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Universal Goo

leapis writes "The NY Times reports that Big Bang Goo may have been found. Scientists at the Bookhaven National Laboratory have 'cracked open protons and neutons like subatomic eggs to create a primordial form of matter that existed when the universe was roughly one-millionth of a second old,' according to recent diagnosic tests."

62 comments

  1. Is that supposed to be a breaktrough? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    Because matter that existed when the universe was roughly one-millionth of a second old has been known for a loooong time. Most people call it Zsa Zsa Gabor.

  2. For those who don't want to register at NYT... by Sklivvz · · Score: 5, Informative

    From the article: "AKLAND, Calif., Jan. 13 -- At least three advanced diagnostic tests suggest that an experiment at the Brookhaven National Laboratory has cracked open protons and neutrons like subatomic eggs to create a primordial form of matter that last existed when the universe was roughly one-millionth of a second old, scientists said here on Tuesday.

    The hot, dense substance, called a quark-gluon plasma, has managed to generate intense disputes in the 15 years or so in which scientists have pursued it. In 2000, a major European laboratory claimed that it had, for the first time, liberated particles called quarks from where they are normally trapped in protons and neutrons, a big step on the way to creating the plasma.

    Possibly seeking to avoid the outpouring of criticism that followed, Brookhaven scientists at the meeting here recited a series of striking new measurements from their particle accelerator in Upton on Long Island, but refused to say that they had actually produced the plasma.

    Creating such a plasma would fulfill some of scientists' biggest dreams, because it would enable them to study the earliest moments of the Big Bang, the colossal explosion that is believed to have been the birth of the entire universe.

    "I think the most economical explanation of what we're seeing is a quark-gluon plasma," said Dr. William Zajz, a Columbia University physicist who is the spokesman for an experiment, Phenix. "But we're holding ourselves to rigorous, very scientific standards, precisely to distinguish it from previous claims."

    Other scientists here said it was clear that the Brookhaven Relativistic Heavy Ion Collider had achieved a milestone.

    "The evidence for the quark-gluon plasma is overwhelming," said Miklos Gyulassy, a theorist at Columbia.

    Each of the 197 protons and neutrons that make up a gold nucleus has three quarks and a handful of other particles called gluons that transmit the strong force that holds the quarks together. By the strange rules of subatomic physics, swarms of other quarks and gluons flit into and out of existence in each nucleus.

    Physicists would like to study the quarks individually, but the force carried by the gluons is something like a rubber band that never loses its elasticity. So a given quark can never escape the embrace of another quark and roam free. The lone exception -- theoretically, at least -- should occur when a collection of ordinary particles becomes so hot and dense that their innards can spill out and form a kind of quark soup, the quark-gluon plasma.

    That is the state that the universe is thought to have been in a few millionths of a second after the start of the Big Bang, before the zoo of ordinary particles like protons and neutrons and pions and kaons had coalesced from the primordial soup. A speck of that soup is what the Brookhaven collider seeks to generate, by smashing together gold nuclei at close to the speed of light.

    Previous measurements have shown that the lump of material at the center of that collision is from 10 to 100 times as dense as normal nuclear matter. Its temperature is more than a trillion degrees.

    The new data, from particle detectors known by their acronyms -- Brahms, Star, Phenix and Phobos -- showed that this searing goo had a remarkable number of properties expected from the plasma.

    One finding focused on the almond-shape region, possibly filled with plasma, created when two spherical gold nuclei strike each other, but not quite head on. Theory predicts that fast particles trying to escape the region should become hung up in the gooey plasma and sometimes stopped completely.

    That general effect, called jet quenching, had been seen before. But observations by Star have shown for the first time that particles escaping down the long dimension of the almond are more likely to be stopped than those escaping along the short dimension, where there is less plasma to travel through.

    "This is demonstrating, if you will, that our unders

    1. Re:For those who don't want to register at NYT... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0


      the Brookhaven collider seeks to generate, by smashing together gold nuclei at close to the speed of light


      In other news, increased rarity causes gold prices to increase!

      *ta-dum* Thank you... thank you.
      And the obligatory: Man if I get modded up to +5 funny for this AC comment, I'll kick myself.

    2. Re:For those who don't want to register at NYT... by dnahelix · · Score: 1

      I know the whole article is a quote, but DAMN it's hard to read all that italics!

      Thanks for posting it though, 'cause I wasn't going to register...

      --
      Slashdot Eds Link Anonymous Posts With Logged Posts
      They Are Vermin Feeding On Each Other's Feces.
      I Hate \.
  3. bah! by xJAPrufRockx · · Score: 2, Funny

    When it comes to scientific goos, I still greatly prefer Silly Putty - no atom smasher required!

    1. Re:bah! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, quark gluon plasma can't copy the funny pages. But on the other hand it can melt J-psi and is 2 trillion degrees.

  4. How compatible ... by gustgr · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ... this is with the String Theory ?

    1. Re:How compatible ... by hcg50a · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, String Theory ought to be able to handle this. If it can't, then String Theory is out.

      From what I know of String Theory (very little), it is consistent.

      The "quark-gluon plasma" is a description from the point of view of the Standard Model of quantum mechanics.

      --
      HCG 50a = 2MASX J11170638+5455016
      11h17m06.4s +54d55m02s
    2. Re:How compatible ... by Curunir_wolf · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Well, String Theory ought to be able to handle this. If it can't, then String Theory is out.

      String theory *could* explain this, but it describes exactly the same behavior as quantum theory, only with math that is orders of magnitude more complex.

      The "quark-gluon plasma" is a description from the point of view of the Standard Model of quantum mechanics.

      Yes, and this would be the first time that this aspect of quantum mechanics had some actual proof that it can make predictions about the real world. Very important.

      As I understand it, being able to prove that string theory works may never even be possible, because it would require a super collider bigger than the earth, using more energy in 1 second that the sun has produced in its entire life so far.

      --
      "Somebody has to do something. It's just incredibly pathetic it has to be us."
      --- Jerry Garcia
  5. Avoid NYT registration by flabbergast · · Score: 5, Informative

    Google News allows you to access NYT's news stories without registration.

    1. Re:Avoid NYT registration by PetoskeyGuy · · Score: 1

      But then you have to wait for google to get the link which sometimes doesn't happen for days.

      Better is to make it a bookmarklet, or use the Random NYTimes Registration Generator
      See this link for more info.

      I can't believe that an article about scientists creating a type of matter only theorized of in the very begining seconds of the universe - how to avoid registration of the NYTimes page gets the highest mods.

  6. I wouldn't call it "goo" by hcg50a · · Score: 2

    The article itself calls it "quark-gluon plasma".

    It's like extremely hot fire. Extremely hot.

    --
    HCG 50a = 2MASX J11170638+5455016
    11h17m06.4s +54d55m02s
    1. Re:I wouldn't call it "goo" by NanoGator · · Score: 1, Funny

      "It's like extremely hot fire. Extremely hot."

      How hot is it in elephants?

      --
      "Derp de derp."
    2. Re:I wouldn't call it "goo" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      How hot is it in elephants?
      African or Indian?
    3. Re:I wouldn't call it "goo" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Huh? I don't know that.

      AAAIIEEEEEE!!!!

      --
      ..any direct or indirect reference to [...] Monty Python or Douglas Adams requires everyone else to instantly post follow-up quotes to indicate that they, too, are familiar with the source material. About 65% of all Usenet traffic now consists of such posts. - the Internet Oracle

    4. Re:I wouldn't call it "goo" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bah, it's not that hot. I can eat chicken wings smothered in quark gluon plasma sauce all day long.

    5. Re:I wouldn't call it "goo" by rhkramer · · Score: 1
      Sorry, this is definitely OT. It would be nice (AFAIC) if long URLs were incorporated in the same link

      Hmm, that [reflectionsoldiers.com] thingie is kind of neat and it's automatic.

      To accomplish that, use the following syntax and post as "HTML Formatted". Unfortunately, one problem with posting as HTML Formatted is that you must then use <p \> to create blank lines to separate paragraphs.

      <a href="http://www.reflectionsoldiers.com/forumtest/ viewforum.php?f=2&sid=7ea89aa14629180fff24300e7e87 4225">the same link</a>

      Are there alternate approaches? (Especially to the need to post as HTML Formatted?)

      I'd like to get the word out. If you are so inclined, please spread the word. If you have suggestions on how to spread the word (or anything else), make your comments and suggestions this WikiLearn page.

  7. So particle accelerators are like... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...toast points. I love a nice soft-boiled quark-gluon plasma.

  8. Re:Oh! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm sorry about my previous post there. It seemed funny until I actually saw it posted. Oh well, I guess humor is just not my calling in life.

  9. Hope History Doesn't Give Bush Credit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ok, so we'll have our Lunar Basestation and plasma drives. Sounds good to me. I just hope that Bush doesn't take credit for it.

    1. Re:Hope History Doesn't Give Bush Credit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't worry about that. Bush is already responsible for the liberation of Iraq and the 2003 economic recovery. That's probably enough good stuff for now.

  10. Only lasted 1E-6 seconds? by Asprin · · Score: 2, Funny


    Only lasted 1E-6 seconds?

    Should have used Tupperware(TM)!

    --
    "Lawyers are for sucks."
    - Doug McKenzie
    1. Re:Only lasted 1E-6 seconds? by flewp · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      Damn it. I don't know what it is, but lately the moderators have been retards. I've seen more comments that were funny (or at least, attempting to be funny but didn't deserve to be mod'ed down) modded as offtopic or some such.

      Focus on modding up people. Save your negative mods for the ones that deserve it.

      --
      WWJD.... for a Klondike bar?
    2. Re:Only lasted 1E-6 seconds? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      I understand. Its gotta be really funny for me to give up a mod point for it, as I have yet to find any post here I thought was funny enough to earn one, but I have yet to modslap someone for an honest effort.

      One can post damn near anything, I won't slap em with a bad mod unless I can see without a shadow of a doubt they have no intention of participating in the discussion. I will not mod them redundant - as I read the posts from the bottom up, and its obvious others may too. When theres 500 comments in a forum, its hard to insist everyone has read every single one before making his comment.

      And the time stamps... I often see posts marked redundant posted within minutes of each other. Geez. Someone made an attempt at adding to the discussion and got slapped over a few minutes?

      Those lame attempts at soviet jokes sure push my patience though.

      The only things I have modded down lately are the goatsex and gnaa offtopics and crapfloods. I realize we have a few juveniles onboard, and if the posts they leave get properly flagged, the rest of us won't have to load it too.

      I'm gonna have to post AC here, as I know this post is sooo off-topic. I dont wanna take the hit for the offtopic, I don't wanna lot of people who choose to read at a high level to see this, and I certainly don't want any karma-whore comments from those begrudging me for simply speaking my mind.

      --

      "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good" [ KJV: 1 Thessalonians 5:12 ]

    3. Re:Only lasted 1E-6 seconds? by Monkelectric · · Score: 1
      Damn it. I don't know what it is, but lately the moderators have been retards. I've seen more comments that were funny (or at least, attempting to be funny but didn't deserve to be mod'ed down) modded as offtopic or some such.

      I wont link to their page, but theres a group that is seeking to "lower the SNR of Slashdot" by modding things inappropriately. They recruit people from their website and post lists of messages that need to be modded. Long story short, they mod something Troll when it's insightful, overrated when it's funny, etc... Some people sure have alot of time on their hands

      --

      Religion is a gateway psychosis. -- Dave Foley

  11. Goo? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I know a secret or two about Goo.
    She won't mind if I tell you.

  12. Swallowed by Rademir · · Score: 2, Informative

    Next thing we'll all be swallowed up by a black hole.

    --
    ourpla.net is your planet
    1. Re:Swallowed by jx100 · · Score: 1

      Barenaked Ladies is a bunch of astronomers? I *knew* they were geeks!

  13. I'll be impressed when.... by Creepy+Crawler · · Score: 0, Troll

    I see a simulation of what happened during Plank time.

    --
    1. Re:I'll be impressed when.... by Uma+Thurman · · Score: 2, Funny

      In Planck's time, there were no computers, and playing a first person shooter usually meant a career in the army.

      --
      This is America, damnit. Speak Spanish!
    2. Re:I'll be impressed when.... by Creepy+Crawler · · Score: 1

      Heh heh heh...
      You know what I meant ;-)

      --
  14. The last Ohno-second by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I was more worried about a spontanious phase transition of the vacuume. Destroying the universe from Upton, NY would be something of a downer. I also imagine it would kind of piss God off.

    You don't want to be next in a long line of people walking through the pearly gates only to have St. Peter say, "Not so fast smart-guy. We've got another experiment lined up for you."

  15. Don't worry the republicans will. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    He'll get a head on mount rushmore, and they'll "renovate" the Jefferson Memorial.

    Because if you repeat it enough it becomes true enough.

  16. This stuff is like.. by Uplore · · Score: 0

    some sort of primordeal porridge thats been in the microwave too long... Way too hot. What setting on the microwave takes matter to one trillion degrees?? The mother of all microwaves thats for sure.

    --
    I couldn't think of a sig.
    1. Re:This stuff is like.. by shaitand · · Score: 1

      damn I want one! How long does it take to warm a frozen burrito in that thing! What about a hot pocket?

  17. For future reference... by xankar · · Score: 3, Informative

    NYT online articles can be read via Google News

    for example, here's what came up by searching "big bang goo"

    --
    ~To choose doubt as a philosophy of life is akin to choosing immobility as a means of transportation. -Yann Martel
  18. Yolks Can Roam Free by Muhammar · · Score: 2, Funny

    'cracked open protons and neutons like subatomic eggs to create a primordial form of matter'

    Dumb analogy. Better would be "battered protons and neutrons like subatomic eggs into yolk-eggwhite sludge"

    --
    I doubt that we will ever figure out - and I suspect that even if we did figure out we couldn't do much about it
  19. Re:Oh! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not only that, but the person appologizing for the post is not the original poster.

  20. I know where to buy this stuff... by weeboo0104 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Here's where you can get a LOT of goo in eggs.

    --
    It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men. -Frederick Douglass
  21. Big Bang Goo by slazar · · Score: 0

    Hmm, Big Bang Goo, sounds like a porn I saw once...

    1. Re:Big Bang Goo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hmm, Big Bang Goo, sounds like a porn I saw once...

      I whipped up a batch of my own just this morning. The universe didn't end, but it was a happier place for 30 seconds or so.

  22. I'm wondering... by Lady+Jazzica · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The article says:

    Previous measurements have shown that the lump of material at the center of that collision is from 10 to 100 times as dense as normal nuclear matter. Its temperature is more than a trillion degrees.

    How do they measure things like this?

    1. Re:I'm wondering... by El · · Score: 3, Funny

      They stick there finger in it. "Hey Bob, does this feel like 'over a trillion degrees' to you?" I'm betting they're just guessing, but I'm sure their calculations say it must be "really, really, REALLY hot!"

      --

      "Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney

    2. Re:I'm wondering... by Josh+Booth · · Score: 3, Informative

      They know pretty precisely how fast the particles are moving, since the accelerator has to know these things to be able to accelerate them. Therefore they can calculate how much kinetic energy they have, which is proportional to the temperature. You can also determine the mass from how much energy it has. They can also probably estimate what the size of the blob of stuff is by setting a max on how far a particle can move in that amount of time. From there, you can deterimine density.

    3. Re:I'm wondering... by StickyZebras · · Score: 1

      And this is why after finding the temperature, they put a sticky note that says, "Hot"

  23. MMM gooo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    mmmm gooo...

    ~ HOMER

  24. Soup of the day by Old+Wolf · · Score: 1

    So when is quark-gluon soup going to appear on the menu at the Ritz?

  25. Is this really necessary? by io333 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Is there anyone else out there besides me that gets a bit creeped out by these experiments? The philosopher physicists tell us that it is impossible to know what was "before" the big bang because before it, there was nothing at all. I cry BS. My theory: before the big bang there were some idiots in a different spacial dimention standing around some new quantum experiment gizmo, playing with the fundamental bits of their little universe... BLAM!

    How do we know that we're not spinning off different universes all the time in the different spatial dimentions with these experiments?! What if we're making huge explosions in their universes? What if they're pissed off and know where we are?

    This all smacks to me like shades of Steven King's "The Mist".

    1. Re:Is this really necessary? by Alsee · · Score: 3, Interesting

      How do we know that we're not spinning off different universes all the time in the different spatial dimentions with these experiments?! What if we're making huge explosions in their universes?

      Perhaps, but if so it already happens countless times every day anyway. The Earth's atmosphere (and every object in the universe) is continuously bombarded by cosmic rays - atomic neuclei with orders of magnitude more energy more than we can muster in any accelerator we could build.

      -

      --
      - - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
    2. Re:Is this really necessary? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Is there anyone else out there besides me that gets a bit creeped out by these experiments?

      I read that there is one high energy particle experiment that could destroy our universe : Oops

    3. Re:Is this really necessary? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Is there anyone else out there besides me that gets a bit creeped out by these experiments?

      Yeah... here's an article about accidently destroying the universe: Oops

    4. Re:Is this really necessary? by jasno · · Score: 1

      Interesting... so if that's the case, why not do more subatomic research in space? Couldn't you just use a 'lens' of some sort to pick out ions with certain characteristics and focus a few on a target?

      I know the detectors aren't very light, and therefore expensive to launch, but digging multi-kilometer tunnels lined with magnets isn't cheap either.

      --

      http://www.masturbateforpeace.com/
    5. Re:Is this really necessary? by Alsee · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You're right about the launch costs for the detectors. The detectors are several thousand tons and a fortune to launch, but still probably in a reasonable ballpark for a supercollider. The magnets are about a tousand tons each - possibly deal breaker if you need too many.

      One big problem is that there is no way to get the collisions to occur inside the detectors. The cosmic rays are coming at random from every direction. Any sort of "lens" can only focus stuff coming from a known direction. If the source direction is unknown then you can't focus anything.

      A second big problem is that only a few hundred of the highest energy particles hit all of the earth per day - an enormous target. You could put up a football feild sized detector and wait years to see a single event.

      A third problem is that the collisions will be extremely "unbalanced". In the Brookhaven collider they have two nuclei collide head-on, the speeds cancel out and the resulting fireball is pretty much "parked" in the center of the detector. If a cosmic ray hits a stationary target inside the detector then the resulting fireball will shoot out the back of the detector at nearly the speed of light. This compresses results into a hard to measure cone or jet.

      A fourth lesser problem is that you don't know what particle came in and you don't know how fast it was going. Maybe it was a single insanely fast proton or maybe it was a vastly slower lead nucleus. The data would still be valuable, but it would be a major headache to give it solid meaning.

      Despite all of that, these cosimic rays have still been harnessed do science. There are ground stations that look up at the sky and watch the shower of debris raining down from such events. It gives a pathetic view of the collision itself, but still useful.

      -

      --
      - - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
    6. Re:Is this really necessary? by kwoff · · Score: 1

      If an explosion sufficient to destroy the universe occurred here on Earth, I doubt anyone would be aware of it because we'd be instantly vaporized, so why worry about it?

    7. Re:Is this really necessary? by io333 · · Score: 1

      If an explosion sufficient to destroy the universe occurred here on Earth, I doubt anyone would be aware of it because we'd be instantly vaporized, so why worry about it?

      Just because our universe is zapped, doesn't mean that we are. In fact, what could happen is that the disappearance of our universe means that we are all dropped into another higher dimentioned universe that our current one is floating in. And of course we all know what happens then: SLIME TENTICLE SPIDERS!

    8. Re:Is this really necessary? by jamesh · · Score: 1

      Why would we have to be instantly vaporized? As long as we're plotting out uncharted territory here (eg making stuff up :) then maybe some of this glue doesn't turn back into atoms. Maybe instead it cracks a few more atoms and creates more glue. It could take years. There's a lot of space between atoms!

      Lets worry a little.

  26. Any national lab with a picture of an 8 sided sno by lazy+genes · · Score: 1

    Moving matter faster than the posted speed limit is dangerous.

  27. disappointment by TwistedGreen · · Score: 1

    What... no pictures?

  28. Blasphemy by delirious.net · · Score: 1

    ...to call it univeral goo. Imagine they are right and someone picks up "goo" from slashdot. Our very existance would be initiated by "goo"!! Blasphemy!

    --
    Don't speak about time until you have spoken to him.