and they went at it. One of them even pulled out a collapsable baton and hit him while he was down. It should be mentioned that the guy who got shit-kicked was knocked down and unconscious before he even finished the "WTF!?".

At this point, his girlfriend jumped in and tried to get them to stop, so they started beating her with the baton.

This happened in less than 30 seconds, in front of a horrified bartender, and the guys were gone before any bouncers could arrive... and they weren't slow to get there.

Even now the bar-scene staff, Vancouver Police, and RCMP (Royal Canadian Mounted Police), are trying to figure out who the guys were and how to find them.

The sad part is that it's not an isolated incedent. In-bar muggings and shootings are on the rise, with a number of East Indian and Asian gangs going nuts on each other.

My whole philosophy is that it's private property, it's reasonable for the bars to ask you to do this to get in, and at the end of the day, you don't HAVE to go there. You don't like their policies, don't go.

If anything, I'd rather see this story being discussed from a "technology-based solution to a problem" angle rather than a knee-jerk "oh my God they're coming to get us, put on your tinfoil hats!" angle.

Re:Living Downtown Vancouver...

[nettdata]

That happened outside the bar?

Nope, inside, at one of the bars near the back of the club.

How would registering help?

Then the cops would at least have a pic of the guy who did this, that could be shown around, put in the paper, on CrimeStoppers, etc., in an attempt to catch him. Right now they have nothing, except for varying descriptions.

In other instances, they can't find witnesses to shootings, stabbings, beatings, etc. Registration would at least give them the ability to track down potential witnesses to help those that were assaulted. I also know 4 friends of mine that have had their drinks spiked in the last couple of years, and they say they had problems describing them, but they could have picked them out from a group of photos (facial scars, shirt they were wearing, etc.).

It also turns out that the same pair of guys went to 4 or 5 bars that night, getting kicked out for causing problems inside the bar... a couple of fights, etc. I found this out when I went around, calling on some bar-staff friends to see if we could find out anything about them.

In this extreme case, it seems that these guys were out to scrap... plain and simple. They came armed with a weapon and the mind-set.

Registration could have at least alerted the other bars, not letting them in to cause problems, and the cops may have had a better chance of catching up to them.

I think it's also important to understand that the area of town where most of this is taking place is VERY small... TONS of bars within a $5 cab ride. It's not unusual for people to get kicked out of one bar and go to another one down the street. On Granville Row, there are about 8 bars, on the same street, in a single block.

There usually aren't many problems outside (except when people get tossed), because there's usually a few cops around (there's a community police station right in the middle of it). It's usually on the inside, in the packed night clubs, that the problems occur.

As to the ID Swap thing, the bouncers aren't (usually) idiots... if they look at the ID (which they'll do before any pics are taken), and it doesn't match you, then you'll be refused. Also, attempting to use ID that is not yours to enter a licensed drinking establishment is a criminal offense... not that that's a big deal or anything... just pointing it out.

Re:The system puts your picture into it's database

[Boogaroo]

Ok, so they're expecting the bartender or some dedicated person to watch for you. How about two days from now? A month?

Photo recognition software can't even get 90% right in the tests I've seen reported.

Well, the license swipe might help, but what happens when it fails to read? Type it in right? No big deal. What happens when 50% of your customers purposefully scratch barcode on the license or de-magnetize it? Give yourself about sixty seconds to process that customer. Big club with say, 60 people an hour ane gonna have their hands VERY full in a hurry.

I think this will probably work, but I would expect the cost to be quite significant to implement.