Linux To Power NWS's Storm Prediction System

Mr. Plow writes "The National Weather Service is migrating to Linux-based IBM workstations and has purchased 900 IBM computers and 160 servers to do so." He includes links to coverage at Forbes (a Reuters wire service story there), Government Computer News, and Computerworld.

Comments

We have are workstations already

[Xenolith]

I'm a NWS forecaster. We have our new workstations... they are pretty darn nifty. They are dual Xeons (2.4 ghz) running RedHat 7.2. These are much improved over the old HPs, which were J200 (overview). The bad news is that the database and application servers are still the old HPs. These are scheduled to be replaced in the near future as well.

Re:We have are workstations already

[Anonymous Coward]

Did you have to fight for getting Linux onto your desktop or was there the cost motivation to push it along?

It was a combination... cost was a big driver, but also that the developers of the new AWIPS apps pushed it that way.

These aren't your normal desktops. They run very custom applications and in some cases have three LCD monitors per CPU.

That said, Forecasters will normally have a Windoze box to the side for surfing the web, email, etc.

Re:Bravo

[Silvers]

The poster above about the disk times in application load performance is right now, however also...

You make the mistake of assuming a 1:1 ratio of CPI (clock cycles/instruction) between each of the two systems, compounded by a difference in the number of instructions needed to complete a certain task, followed by the amount of parallel pipes in each processor... etc etc etc

Important to mention...

[Anonymous Coward]

That the migration is from HP UX boxes to Linux, not from Windows as some people might assume.

Re:So what's the forecast?

[frankthechicken]

Well, since Edward Lorenz and his discovery of chaos, many of the current weather prediction systems are chaotic, and thus the forecast becomes less accurate over a longer time period.

Like many chaotic equations, the systems of weather patterns follow a `normal' path for a period of time before becoming chaotic. So this method is useful in predicting specific weather patterns for as long as 5 days in advance. After this point though the chaotic nature of the systems become apparent, with different scenario runs of similar data leading to completely different results.

So, more advanced computer power may lead to a better understanding of the chaotic equations which drive our weather and other environmental factors, though I for one remain sceptical, there are just too many factors to take into account for anything more concrete than the weather might possibly be . .

Re:So what's the forecast?

[Xenolith]

Well, to throw one stat out at you. In 1987, the NWS had a probability of detection score for tornadoes of 25%. This past year it was nearly 80%. Now given, part of that improvement is better trained employees and an excellent skywarn/spotter network. But yes, bigger and better computers are helping to improve the NWS mission.

Re:Bravo

[Xenolith]

There are still old HP systems running the database and application servers. That is part of the reason. These systems will be replaced shortly as well with x86 architecture. Hopefully with up to date and better optimized database software.

Assuming it is the application I am thinking of... it was more like 5 minutes to start up, not 60 seconds. Yes, the HP systems were ancient (relatively).

Re:Maybe this will help Linux's respectability

[Stile 65]

NASA and the Department of Energy use Linux, and have for years. They use Linux Beowulf clusters for computational fluid dynamics. Most of them have an SCI backbone for inter-node communications. Although, I guess nowadays for CFD you might as well write multithreaded code that's compatible with OpenMosix and, instead of spending a ton of $ on a cluster, run the simulations on your employees' workstations.

Oh, and you might as well not bother imagining a Beowulf cluster of those babies... it's been done.

Re:Dear NWS

[Anonymous Coward]

I work at NWS and they are decommissioning the HPUX boxes by the dozens/hundreds in many different locations around the county.

They will be surplused by the General Services Adminstration like any other old piece of government hardware. See ifyou can find your local depot/auction location.

Re:So what's the forecast?

[Anonymous Coward]

In 1987, the NWS had a probability of detection score for tornadoes of 25%. This past year it was nearly 80%. Now given, part of that improvement is better trained employees and an excellent skywarn/spotter network.

*cough*cough* You sure that wouldn't have something to do with NWS fielding the WSR-88D (aka NexRAD) doppler radars? there is a boatload of information one can extract from that data. One of the particulars is the tornado vortex signature (TVS) which usually forms anywhere from 15 to 30 minutes in advance of a tornado. One of the nice things about TVS is that the system can detect it and then notify the severe weather guru who can issue a warning.

Re:Practical Outcome of This Change?

[Anonymous Coward]

AWIPS is used mostly for severe weather forecasting. The 42 seconds saved, as quoted in the article, is enough to get a Tornado Warning out.

This is not about trying to predict if it's going to be nice out next weekend.

Re:Let's laugh at the sheep

[Lxy]

First, as I repeatedly say, this isnt an organization choosing "Linux". This is an org choosing IBM, who is intelligently exploiting a free product in order to sell their product.

You can't be farther from the truth. In fact, some of these workstations are Dell. I've seen them with my own eyes, and in fact ran top on one of them *drool*.

The NWS's AWIPS product has always run on HP-UX. A couple years ago they had started looking into linux because they'd get a free OS for cheap hardware, a definite advantage. They've been running linux and HP-UX side by side for a good year now, but it wasn't until a few weeks ago that AWIPS finally supported linux. Once the support came through for AWIPS on linux, they abandoned HP-UX.

This was a move a long time coming, and I'm glad they went through with it. So no, they are not sheep, and you are an idiot.