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The Subtle Tyranny Of Spreadsheets

pipingguy writes "I found this link on a CAD-related mailing list which questioned the current state of spreadsheet usage. Since using spreadsheets is often only one step away from PowerPoint mastery, I thought it worthy of submission." An excerpt: "The second distortion caused by conventional spreadsheets is more subtle. It's described in a 1980s paper, written by university researcher Jeffrey Kottemann and others concerning what they called 'Performance, Beliefs, and the Illusion of Control.' The paper described an experiment in which subjects were asked to perform a planning task using different tools, some of them with elaborate what-if capability and others without it." Yup, it's a ZD/Yahoo link, but it raises good questions."

11 of 554 comments (clear)

  1. A better article on the same point... by Singletoned · · Score: 4, Informative
    "When you're holding Excel, everything looks like a spreadsheet" by Yoz Grahame

    I particularly enjoyed it, and it made me wonder why I've always hated Excel. maybe it's time to forgive...

    (I always used to like Pipdream on the Archimedes though. That was a combined spreadsheet and word processor).

  2. Excel isn't a DB! It's a FS! by beacher · · Score: 3, Informative

    To anyone that has Excel '97 - On a new Worksheet, Press F5. Type X97:L97 and hit enter. Press the tab key. Hold Ctrl-Shift. Click on the Chart Wizard toolbar button. Use mouse to fly around - Right button forward/ Left button reverse.

    Excel 2000? Under file menu, do 'Save as Web Page'. Say 'Publish Sheet' and 'Add Interactivity'. Save to some htm page on your drive. Load the htm page with IE (don't give me any grief over this one- you're already screwing around with Excel so I don't want to hear it ). You should have Excel in the middle of the page. Scroll to row 2000, column WC. Select row 2000, and tab so that WC is the active column. Hold down Shift+Crtl+Alt nad click the Office logo in the upper-left. If you have DirectX, you will be playing what looks like spy hunter. Use the arrow keys to drive, space to fire, O to drop oil slicks, and when it gets dark, use H for your headlights. -B

  3. Re:The cost of everything by misterpies · · Score: 3, Informative


    'Fraid your friend's not very original. The original quote is from Oscar Wilde: "a cynic is a man who knows the cost of everything and the value of nothing"(

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    The author of this post asserts his moral rights.
  4. Re:The question does not deserve mod pts, but answ by misterpies · · Score: 3, Informative

    >> And what the *fsck* does it mean, even if the data has a Gaussian distribution?

    that's what wikipedia is for :)

    it's a measure of the width of the distribution. Given a gaussian distribution, a random measurement will occur within one standard deviation of the mean with a probability of around 68%. Or to put it the other way round, if you have data and are trying to calculate the distribution, there's about a 68% chance that the true value of the mean falls within 1 s.d. of the value you calculated.

    If you don't have a gaussian distribution, you can still calculate a standard deviation but it will not have the same meaning with respect to the probability of you having got the right mean.

    This is of particular relevance to spreadsheets, since they're often used to do calculations on financial data such as stock prices and most financial data is not gaussian--it's 'log normal', meaning that the logarithm of the data values are gaussian, but not the data itself. So most people doing standard deviation calculations on such data are probably completely misinterpreting the results...

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    The author of this post asserts his moral rights.
  5. "Powerpoint Mastery" by foobsr · · Score: 4, Informative

    Since using spreadsheets is often only one step away from PowerPoint mastery.

    Erm .. for "Powerpoint Mastery" have a look at Tufte "The Cognitive Style of PowerPoint".

    Yes, I know it was discussed here before (as I guess), but still - it is worth a mention.

    CC.

    --
    TaijiQuan (Huang, 5 loosenings)
  6. Why not to use Excel as a DB by linuxtelephony · · Score: 4, Informative

    One of the biggest reasons is the sort function combined with [l]user error.

    If a spreadsheet has more columns that fit on the screen, and is used by more than one person, at some point you can almost count on someone highlighting some, not all, of the columns and then sorting the highlighted columns, and saving the file. When that happens, the highlighted columns are sorted, the rest are left as is. Worst, the next person to use the file doesn't always realize the corruption has occurred.

    This was a problem in Office 97 and earlier. I think it was a problem in Office 2k, but I don't remember. I have not tested this on Office XP or 2003.

    --
    . 62,400 repetitions make one truth -- Brave New World, Aldous Huxley
  7. Re:please everybody by ChiaBen · · Score: 5, Informative

    You shouldn't be forced to use SQL for manipulating data, you should be restrained from using Excel. ;) The reality of the differences between a spreadsheet and a database is that a spreadsheet lacks the data constraints (relationships) necessary to keep a user from entering bad data. A database can control this (data integrity) to a large degree (depending on your datamodel design).

    An example I fight with daily is product attributes. I maintain a n ecommerce database with about 180,000 products, each of which would have, say, a color. The problem is that if I import data from a spreadsheet it might randomly insert spaces in the data (i.e. "Black " or " Black" instead of "Black"), whereas if I get the data entered through our tools, the user selects from a list of colors, and only if the choice doesn't exist do they add a new one.

    You mention how people are doing a knee-jerk that 'DB's are sacred'. Yes, they are. So are spreadsheets, the problem is that people bastard-ize their use and end up confused about why they both exist, and how to use them.

    Database = Data storage, data consistency, ease of data maintenance
    Spreadsheet = Data analysis, data redundancy, lack of data integrity.

    That's how I see it, anyhow.

    --
    "If voting could really change things, it would be illegal. " - Revolution Books, NY
  8. Re:please everybody by morelife · · Score: 4, Informative

    I use Excel constantly to do layouts for invoices, estimates, cards, presentation, etc. because of the precise sizing control. It looks professional, not cheesy at all, some of the stuff looks like it came from a printer.

    As for the database aspect, Excel is well suited for a database table layout, that's one of it's principal uses. Not a relational database, but just simple tables, it great at. There's no reason you couldn't have an address book with hundreds of entries and a dialog box front end made with macros. I did this in the past, worked great.

  9. Re:Spreadsheets are the worst sort of hack program by MrWa · · Score: 3, Informative
    Some minor points:

    - Cryptic names for fields
    How is this "stamped out in programming languages" other than convention and training? Is is forced on you?
    - No comments
    Excel can "comment" to some extent.
    - No obvious flow of control
    Some would argue that the freeform nature of a spreadsheet is what makes it so appealing.
    - No modularisation
    - No capability to test spreadsheet sub-components in isolation
    - No capability to do a diff to see what's changed between versions

    Excel can keep track of every change made - didn't we just have an article making fun of Microsoft for this feature in Word?!

    Not saying the spreadsheets, or Excel specifically, is the answer to everything.

  10. Re:please everybody by generic-man · · Score: 4, Informative

    PDFCreator gives you "print to PDF" capability in Windows. It's free software.

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    For more information, click here.
  11. Re:The underlying problem... by mst76 · · Score: 4, Informative
    Do you really know what the standard deviation is? For example, you know that most standard tools for calculating standard deviation it assume the data has a Gaussian distribution. But what if your data poisson distributed, or hypergeometric, or maxwell-boltzmann... [...]
    That is not correct. The standard deviation of a random variable is the square root of its variance. The variance is the squared expectation of the centralized variable (variable minus its mean). Calculating the variance of a random variable involves integrating (or summing) the probability density function p(x) times x^2. If it's a well known distribution, one would usually look it up in a book, or try to solve the sum or integral (by hand or with Maple or Mathematica). Note that the only thing you need to calculate the standard deviation is the distribution or density function, no actual data is involved.

    The things listed as mean and standard deviation in Excel are sample means and sample standard deviations. If you have a list of numbers, and you assume that they were drawn from some distribution with finite expectation and variance, you can calculate the sample mean (simple average), which is an estimate of the expectation. Then you substract this mean from all your numbers and take their squares. The average of that is an estimate of the variance of the distribution, take the square root for the standard deviation. The nice thing is that these estimates converge to the expectation and variance regardless of distribution. If you do make the additional assumption of Gaussianity, you can also say something about the rate of convergence and the distribution of the estimate. But the basic formulas in Excel and such for sample mean and variance work for any distribution that has a mean and variance.