Slashdot Mirror
Europe Joins Race To Send Humans To Mars
hereisnowhy writes "CBC reports that the ESA hopes to send humans to Mars within three decades. They first hope to return a Martian soil sample by 2014. They stress the importance of determining whether Mars ever supported life before humans touch down on the surface, because "You can sterilize a robot. But you cannot do the same to an astronaut. Inevitably a human will introduce microbes to the planet ... and contaminate it."" Kame-sennin links to a Reuters article on the plans.
They are still on a decades-long timeline. Here's hoping that The Mars Society can speed that up.
The Spoon
Updated 6/28/2011
Sorry to reply to my own comment, but I found the original.
Whitey on the Moon
By GIL-SCOTT HERON
A rat done bit my sister Nell with Whitey on the moon.
Her face and arms began to swell and Whitey's on the moon.
I can't pay no doctor bills but Whitey's on the moon.
Ten years from now I'll be payin' still while Whitey's on the moon.
The man just upped my rent last night cuz Whitey's on the moon.
No hot water, no toilets, no lights but Whitey's on the moon.
I wonder why he's uppin me. Cuz Whitey's on the moon?
I was already givin' him fifty a week but now Whitey's on the moon.
Taxes takin' my whole damn check,
The junkies makin' me a nervous wreck,
The price of food is goin' up,
And as if all that shit wasn't enough:
A rat done bit my sister Nell with Whitey on the moon.
Her face and arms began to swell but Whitey's on the moon.
Was all that money I made last year for Whitey on the moon?
How come there ain't no money here? Hmm! Whitey's on the moon.
Ya know, I just about had my fill of Whitey on the moon.
I think I'll send these doctor bills
airmail special....
to Whitey on the moon.
We are loaded with bugs. In fact, without Esheria Coli, we would not be able to digest our food. We use bacteria and virus to protect us as well. So there is very little chance of protecting the environment if we have something on the ship.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Anyway, once you're into the suit, you can head out into space/whereever. Of course, the exterior of that suit is probably lousy with contaminants, so that's not such a good idea if you're looking for bacteria or whatnot on the planet.
You could probably use some sort of cleaning solution, but given the ridges and folds, not to mention the binding and connection points on the suit, you'd probably miss some spots or even worse, get liquid that could (perhaps) freeze in a joint or seam. Something like that happening near the helmet or glove attachment point could be very bad news.
Finally, lets not forget that taking enough of those chemicals to sterilize the suit everytime you go out could get both very heavy AND very expensive.
And no, you do not use viruses do not play any role in protecting your body.
Actually, they do. There are viruses that will block other viruses from being able to insert themselves. Likewise, some virus will actually, change protein structures as well as change wether a protein is expressed or not. So yes, there are protective virus.
One thing people seem to forget, GW is a BUSINESSMAN, first and foremost. I don't necessarily agree with all his stunts, but I do know that he knows what he is doing with our money. That $300 tax rebate was supposed to be SPENT. Fucking uppity morons who put that shit in their savings account then made fun of Bush (on TV even, what fools) don't know shit about shit. Man, how annoying that was to see. Grr, I need some tylenol now.
Slashdot is proof that Sturgeon's Law applies to mankind.
So we're already contaminating Mars. There's nothing we can do about it.
Good thing it would be instantly wiped out by the inhospitable Earth conditions. Any life on Mars would be adapted to the Martian environment and extremely ill-suited to other conditions. It would be contending with significant differences in pressure, temperature, air content, and gravity just being on Earth, let alone trying to live in the human body. Sure, life can adapt to an extreme range of conditions. But a bacterium that could overwhelm Earth is not going to evolve on Mars.
We know the suits arent sterile, that's the point, why not sterilize them? Bringing the suits back on would be easy to sterilize, just put the suit in an autoglave and tada..
But before they went out, this might not be so easy. Remember, astronauts are used to working in SPACE. SPACESUITS are massive, bulky, radiation shielded, air conditioned and heated, and many, many, many other things. On Mars, with the presence of gravity, this bulky, massive suit would just be plain useless. Instead, a more sleek body suit might be prefered. Something like a scuba suit here on earth, ribbed with heating and cooling and bio-sensors, and instead of zipping or snapping or locking, make it skintight and put on simply by crawling in. Put on a sterile helmet and air supply. Go through into the outer airlock and go under a quick, high pressure wash, then a longer hair dryer like phase. Step out on the planet relatively germ free. Wanna make even more sure? Use Anti-bacterial substances on area's that wont get washed well such as helmet fasteners, and coupling points. This module could be sent seperately and wouldn't be as uneconomical as you make it sound.
As for the temperatures on Mars, they would have to be well monitored.. during the day it can get really hot, and nights are really cold due to the lack of a dense atmosphere, but if you chose the right time, with a temperature around 100 degrees to 40 degrees, you wouldn't have to worry about freezing, and the heating and cooling in the suit should take care of any astronaut discomfort. Ripping a suit on mars should also see less of a consern as there is an atmophere, and the worse that would happen is a really bad sun burn. What about sand storms? Martian Sandstorms are really high speeds, but where the atmosphere is not dense, they don't have very much force. The worse damage would be the covering of solar cells or helmets or other equipment. The sandstorms shouldnt bother the marinaut; feeling more like freezing rain or at worse, small hail.
It's all about how the suit is designed, but as for cost, you can keep it all low simply by shipping first, arriving and unpacking later. You wouldnt need to resupply if you used an autoglave to do sterilization of instruments, and if you recycled your water supplies right. Antibacterial solution is very potent, so a pill bottle distribution of the equipment, mixed with water, should be able to last a very long time.
"Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is." G.W.Bush
Viruses aren't a normal part of our physiology though...they're not ubiquitous in the human body the way bacteria are. Useful viruses are usually deliberately inserted. (innoculations, virotherapy, and the like)
Things like E. Coli, L. Acidophilous, L. Casei are part of a normal functioning digestive tract for EVERYONE. They compete with pathogens for "real estate" to prevent growth of the baddies in addition to releasing trace amounts of useful chemicals. (though they're mostly wasted since they're in the large intestine)
This message brought to you by the Council of People Who Are Sick of Seeing More People.
Attenuated viruses sensitize your immune system against that specific virus, so that it can effectively defend against future infection FROM THAT SAME VIRUS (or the full strength, unattenuated version).
Both virsues cause damage to your body, and the only reason for innocuation is its better to get sick from the weaker one rather than the stronger one. In no case does it ever help your body.
No known virus performs a postive biological role like the parent poster was implying, IE they are not capable of synthesizing essential compounds or directly preventing colonization of dangerous microbes- bacteria like S.aureus, E.coli, etc are directly required for survival.
Celestial dynamics favor transfer of material from Mars to Earth 60 times over the reverse:
(1) Mars has 1/3rd the gravity and requires 1/9th the impact force;
(2) Mars has 1% the atmosphere (though could have had much more in the distant past);
(3) Mars is much closer to a source of meteors in the asteroid belt.
Also, Mars may have stablised geologically a couple hundred million years before the larger Earth did. It appears that life can arise in less than this time. Mars also died geologically much earlier than Earth too.
Its likely there is only one chemistry of life in the solar system due to the high interplanetary infection probability. There could have been thousands of rocks sent from Mars to Earth over the billions of years, considering we've found 18 Mars meteors on Earth without looking too hard. Other places for life uch as the warmer cloud layers of Jupiter and the oceans of Europa and Titan could have been infected too over the eons.