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Good Demo System For A High-Bandwidth Link?

Posted by simoniker on from the zoomity-zoom dept.

FuzzyDaddy writes "My company is planning on demonstrating a 2.5 Gigabit per second link to some potential customers in the next few months. Now, we have all the equipment needed to measure how well the link is performing, but we'd like to put together a cheap 'Gee Whiz' demonstration. Surely other /.'ers have put together similar demos in the past. What combination of computers, network adapters, and software have you used to demonstrate high data rate links to potential customers?"

33 of 471 comments (clear)

  1. Easy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Just take them to

    http://www.apple.com/trailers

    They'll love it.

  2. Relate in DVDs by chrispl · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Download a dozen DVD movies at once and have them all display in real time? That would LOOK impressive at least.

    --
    What post? The one you're carrying inside your rusty innards!
  3. If even you don't know what it's good for by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    then you may as well quit selling it. The fact is people who need that sort of performance come looking for it, everyone else can get by fine on 100Mb.

    1. Re:If even you don't know what it's good for by keller · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Judging by the post, I think he knows purposes, but would like something that he can show the nontechies/management type people, and they go "WOW! Get me 10 of these highspeed thingies..." and the people who really needs it gets the equipment!

      --

      Enig? Det alt for hot det smor!

    2. Re:If even you don't know what it's good for by chrismear · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The problem with trying to impress the non-techy types is that they usually have a very poor idea of what is achievable using standard technology. I know that in the past when I have showed off my high-speed college internet connection to such people by, for instance, streaming video, the usual response is along the lines of, "So what? My TV can do that."

      Unless you know something about how data-intensive digital video is, and have experience with the usual video quality achievable over the internet, a simple 'streaming video' demo, even if it is multiple streams at ridiculous quality, has the potential to bomb.

      IMHO.

      Having said all that, this was a few years ago, so maybe the average person these days has a better idea about how hard video is over networks. But given the technical knowledge of the average internet user, I would not hold my breath.

    3. Re:If even you don't know what it's good for by Tango42 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      These are the managers, not the techies. Do you really expect them to understand the numbers?

    4. Re:If even you don't know what it's good for by Tango42 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That would be logical, but since when has logic had anything to do with standard business practice?

    5. Re:If even you don't know what it's good for by KilobyteKnight · · Score: 5, Insightful

      These are the managers, not the techies. Do you really expect them to understand the numbers?

      Maybe I'm old fashioned, but yes, yes I do expect managers to understand what they manage.

      If they don't, fire them.

      --
      When will Windows be ready for the desktop?
    6. Re:If even you don't know what it's good for by ghjm · · Score: 2, Insightful

      There are three kinds of people in business.

      1. People who don't have a boss, because they are the boss.
      2. People who are a boss, but also have a boss.
      3. People who work for living, and have a boss.

      Usually, the term "manager" describes Type 2. These people can be fired by either Type 1 people, or bigger Type 2 people. Note that Type 1 people still have constraints on their ability to act; they may be overseen by a board of directors, or answerable to major customers - when I say they don't have a boss, I only mean that there is no individual person who tells them what to do.

      Interestingly, Type 3 people can be evaluated on the merits of the contribution they actually make through their work (e.g. how many widgets they assembled or calls they took). Type 3 people are also protected by employment law. As a result, it is very difficult to fire a Type 3 person with a strong work record.

      Type 2 people, who are exempted from most of the protections of employment law, are much easier to fire. This makes them very vulnerable to any Type 3 person who finds a way to talk directly to Type 1 people. No-one likes to be vulnerable, so Type 2 people spend a lot of energy finding ways to strengthen their positions.

      There are two ways to do this. The first is to have technical skill beyond the capability of any Type 3 person. If the Type 2 person is very smart or competent, or started as a Type 3 person in the same field, this might come naturally. If not, then it can be simulated by manipulation of the methods of delivery for knowledge and training.

      The second way is to create various kinds of barriers that prevent the undesired outcome. For example, many Type 2 people jealously guard access to the Type 1 people, to make sure that no Type 3 person could ever voice a negative opinion. Many Type 2 people also keep a file (perhaps a mental one) on all the Type 3 people in their circle, so that they can (a) undermine their credibility if they ever actually talk to the Type 1 people, and (b) justify firing them if they become too much of a threat.

      Type 2 people who use the second method are referred to as "professional managers." Many of the current ills of society are frequently attributed to the rise of a professional management class, even though cluelessness at the higher ranks surely dates back at least to Roman times.

      -Graham

    7. Re:If even you don't know what it's good for by spazoid12 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Judging from the post... it seems to me that he might just as well have asked:

      We invented a product without a purpose, please help us think of a purpose.

    8. Re:If even you don't know what it's good for by bofkentucky · · Score: 2, Insightful

      32,256 DS0's to a OC-48, those are uncompressed raw 64kbs voice channels, but finding (and constructing) sound file with 32,000 voices trampling all over each other is going to be tough.

      --
      09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
  4. Use PCI-X by robbyjo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Use PCI-X based cards to minimize CPU utilization. And of course, you should put a decent memory (fast and big enough) if you decide to buffer the transfer -- maybe a PC4000 512MB RAM. Then, if you decide to save the transfer or for the sending part, use a SCSI or SATA based HDD. Everything else can be el-cheapo based, IMHO. You can put a low-end CPU if the CPU utilization is low enough and then boast it in the demo. ;)

    For the obvious, make sure you run OS with minimal background processes to reduce CPU overhead. IMHO http-based transfer works wonder for clients interested in "real-world" application.

    --

    --
    Error 500: Internal sig error
    1. Re:Use PCI-X by Shinobi · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Having recently done some research on various high-end bus and network technologies, I'd say go with PCI Express instead. PCI-X still has CPU issues, especially if you combine it with TCP.
      PCI-X also has the problem of being half-duplex.

      Most impressive of the bunch though was Infiniband and 3GIO, which can be implemented from the north bridge straight out to devices several km away, via fiber-optic cables.

  5. Talk to marketing by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I wouldn't know about computers and network cards and such, but as for what software to use: ask the marketing department (if you have one)!

    If you can find out why your customers would need a 2,5Ghz link, and find the software that would demonstrate that your offering meets that need, you'll have no trouble selling it to them.

    --
    If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    1. Re:Talk to marketing by AdamTheBastard · · Score: 5, Insightful

      An extension to this would be to actully find out what the potential customers user their LAN/WAN for. Find out what kinda company they are. Find any software they are using, check if it saturates your pipe. If it does then show them how much faster it your network does the job compaired to others. If it doesn't saturate your pipe find a program that does the same thing and can use the bandwidth you are offering and suggest it to them. Be kinda and helpfull, do some reaserch into other products that can help them. People LOVE graphs. Give them a graph that shows the speed of your pipe vs the speed of 'other techs'. Show them a graph of the time it takes to do task X on your system vs everyone else.

  6. Re:1 terabyte backup to remote site in 7 mins.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Now that's a good idea. I wonder what they are actually using it for though, surely it would be best to demo whatever the eventual utility would be?

  7. Re:Can't go wrong with video by Frekko · · Score: 2, Insightful

    You'd have to show MANY DVD's at the same time to show the potential of a link like this. I'd rather copy the whole DVD over the link to show the speed.

  8. Gee Whiz? Gee, don't by orthogonal · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Now, we have all the equipment needed to measure how well the link is performing, but we'd like to put together a cheap 'Gee Whiz' demonstration.

    Speaking for myself, any additional "Gee Whizzery" would at best distract me from your take-home point -- that your network is really fast.

    At worst, it would make me wonder why you were trying to distract me, and what you might be hiding, glossing over, or leaving for the fine print.

    Now, there are a few things that you could do to make a more effective presentation. Despite years in the business, I still sometimes have a hard time grasping the size of Gigabytes, or remembering how Gigabytes compare to Mebibytes (that's not a misspelling; I'd include a link if I weren't typing on my handheld) to kilobits. I guess that.s why ls and df have a -h switch.

    A nice chart showing your speed and bandwidth in terms of Tom Clancy novels per minute, or (umcompressed) Wagner operas per hour, would tend to bring those numbers home.

    And for the suspicious, so would demonstrating downloads against encrypted and uncompressable data, so no one has to wonder how much of your speed came from on the fly adaptive Huffman encoding.

    Basically, if what you're selling is speed and bandwidth, demonstrate that. Saavy customers aren't going to be swayed by booth girls or Barney the Dinosaur, and saavy customers won't want to waste time on that. If you're still aching to spend money, have a nice lunch delivered during the demo (after you've asked your customers about any dietary restrictions they have).

    --
    Opinions on the Twiddler2 hand-held keyboard?
  9. Target demo to their application by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Although I'm not a salesperson, I can give you this advice:

    Someone in need of such a high speed connection will want it for some reason/application.

    1. Find out what that application is.
    2. Find out how they measure the performance of you product for their application. They will have some Key Performance Indicators for it.
    3. Make a demo that shows the strengths of your product for _that_ application (include their jargon and KPIs)
    4. Try to make it visually appealing (this might include additional streaming videos or book download counters as suggested by others here to insert a 'fun factor'. Who says demos need to be boring?).

    Know who is coming to listen to / look at your demo. Techies will look for different KPIs than managers. Don't think what will impress you, think what will impress them.

    Good luck

  10. Zigacktly by squaretorus · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If I've asked you to demo the link because I want to ship out data to my 250 locations in real time rather than overnight, or some other PITA time show me the link talking to >100 locations at once. Even if you're just sending through an arbritary file make sure its of the same order as the data they need to shift.

    Show me that you understand what I need, I already assume you know what you have to sell. I need convincing that you know how to keep me happy.

    And you can't assume I have ANY idea how much data is involved in sending HDTV or any other 'consumery' signal. I'd avoid TV as a demo at all costs! If my cable hookup and FREE set top box can handle it wtf does your big connection cost so much for???

  11. Forget video... by Tweaker_Phreaker · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Most businesses won't give a damn about video streaming, especially when it's possible with a 10 Mbps link - you should avoid even mentioning video unless they want to know about teleconferencing. You've got to provide them with reasons why they NEED that fast of a connection. A few obvious things are:
    1) Connecting multiple offices together (with many hosts) so they can work in harmony instead of waiting hours to finish transfering something and playing solitaire while they wait.
    2) Providing access to (a) storage area network(s) which could be used to store all their backups which eliminates the hassle of using tapes.
    3) Connecting a HUGE number of hosts together with a few routers and tons of switches.
    4) Providing room to grow.
    If you can't demonstrate many hosts utilizing the link simultaneously, the next best thing would be to show one host transfering a backup of the OS or a large database. Just be sure that the computers you use have hard drives (RAID's if you're only using one host on each end) that are fast enough to keep up with the link.

  12. Re:full frame uncompressed high definition video by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    The problem is, you can say that it's uncompressed, but it doesn't look much different from compressed. In a demo, perception is everything.

  13. Re:Can't go wrong with video by Ewan · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What hard drive has the bandwidth to run at 2.5Gbits a second? Ultrascsi320 disks don't, Fibrechannel arrays can have connectors that are 2Gb, but they still have invidual disks which are much slower, just with a large RAM cache to provide the bursting speed.

    Ewan

  14. No data found by BrK · · Score: 5, Insightful

    There isn't enough data in your post to suggest *anything*.

    Is this a wireless link? Is it a LAN type segment? A campus/MAN type segment? Is it copper? Is it fiber? Is it cheaper than OC-48 (which is also a 2.4Gbps link, and has been in use for many years now)?

    What is your customer base? Anyone with money? Fortune 500(0)(0)(0)? Universities? Office Parks?

    This is like saying "I have a car, where should I drive it", without mentioning that your car is a Mini Cooper and you are on the island of Nevis.

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    -This sig intentionally left blank
  15. This will probably get modded troll or something.. by bl1st3r · · Score: 2, Insightful

    but I'll post with my name anyway. I'm not afraid.

    It appears to me that if you are asking slashdot how you can best use a connection this fast, you should probably quit your job and give it to someone else who would appreciate it more. The list of things I could show with a connection like this are just pure ownage, and even clients without a vag would find themselves getting wet. Metaphorically speaking of course.

    You sir, are the troll for asking a question like this on Slashdot.

    --
    hrrm.
  16. @2.5Gb/s the bottleneck isn't the network... by Junior+J.+Junior+III · · Score: 5, Insightful

    it's the system. If you're going to hook up a 2-node network for demo purposes, you'll be bottlenecked by the storage devices on the computers well before you can show what the network pipe is really capable of.

    The only things I can think of inside a computer that can sustain 2.5Gb/s throughput are the front side bus and the AGP slot, assuming you have 4x or better on the AGP. If you're transmitting data, it has to come from somewhere, though, and unless you've got a VERY sizeable RAMdisk on hand, you're not going to impress people with moving files from one place to another -- you'll saturate the drive(s) the data is stored on well before you hit the capacity of the pipe.

    2.5Gb/s is good for network backbones right now, and not much else. Well, it's great for anything involving data tranfer, obviously, but it's also overkill and therefore probably costs too much, and therefore not so great. But the performance, certainly, sings.

    My best advice? Come up with some kind of network oriented demo that involves a many-node network, the nodes each equipped with very fast UltraSCSI 320 RAID-0 arrays so they can try to saturate the pipe.

    --
    You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
  17. Re:Can't go wrong with video by MooCows · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Also you can repeaditly stream a text version of War and Peace or some other lengthy book, with a counter on the recieving end showing how many times you have downloaded it. Keep a copy of the print edition on the table to show them what is comming down as the counter ticks away.

    That's the first good idea I've seen to impress non-techies :)
    Imagine them looking at a counter going up insanely fast with such a huge book next to the monitor.

    --
    The path I walk alone is endlessly long.
    30 minutes by bike, 15 by bus.
  18. what turns your customers on ? by sir_cello · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I can't believe that in all the commentary so far that someone hasn't suggested you tie it to the customer's business interests/needs ? Are we all a bunch of technical engineers that don't know anything about commercial realities ? What kind of business are your customers in, and what kind of applications are important to them ? Is it sending large JPEG images to production houses ? Is it delivering software releases ? Is it video conferencing ? For all of the technical wizardly, all I can see is a lot of commercial ineptitude!

  19. How about... by michrech · · Score: 3, Insightful

    How about *gasp* finding out what your potential customers are wanting to do with such a huge link and doing your best to simulate what they will be doing?

    I dunno... Just may work!

    --
    bork bork bork!
  20. Might be a CPU bottleneck, but... by swb · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ..this idea, coupled with the "time warp" of another post would be a great idea, especially if you could manage to display HD video.

    Start out with what video on the internet looked like back using dialup in 1995 -- postage-stamp sized 8 bit windows running at 8-10 fps with out-of-sync 8Khz mono audio. Move slowly up the resolution and link speed until you get to "today's streaming video", but still displaying only one window of video. During this time, keep the display at something smaller, like 800x600 on a larger display; partly to magnify the pixelization of older/slower video, partly for greater wow factor later on.

    At this point, you start talking about your link and you switch the video feed to HD full screen. "And that's not all...." -- switch the display to max resolution (2048 x 1536?), and start adding HD feeds until you've tiled the screen with HD feeds. Keep adding them until you have so many on the screen that they're hard to see or you really have maxed out the pipe.

    This is something that ordinary people can grasp; the challenge will be a computer with video display capable of displaying dozens of simultaneous HD feeds, but it will look really cool, especially if you keep the sound going on each station and gradually increase the volume as you add channels for dramatic impact.

  21. Re:Streaming and booting. by hamsterboy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Good idea, but this might backfire. The DVD should run just fine; an "uncompressed" DVD A/V stream is specced at only 20Mb of bandwidth.

    The remote booting will bottleneck in local storage before you even get close to 2.5Gb throughput.

    -- Hamster

  22. Re:dumb question by glesga_kiss · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Hot grits according to everything2: Hot grits

    Hmm, the only post that offers any realistic answer and it gets modded down. Good news, I guess the crack shipment is in...

    Does anyone know the answer to this, or is everyone pretending to find an "in-joke" funny when they really don't have a clue? As the parent parent asked:

    WTF has "Hot Grits" got to do with Natalie Portman?

    If no one knows, the joke should be banned from Slashdot. ;-) It's as bad as using an acronym for something you don't know what it is.

  23. Re:Can't go wrong with video by kauschovar · · Score: 2, Insightful

    That is a really really good idea. Might want to figure ahead of time how many copies you expect to download, then calculate how much space that many hardcopies would take up. People are impressed by big numbers like that.

    "Enough copies to go around the equator."

    Or maybe from here to the moon, or enough copies to cover the land area of Alaska, or Russia.

    We've all heard sayings like those before. That's because they're effective.