Slashdot Mirror


The Open Code Market

There's a new article in First Monday entitled "The Open Code Market". Jordi Carrasco-Munoz, the author has some interesting comments about the article itself, which I've put below, but the overall direction of the piece is, in his words: "In short, The Open Code Market aims to become a Free Market for software, as well as a market for Free Software. The OCM introduces into the Free/Open Source movement an economic incentive, to help align the priorities of Free/Open Source developers with those of the end users. " Jordi writes: "

The Open Code Market

The peer reviewed magazine FirstMonday has published one paper I wrote on the business possibilities of Open Source titled "The Open Code Market".

In short, The Open Code Market aims to become a Free Market for software, as well as a market for Free Software. The OCM introduces into the Free/Open Source movement an economic incentive, to help align the priorities of Free/Open Source developers with those of the end users.

Between the final draft and publication, I received many valuable comments on the idea. I am very grateful to all those who dedicated some of their valuable time to read the paper and make insightful comments.

Some of those comments led me to an earlier similar effort by Brian Behlendorf named SourceXchange (originally at www.sourcexchange.com). After contacting Brian, his comments were probably the most valuable, since he had gone through the the actual proces of running a project similar to what I am proposing.

His main line was that:
a) while the market made profits, it did not reach the levels of profitability that were expected in the middle of the dot.com boom, and investors looked for other (more lucrative) endevours
b) That the dot.com boom also addedd costs (high salaries, etc) to his attempt and
c) that it is difficult to commoditise software creation due to the uncertainties over time / effort required to write the software, and the difficulty of the role of "project manager".

My line on all this is that
- The project may be easier to develop now as expectations for profits (and costs) have decreased, and that sourcing on low-cost countries (i.e. India, Vietnam, etc.) would reduce costs significantly.
- I also expect that the market will take off only as Free Software/Open Source (Linux in particular) moves to the mass market of the desktop, thus generating the necessary economies of scale, visibility and consumer-mass. In my idea, the target end-users of the market are not IT companies, but mainly individuals with no IT knowled (nor desire to acquire it) and Small and Medium Enterprises with small or no IT departments.
"

26 of 143 comments (clear)

  1. DIY'ers by Gabrill · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I think I see a new class split. The do-it-yourselfers that appreciate the quality and flexibility of open source vs. the people who just want a working computer without configuration woes. Guess which one will spawn the new millionairs and monarchs?

    --
    Always going forward, 'cause we can't find reverse.
  2. Try before Buy by WebfishUK · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I could see this kind of thing working as a try before you buy market - use the code and pay when you release the product.

    --
    -- "Can't sleep, clowns will eat me!"
  3. this all sounds great... by Major_Small · · Score: 5, Insightful
    but you have to look at most computer users... most people don't know about programming and think an open-source program means that somebody will come in and hack their computer...

    try explaining the good side of open-source programs to people who have never written a program in their life... you'll see what I mean...

    I can't see much revenue comming from ordinary computer users who would see this as a 'hacker's' network or something. where they should direct themselves is towards the programming communities and (mostly) businesses...

    1. Re:this all sounds great... by DarkSarin · · Score: 3, Insightful

      i must respectfully disagree. i have managed to successfully explain why open source programs are good to a number of non-programmers. Even my mother, who is one of the most computer illiterate people on the planet, was able to grasp the concept.

      Granted, she did not come into the situation with a bias against it, but several of the people I know have.

      I know it feels good to say that we who watch /. are the 3l33t, but the truth is that if you really want to, it is possible to explain most of the concepts of open source to just about anyone. It doesn't mean that they will agree.

      Personally, I take the view that humans are pretty smart.

      --
      "We don't know what we are doing, but we are doing it very carefully,..." Wherry, R.J. Personnel Psychology (1995)
  4. Levels of profit expected during dot.com boom? by Per+Abrahamsen · · Score: 3, Funny

    Did he mean the site didn't run with big losses and an unsustainable business plan?

    I that was what was expected during the .com boom.

  5. Some questions by TheSpoom · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I think it's a very good idea, and I hope it will take off. That said, there's a couple things I wonder.

    • What incentives to companies have to use this?


    • The obvious answer is of course that the code can be seen and updated by the OSS community but IMHO most don't see the value in that and would rather stick with their own development team to do their work for them (think the Microsoft argument of having someone to fire).

    • How do we convince companies that their software will be supported?


    • My guess would be that it's effectively the same for them (since they could commission patches much the same as they could pay their programmers to update software) but again, management probably doesn't like it that they have to pay someone out of house to do it.


    It's about time that someone created a method such as this to make the creation of open source code generate some funds for the programmer. If companies can see that keeping these programs open can be beneficial not only to them in the support of the OSS community but the the industry as a whole then I think everyone should be benefitted by something like this.
    --
    It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
    - E. Debs
  6. Something like Expert's Exchange? by G4from128k · · Score: 2, Informative

    It sounds like you are proposing something akin to Experts-Exchange, but with a few differences. OCM would use real dollars, instead of points. OCM would also encourage the creation and reuse of code, not just answers to IT questions. OCM might incorporate private collaborative project spaces to help a shifting group of workers create commissioned code.

    --
    Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
  7. Just find the right service model by WampagingWabbits · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'm working on an open-source location search (Mobilemaps) which aims to create a collaborative market for developers/portals using it.

    The right service in this case is geotargeted advertising for local businesses wanting to gain some visibility on the net. It's an extension of a proven business model used by search engines like Google.

    The plan is there's no need for developers to be paid for their code, they just earn money by participating in the advertising service by operating the location search for their local area.

  8. Mixed gut reaction... by LilJC · · Score: 3, Insightful
    This is an interesting idea, though at its heart seems to be nothing more than a distributed consulting company.

    Suppose right now today my company wants a custom feature or a bug fixed in some OS software. We can pull out our checkbook and hire X to do Y for $Z. If it's OS work, that's just part of our contract. AFAIK, this happens already.

    So what is the innovation here? To create a "market" that is basically a consulting company for OS work? Doesn't seem to be...after all, the article specifically says this is not limited to GPL (and that didn't seem to be followed up with "or other open-source license"). It says open code, but does that mean the results must be open or simply the basis must be open and the end results can only link to open libraries if they are closed?

    Or is it to create a consulting company that uses contractors? I don't believe that's it either... contract consulting work is already routinely outsourced and sub-contracted.

    Or is it to organize a commercial venture based on the work of OS? This might be the real heart of the issue. There is where I get mixed:

    Surely funded development of OS software advances them, but this could turn sour quickly (think Red Hat!). Now, with varied customers with individual requests I'd like to think that the market could not take on a direction with its own agenda, but I would like to hear some arguments for and against this. The model indicates this is for-profit. Thus, requests from the highest bidders would probably get preference. Supppose MS throws a few billion at time-consuming features that add little value to the product. Why wouldn't this market eat that up? But think about the cost of this. While developers add features such as scrollbars changing color through a gradient to indicate how far down you've scrolled, they are not working on fundamental issues that need to be addressed before they blow up in our faces. Suppose SCO hires a company to request a feature which would infringe on SCO's IP such that there is a genuine IP infringement that they don't appear to have set up directly.

    I, for one, would rather have talented developers working on things like IPv6 implementation, that commercial investors probably won't want to fund, or at least wouldn't be able to compete with people who use the market as a tool against OS.

    I think any time something this scale is set up, it should be very carefully critiqued. Unfortunately, there's nothing stopping anyone from doing it if it turns out to be a set-up for OS disasters.

    --

    The only thing more dangerous than a file named -rf is renaming it -rf\ /
  9. SourceXchange reborn by mpieters · · Score: 2, Informative

    Mark Pratt of Beehive, Germany, has relaunched the SourceXchange idea:

    Open SourceXperts.com

    Complete with the lame eX. It only launched on 10 November, so be gentle with yor 'how quiet here' comments.

    --
    "The truth shall make ye fret" -- The Truth, Terry Pratchett
  10. "dot.com" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Did anyone else read that as "dot dot com"?

  11. Am I missing something? by IA-Outdoors · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I also expect that the market will take off only as Free Software/Open Source (Linux in particular) moves to the mass market of the desktop

    Err, hello? RH desktop...dead. SUSE...wounded by Novell. SCO is bleeding any OSS-involved company with litigation. Who's going to take linux to the desktop or "mass market" as suggested here?

    I'm not saying this guy is wrong, but the OSS world has got some damage control to do. I'm confident it will pull through (my paycheck depends on it) but I would rethink using this as a justification for this project's market readiness.

    --
    You never saw a fish on the wall with its mouth shut.
  12. Better than Try before Buy by G4from128k · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I would hope that OCM would be better than "try before you buy." I have reached a stage in life where I want products that do what I want them to do. I don't care to spend time trying software in a production environment because I find that so much of it is a waste of time.

    OCM would seem to support the commissioning of software projects or modifications. Thus I could go the Market, submit a request (e.g., "I want a real-time transparent version of CVS") and various groups might make counter-offers of price and functionality. A bit of public interchange would would lead to a mutually agreeable specification and price. In some cases, the software provided might be off-the-shelf and in other cases it might be written from scratch.

    As a venue for the commissioning and creation of software, I see OCM providing a valuable venue for both software creators and software consumers. Software consumers could aggregate to share the costs of new or modified software or form a mutual-support community around a given piece of software.

    --
    Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
  13. this all sounds great... but it's not a market by harriet+nyborg · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Game theory shows that market failure occurs when one person's consumption does not diminish the ability of others to also consume the product, a condition called "nonrivalous consumption" or "jointness of consumption."

    Market failure can also occur when people who have not paid cannot be prevented from consuming the good, a condition called nonexcludability. Public goods by definition exhibit both jointness of consumption and nonexcludability.

    Ergo, it may be a resource, but it can't be called a market.

    1. Re:this all sounds great... but it's not a market by ahfoo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      That's a good point and the intimately related, if less eloquently stated, question is whether ideas really should be sold as property at all.
      I've been on both sides of the fence and technically I still am, but I'm a lot closer to being all the way on the FSF side these days.
      For years I've worked in educational multimedia publishing and I've seen the market go all to hell, but I'm still in because I did so much work in the past that there's no such thing as being out. New work in the same vein is a like second nature so I still do it although the profits are god awful slim.
      Obviously that stuff is all very Microsoft and very much based on images of magic secrets and such and everybody is selling bit of information they can possibly package. It's such bullshit. It's just a big orgy of trying to screw people.
      But seeing thast despite being so "competitive" there's still next to no money in it, so I've been developing a forums web site all based on open source and I'm so much happier with the latter. The whole point of this forum isn't to make momey, it's to develop a knowledge base.
      Now you can say bring up the "how do you pay the bills when working for free" issue and this has come up plenty already. But the point is that the money sucks either way. By just dropping the whole issue and getting on with using a free and open forum to focus on a new and specific skill set, you can get onto making products that you can sell instead of selling data.
      To me this has become the bottom line. You shouldn't sell data. I do it myself, but I'm coming to the conclusion that it's simply the wrong approach. If the information you're selling can be used to make a product then why not sell that product. If the information you're selling doesn't make a product, then why should it cost?
      As for services like education. I seriously think those are things that governments should be able to support through taxes. We don't need a free market in educational software materials. We already have one and it is so fucked up.

    2. Re:this all sounds great... but it's not a market by Grotus · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I disagree with the nonrivalous consumption part.

      The true product in this market is not the software, but the developer time. If a developer is working on one commission, other consumers cannot also be getting work done from that developer on their commissions. So, the consumption here is rivalous.

      The nonexcludability portion I do agree with.

      --
      "From my cold, dead hands you damn, dirty apes!" - CH
  14. The point? by Trurl · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I believe that a project like this misses the point. As I see it, most Open Source developers do not write code because they want to Make The World A Better Place. Their motivation is not the satisfaction of users.

    Programmers write code because that's what they love to do. This is why there are dozens of editors, mailers, etc, rather than a single well-maintained application of each type. A coder says to himself "I feel like writing yet another mp3 ripper GUI". He proceeds to do so despite the fact that numerous examples already exist because his motivation is his own pleasure, rather than a desire to fill some gap.

    Trying create a carrot to dangle in front of these people is pointless. They don't want your carrot. They want to write the code that they want to write.

    1. Re:The point? by csnydermvpsoft · · Score: 3, Insightful

      What prevents people from applying that same love of coding towards earning a paycheck as well? Isn't that one of everyone's main goals in life - to earn money doing something they enjoy?

      I've done plenty of projects, for pay, where I take my employer's requirements, make them my own, and enjoy it. In fact, I end up having more motivation than if I were working on something for myself, as there is the money factor to go along with the pleasure factor.

      Also, your assessment of motivation for open source coders is flawed. There is indeed a gap to fill, though it isn't usually shared by large numbers of people. In most cases, a coder writes a piece of software because it fills a need for that individual coder - it's not simply a case of "I feel like writing yet another mp3 ripper GUI," but instead more of a case of "I don't like any of the mp3 ripper GUI's out there, so I'll write my own."

  15. Not to seem arrogant, but by lone_marauder · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The OCM introduces into the Free/Open Source movement an economic incentive, to help align the priorities of Free/Open Source developers with those of the end users.

    The one thing Microsoft has done well is focus on end users. They are able to hock woefully inferior file, database, and mail server solutions because they make sure that Word's macro engine can cook your breakfast for you if you want it to. If users want a feature, it will be in the release product - performance, stability, and security be damned.

    I don't necessarily think we should follow MS in this regard. It doesn't seem to have really worked out for them. Let's focus on what is really attracting people to free software - choice.

    --
    who are those slashdot people? they swept over like Mongol-Tartars.
  16. TopCoder Software is already doing this by srowen · · Score: 5, Informative

    TopCoder Software has being doing what this article describes for over a year:

    http://software.topcoder.com/

    In short they are trying to put a structured, process-oriented community development model into a design / development competition format (with cash incentives, both upfront and as royalties) for creating new software. The resulting work is marketed as a component library, and the community itself is marketed as a "no-shore" development resource.

    Check it out, it is a pretty good system -- the results are surprisingly good. I regularly participate in these projects.

  17. A bazaar in cathedral clothing... by TrombaMarina · · Score: 5, Insightful
    most of the success stories so far (Amazon, Google, etc.) are not new producers, but more efficient (and cheaper) middlemen.

    +1 Perceptive

    This solution helps to bring together two separated communities: Users and developers, cutting drastically (but not entirely) middlemen and their added costs... The OCM acts as clearing house by delivering the software to the client and the money to the developer

    The communities are not separated. The high level of communication between developer, tester, and user is the greatest strength of OpenSource software. They are sometimes the same person! By introducing a "clearing house" you are adding a middleman and thereby reducing efficiency.

    While the customer may be able to tell if the software works as requested, it cannot identify buggy, poorly written software, let alone know if the software presents a security risk. Thus, the OCM will also have to provide services as required.

    +1 Perceptive

    This is a difficult problem. Really difficult - and essentially unsolved by traditional development models. OpenSource itself is a solution to this problem. Code reviews, while one of the most useful tools for preventing these problems, are also one of the most labor-intensive (read "expensive").

    consumers and businesses work for money, and they mistrust people who do not

    Very true. But I believe this paper underrates the strength of (as Eric Raymond calls it) the gift culture. Essentially, OpenSource developers compete to give the biggest gift to the community. The bigger the gift, the more their standing within the community rises. This has worked pretty well the past 13 years or so.

    While I applaud the effort to pay these people for their gifts, I think it tries to shove a square peg into a round hole here. It changes the motivation from "give a big gift" to "give the user what they asked for". That raises many problems:

    1. What users ask for often isn't what they want. There's a curse (I think it's Russian) that goes, "May your every wish be instantly granted." Read any story about genies for examples of the problems with getting what you ask for.
    2. Even if a specific enhancement meets a user's short-term needs (as this system encourages) there is little or no encouragement to provide an extensible solution. By comparison, "Giving the greatest gift" encourages long-term extensibility.
    3. Even if the enhancement is extensible, it may break something else that used to work. Again, the compensation scheme is weak here.

    The developer rating system would address these problems to some degree, but all ratings systems come with their own problems. Look at what OpenSource has accomplished so far. I use all OpenSource software at home, and much at work. Linux is rapidly penetrating corporate infrastructure - it's been the fastest growing operating system for years. What's broken about it?

    Ultimately, I think this paper encourages one to think about the differences between OpenSource and traditional motivational schemes/business models. It is a very interesting read and a lot of thought obviously went into it. I personally believe that society as a whole has more to gain by embracing the benefits of sharing, than to see OpenSource become as systemitized and hierarchical as much of the rest of our society.

  18. Liability by kwhite · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Here is a question I have had about open source code since taking a computer ethics course and also wondering whether we as computer professionals should be certified.

    If company A is using an open source product and said product causes a customer of company A to lose millions of dollars whos is liable? Some may say company A is liable which may or may not be true, but lets remove company A now. Many businesses want someone to be "responsible" for the software they use. If that software is written inhouse or by a third party then the liability is obvious. If open source is used would you go to source forge (as an example) and get the user ids working on the project and sue them for liability? You see businesses can't just think about what is the best piece of written code, but also perhaps which piece of code will cover its backside the best. Is that the best situation? I do not know, but it is a situation that exists, why do you think major corporations and even small business owners have lawyers and liability insurance?

  19. Public Software Fund by Russ+Nelson · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Sounds like he's proposing what I've already done, pubsoft.org. We take tenders for software, whether for entire new pieces of software, or improvements to existing software, and seek to put together developers and users. Multiple funding models are supported: matching grants, whole grants, or the Street Performer's Protocol. We've funded the up2us program (which never made it out because of the difficulty of tracking up2date development), and are currently funding FreeS/WAN, and GNU Radio.
    -russ

    --
    Don't piss off The Angry Economist
  20. Intellectual Property!! by alexjc · · Score: 2, Interesting

    This initiative is doomed to fail if they do not have very strong policies on IP. The GPL provides no guarantees on IP; for example, I could implement a patented algorithm and release it and users could get sued.

    The article does not even mention the words "intellectual property." Something to consider!

  21. Re:Are we all lemmings? by nickos · · Score: 2, Interesting

    "...a lemming is a little mole-like creature that once in a while commits a mass cuicide."

    This article points out that lemmings "do not, however, commit mass suicide by leaping off cliffs, a myth compounded 45 years ago by Walt Disney's White Wilderness film - which showed lemmings apparently going to their doom."

  22. Re:DIY'ers: OCM supports Plain Old Users by Laur · · Score: 2, Informative
    This is the big problem with current Open Source world, IMO -- the current Open Source world seems oriented toward DIY'ers creating code for other DIY'ers. Its a BOF community of computer and software-loving people. The result is code that only another coder would love. What fraction of Open Source software packages "just works" without configuration, reading a manual, etc.

    I'm not sure about the overall fraction of open source, but I think that the majority of the most "popular and common" open source apps "just work." Here's some examples from my personal experience based upon what I use.

    Everyday apps:

    KDE - just works. Plenty of tweaking can be accomplished by right clicking or through the control center.

    Mozilla - just works.

    Evolution - just works.

    OpenOffice.org - just works.

    --
    When you lose something irreplaceable, you don't mourn for the thing you lost, you mourn for yourself. - Harpo Marx