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New South Wales Traffic Authority Switches to Macs
MacGyver writes ""In what may well be Apple Computer's largest coup in the Australian enterprise space, the New South Wales Roads and Traffic Authority (RTA) will deploy 1200 G4 iMacs across 140 registry offices." This isn't just a Mac story: the RTA statement noted, "The Apple rollout is a continuation of RTA usage of open standards-based software and systems. The further adoption of open source is being undertaken to provide more choice of vendors and to guarantee RTA systems are providing value for money."
thats like saying your moving from california to idaho for a better selection of produce.
--Idiots, Every single one of YOU, A flaming mass of conglomerated morons, hey wait a second, isnt that how RAID works?
they do control the hardware, but all the parts in there are standard peices of hardware. It isn't so much the hardware that they are worried about, it is the software. OS X is pretty damn nice to open-standards and the hardware is nice. They still can go with a linux/bsd solution, such at a time when the latest Mac OS won't run on the machines properly they can load up Linux etc.
Jisho - A Japanese English German Russian French Dictionary for the rest of us.
Granted, but it's either stick with OS-X and be restricted to a much smaller subset of hardware they can choose from, or switch to Linux/*BSD and realize that Mac hardware *is* standard, and not exactly cheap.
Mac's prices are based on the fact that you have a stable system because, again, they control the hardware. If their goal was truely as stated, buying 'off-the-shelf' parts and installing Linux/*BSD would be just as effective and far cheaper...
"If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living."
- Seneca
This isn't just a Mac story: The further adoption of open source is being undertaken
:P
The irony here is, there wouldn't be a mac/apple story if it weren't for Apple having gone to OS X and a more open software philosophy. It looks like, were it not for open source, much of the revitalization that Apple has undergone in the wake of OS X would not have occured, and "Apple is dying!" would be all over slashdot - as it as prior to OS X. Haven't seen those trolls for a while, so maybe it's telling.
Of course, now there'll be 15 replies with, "Apple is dying!" or "BSD is dying!" or such, just to spite me.
~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
My guess why they went for Apple is probably because Darwin is bassed on BSD and the source is available. It may not be open in the sence that Linux is but it is more open then Microsoft ever will be.
Also, with Apple meing a majoe vendor they have a certain sence of security when it coemes to future support. Apple have a better chance of sticking around than some shop making custom Linux boxes
That's all old Apple stuff. The new Macs use standard memory, IDE drives, USB keyboards and mice. They've bellied up to the Wintel hardware base, just like Sun has.
You're right about most of your other points, but don't hold the ancient history of deliberately closed hardware at Apple against them in this day and age.
resigned
MacOS X isn't based on FreeBSD.
They ported in a FreeBSD userland to provide the core userland. They planted it on top of a Mach kernel based on NextOS, a proprietary closed-source OS. They piled on top a GUI layer that is closed source.
Saying MacOS is 'based on FreeBSD' is like claiming a Windows 2000 machine is 'based on GTK' because you installed the Win32 port of the gimp on it.
resigned
Actually, this is pretty important. Governmental departments are notoriously slow to change. This shows that governments are slowing giving MS/Windows alternatives a chance, which is extremely positive. Sure, they may not have gone with Linux (the fact that Mac OS X runs MS Office natively probably makes it easy for them to transition to the new platform), but this shows that alternative OS's are slowly gaining traction. Furthermore, Australia is very Microsoft-centric. I was surprised by the prevalence of MS technology there. And the fact that an Aussie governmental department would go with Apple highlights that alternative OS's may have a chance after all.
-B
I don't see the value in using 1200 Macintoshes for simple data entry applications which could be accomplished by dumb terminals. Nothing against Apple or the Macintosh, but this is like replacing the Fords and Chevys at the public works with 1200 brand new Mercedes-Benzes.
"Yeah, but who's gonna FLY it, kid?"
Stability is a tricky thing - just like vendor relationships. Apple knows their hardware as well as their software. Whenever I hear the word, "Custom", as it relates to a large project like this, I cringe.
Does 'Custom' mean that you never have to:
- Patch it?
- Update various included software?
- Include new hardware support?
Of course not! Even if you're not paying for the software, you're going to have pay for the support for the software - however you figure it. Just ask IBM - that's their new business model. Think their customers are getting off any cheaper than Apple's? Don't bet on it.
"...Well, there's egg and bacon; egg sausage and bacon; egg and spam; egg bacon and spam; egg bacon sausage and spam..."
If their data is cross-platform, then it doesn't matter if they are using Macs, Linux or glorified iPods..they are not "locked in" to a particular vendor.
So why choose Macs? Maybe for them it was a lower TOC. Maybe for them it is easier to get a locked down system for iMacs. Maybe they just want their offices to look nicer? Who knows..maybe the question was answered in the article...
I come from a LAN down under
Where the packets flow and routers chunder
Going with Apple gives them the ability to run OSS software on top of a supported, performant, supported, off the shelf platform. It reduces the risk and is therefore a good thing from a taxpayers point of view.
The cheaper hardware isn't a big deal here either. As a government agency they would have to go with a big supplier, one that's going to be able to supply and support them and has a track record of doing so. When you are dealing with these volumes I would guess that the Apple kit won't come in much more expensive than say Dell or HP etc.
You may think me a tired, old, cynic. I'd have to disagree about the tired bit.
Um HELLO!!!! (I copied that bit off your post)...proprietary computers don't cause lock in....proprietary data formats do. If the data is OS/hardware agnostic, it hardly matters what hardware they use on the desktop.
If using Macs helps with that transition (remember they probably need MS Office) then lucky Apple - they make a sale.
I come from a LAN down under
Where the packets flow and routers chunder
Whilst I like the idea of using Macs, somehow I think that considering the intended use of them, this is an ideal situation in which to deploy x-terms. The article says that they already use Sun gear, so why not roll-out a load of Sunrays? - They'd use less power and last longer because they have no moving parts.
That being said, the Macs are a better choice when compared to PC's... they might be a bit more expensive up front, but the build quality is excellent and people find them easier to use, so the cost of maintaining and supporting them is going to be lower.
One of the interesting things in the article is that they can use the swivel mount to show people their license photos easily. Pretty nifty.
Of course, I have no idea about why they made the decision because I don't work there - I also live across the border in SA.
Don't say cheaper. You have to hire people to put the systems together, image the drives, maintain the computers (oh, shit. no warrantee), the nerd you'd need to configure linux or BSD in an enterprise solution.... That sounds like both less effective and, in the long run, more expensive.
Don't worry - its just stigmata. Pass me a napkin and don't you dare tell my mother.
Also, since when does off the shelf hardware not have a warranty?
Seriously, something like this is planned, they can buy in bulk and it is most definitely less expensive both in the short term and long term. There is no comparison on price so find another point to argueOff the shelf does have individual warranties, but not for the unit as a whole. YOu want to add the beurocracy of dealing with even more companies to a government department? Increased time spent getting shit fixed is money - someone has to deal with it.And those support agreements are available - i never denied they were - but thats an added cost over the hardware (and assuming the software is free). Macs also tend to preserve their value for signifigantly longer than x86 boxen. iMacs have lower profile/cost of most available boxes, have an ergonomic LCD, etc. You save space, blah blah blah. If you're going to come up with conclusions, at least give us the benefit of making up some numbers.
Don't worry - its just stigmata. Pass me a napkin and don't you dare tell my mother.
Also, I can buy hdds in units of 50-500, even 1000 no problem. I am covered under an enterprise warranty. If a drive goes bad I ship it off to Maxtor or whoever I choose to go with after learning the environment they will live. Its not different from any other setting where you buy the computer whole. You're argument over space is irrelevent as well since there are both monitors and cases designed to be like Macs. If you assume the software is free and the computers themselves cost less then where do you figure Macs cost less in any run. Seriously, the argument has been made they use the same types of components so how would a new G4 or G5 hold its value compared to a normal PC? It won't, Apple gave that up when they stopped using scsi in all their machines.
As for numbers on the support agreements, they would be useless since such a thing would rely on information I don't have, such as, do they want the support team to manage the hardware as well? Do they want the support team to ensure upgrades are done when a new product is available? Depending on their needs the price will change a lot. But its still a hell of a lot less than the cost of a support call to Apple.
It should come as no surprise that a lot of posts are in the vein of "they should have used xxx instead of Apple, because Apple is proprietary/expensive/..."
Which shows a lot of people who shout RTFM all day are above RTFA. I think it's pretty cool to see macs deployed in open source situations. Best of two worlds and such...
The funniest posts of course are in the vein of "they should of called my cousin Ned" (translated from "build yourself").
Which shows a lot of people don't know what "Cost" and "Cost of ownership" and associated factors are.
Even with Apple's recent track record, I doubt self-built kits will outlive a bunch of macs without blowing some fuses and minds, but whatever.
I think the appropriate response to Apple and NSW TA would be "Good on ye, mate!"
I think, therefore I am...I think.