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Retired Microsoft Operating Systems Still Popular
Decaffeinated Jedi writes "Despite Microsoft's recent retirement of Windows 98, News.com reports that many users continue to cling to the company's older operating systems. The study cited in the article suggests that 80 percent of companies still have machines operating on Windows 95 or 98. While Windows 2000 was the most common OS in the study, just 6.6 percent of the desktop machines included in the survey were running Windows XP." The results aren't too surprising. I get a lot of user mail from Netscape 4 users, and it only makes sense that they're running it somewhere.
I still use it for my kids games and educational software....the newer ones DON'T WORK...hmmmmm
It's scary how many NT 4 boxes I come across in the work world. they just don't want to update, and the diff between using that and the newer offerings is huge, although so is the price.
CB
free ipod and free gmail!
I'd hope that larger companies would realize it's cheaper to upgrade than suffer the wrath of unsupported, unpatched windows boxen!
The Apple II C's may be perfectly fine for a high school physics lab. The MECC (Minnesota Educational Computer Consortium) produced hundreds of programs for the Apple II C that probably still have use.
A poor mechanic blames his tools.
True, on the other hand. Some companies switch to newer versions, "because it's newer". They have absolutely no need for a newer version, but well "it's newer, get it".
Mostly it's impossible arguing with people who think like that. They just want the new version, because it's available. No need to say that those people hardly believe you if you can do something better and cheaper for them (example : dynamic webdesign : "YOU can do future updates, without having to pay anyone for it". They don't believe you when you say anything like that, without prooving it 20 times).
Why pay all the extra money for an OS that won't run on your less-than-uptodate hardware and which has draconian phone-home anti-piracy measures? Sure Windows 98 wasn't the most stable Operating System in the world, but it's Windows and Windows just wouldn't be Windows without instability.
I personally run an old copy of Win98 under Win4Lin for Linux. I use it for a program or two which I need to use for work but which does not have a compatable Linux counterpart.
I worked at an ISP in Sweden a little while back. The biggest majority of users are still using Windows 98. I guess ms only chance to make people upgrade is the usual underhanded tactics, not supporting new features etc.
Me myself, I still use netscape messenger for email and have no plans on changing client. (Its super easy to backup your email in that program)
MS OS/2 1.0 was not EOL.
It was abandoned by MS at 1.2 so that 3COM's 3+Open and IBM's PC Server OS's that built on top of it would have to react and lose market share.
MS was in an agreement with IBM and 3COM that allowed them to take advantage of the developments of the other two while leaving them in the cold. IBM tried to pick up development of OS/2 (including WARP), but that is a different story.
NT, Win2K, and XP all use the "net xxx" commands that were the heart of 3COM's OS even before the "alliance" with Microsoft. I think this is why Bob Metcalfe seems to hate Gates with such a passion.
"Come into my den said the spider to the fly."
~8^]
The business desktop is Windows 2000 Professional. There should be a new version of Windows 2003(5?) for desktops soon.
My company has some 40 employees who still run Windows 95/Office 97. For us, the reason is simple: The hardware is inexpensive, we already own all the licenses, and all of our user's are used to the software.
As with most office environments that I have worked in (distribution and insurance companies mostly), the end user really only uses their PC as a wordprocessor, email station, and remote terminal.
In our office, the wordprocessing is usually done by management, so an email station and remote terminal to our database system is all that is needed.
-- You don't shoot to kill, you shoot to stay alive.
Find a used PC store in your area (there's at least one in most cities) or even get chummy with the proprietors of the "independent" computer shops. They typically have older systems for around $200 including monitor. If you're buying a couple systems, they may cut you a no-monitor deal.
3Com's 3+Open was based on Microsoft's Lan Manager product. 3Com's contribution to 3+Open was the network transport and drivers for a bunch of network cards. The later enhanced it to add an x.400 mail transport and a bunch of other stuff.
The "net xxx" commands all come from Lan Manager originally, NOT from 3Com.
"People realize that that "activation" in XP is invasive, and undesirable. People will continue to need the ability to install the same purchased license on more than one machine. Being the last Windows that let you do this easily,"
...And if you know someone who works at the bookstore, you can get one of these covenanted faculty versions even if you may not exactly be "faculty"...
At some universities that have a special agreement with Microsoft, like The University of Cincinnati, Faculty can get a legal liscenced copy of Windows XP Pro that never asks for activation, doesn't require registration, and can be installed an infinite number of times, presumably on an infinite number of computers. And they can purchase it from the University Bookstore for around US$6.95
In my company's website logs (the company targets the university student market, so this isn't universally applicable), you still find a lot of old windows products.
windows XP is 43%
windows 98 is 22%
windows 2k is 18%
windows ME is 6%
windows NT is 2%
windows 95 is 1%
Macintosh is 3%
And if you want to talk old, when I was in school one lab had an expensive scientific instrument ($100,000) that was controlled by a windows 3.1 computer. The software would not run on anything else. Upgrading would mean buying a new instrument. They left it as is.
It may be the same as abandonware, but that doesn't mean you can copy it. Abandonware is still copyright violation, just with a different justification from normal warez.
Had the organization stayed with Win2K, this never would have come up.
Realistically, Windows 98 is probably the last version of Windows that can be reasonably kept from calling home, and has a higher probability of not having some kind of government back door. You think MS got a slap on the wrist in the antitrust action for free?
CEE5210S The signal SIGHUP was received.
ultr@vnc is even better..the list of features is very impressive (I like built-in file transfer.. pcanywhere is now officialy obsolete)
DJ kRYPT's Free MP3s!
The biggest problem is the ram.
if you would ahve installed vector linux it would have downright screamed and MozillaFirebird would work great if you had 128 meg of ram.
I have 5 machines I have given to friends that are P166MMX and it is very VERY useable with Vector linux.
Wordprocessor is ABI word.. which is 9000% faster than open office.
Spreadsheet is Gnumeric, and it also is a billion times faster than Open office.
you have a choice of about 4 built in tight window managers and you can install gnome or KDE is you desire.
Give it a try.... Vector Linux. it is pretty impressive that they can take the fastest distro- slackware and make it faster and add a "apt" style of installer but is GUI based.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Switching to a recent SuSE Linux will be disaster on that hardware! Don't even think about it.
Especially the system administration tool, YaST2, will crawl on 64MB of RAM.
I have a number of versions of windows (all legal). Since I'm a developer I tended to collect some of them. Also a few years ago I was a dealer and sold some machines and had to take back at my expense certain OS copies because the customers simply could not use them.
My son uses win2k and I have a machine with NT 4.0 on it. I presently have a machine that runs 95 too - but it is an old P90 and it is turned on only once in a blue moon.
What I've found is that my son has had a great deal if difficulties with win2K. He has re-installed more than 5 times. The OS loses its network printers regularly. He whines about it of course and threatens to get a copy of XP.
I don't think his machine will run XP very well so if he does that he may as well throw out the present machine. Talk about crap eh?
Meanhile I've pretty much abandoned my NT machine and am now using the Debian Linux machine virtually 99% of the time. I may even install VMware and if I do this - I may be able to go back to only one machine. It will save me a bit of electricity.
So an effect that I presonally predicted several years ago is happening - that effect is that old copies of microsoft software are competing directly with newer versions. Given this - I am surprised to see that Microsoft revenues are holding up... or are they?
If the revenues don't materialize, Microsoft shares could erode in value at an unprecedented rate. This would be due to the fact that the number of shares Microsoft has issued is mind boggling.
I personally do not see Microsoft as a growth company at all. While I will not short them, there is no way I'd invest in them either.
This came out in the "anti-trust" trial, remember?
Windows is supposed to run slower with each new version, so you will have to buy current hardware to run it, at new-technology prices, so that the cost of the Windows OS, as a proportion of the total price of the delivered computer, will stay below a level they figured is likely to trigger a consumer revolt.
There's nothing accidental about it.
openoffice.org supports ms file formats.
Who knows what Red Hat is doing for the moment, but $60 is exactly what basic membership in the MandrakeClub costs per year. It's not required, though. You can use it for free and comes with openoffice.org
If you have to run office 97, codeweavers.com Crossover Office will do it. Strangely it's also $60. You seem to have picked a popular price point.
IANAL, but not really.
:)
The clickwrap 'contract', other than the flaw of it being a contract of adhesion ('take it or leave it') it also offers nothing to a user.
For a contract to be valid, it must offer consideration --- both parties must obtain something that I would not otherwise have. The clickwrap 'contract' doesn't. It *was* claimed that it offers me the ability to copy the software from disk media into memory, but that was explicitly ruled not copyright infringement. Therefore, the 'contract' offers me nothing I don't already posess under copyright law.
Now, the contract between microsoft and the OEM or company might have such consideration 'cheaper prices in return for accepting this restrictive contract'. However, I or any other purchaser of such a box am under no such restriction.
Also, many could argue that such OEM contracts constitute tying. Finally, there are cases where one must agree to a contract unseen, which to does not form a binding contract.
Remember, its always easy to claim anything. I now demand that all readers and especially you empty your browser cache, you pirates!
It may surprise a lot of folks to know that good ole' DOS is still widely used, and wildly popular, in industrial and engineering environments. And why not? Very small footprint, mature and stable, relatively easy to program for, great for embedded stuff, and loads of 'net-based software archives Out There with enough handy applications and programmig tools to choke a goat.
During my tenure at Boeing, I saw a number of CNC (Computer Numerical Control) machine-control applications in the factory that were all DOS-based. In the electronics labs, many design or data-acquisition tools are DOS-based. And here, in my home lab, I've got a blort-load of radio service software that requires a pure DOS platform or it simply won't run.
"Retired" OS's are popular for a variety of reasons, just as older test equipment is often favored over much newer stuff. One of those reasons is that the underlying principles of what you're trying to do never change: Only the degree of complexity needed to get it done does.
Bruce Lane, KC7GR,
Blue Feather Technologies
I took advantage of the Windows XP Pro downgrade rights to run Windows 2000:
I still think Windows 98 SE is preferable for games, but I don't miss it too much.Since a lot of protected-mode games will never be re-ported to Win32 or Linux, I still keep my old DOS disks handy.
I actually built a special PIII 733Mhz/133FSB dosbox with intentionally obsolete (for compatability) sound & video just so I could have an MS-DOS 7.22 platform to run those cool old 4GW games on.
Funny things can happen in autoplay mode, though...the frame rate is so fast the game looks like a bunch of munchkins on crack.
Scruting the inscrutable for over 50 years.
FYI:
Linux tends to want memory over processor speed.
Memory for laptops isn't too expensive on ebay. (I upped my old p166 laptop from 32M (16 onboard + 16M) to 80M (16 + 64M) for about 30 bucks.
Well worth it. Galeon is pretty quick on OpenBSD now. I remember it being slower under Debian Woody, which is odd, since I was running a pretty stripped down install of it.
The two statistics aren't in conflict. The 80 percent one only refers to companies that still have some number of machines running Windows 95 or 98. The 20 percent one refers to the total number of Win95/98 machines out there. If the companies who have Win95/98 machines only have 25% of their computers running Win95/98, then everything's pretty much squared up. (It's an oversimplification that doesn't take into account home users, but you get my point)
Apparently, just after the 2/03 MSIE 5.0 users upgraded to 6.0, only to downgrade again fairly soon afterwards.