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GrokDoc Goes Live; All GNU/Linux Newbies Welcome

An anonymous reader writes "Writing at LinuxWorld, Groklaw's PJ asks "What Do Newbies Need to Make the Switch to GNU/Linux? and invites the world - literally - to help with answering the question, by participating in the wiki she and some colleagues have just launched. GrokDoc aims to turn the usual process on its head: "Instead of experts telling newbies how to do things, we will let newbies show and tell us what they need." Might be a fantastic way to help push Linux still further toward that fabled tipping-point."

6 of 504 comments (clear)

  1. Re:WM? by stevey · · Score: 5, Informative

    You can do far worse than pointing people at The Linux Cookbook.

    This is something that is task orientated which seems to make lots of newcomers to Linux (but not computers)

  2. Re:I Disagree by Elecore · · Score: 5, Informative

    I've gone through a few different distros the past year, and I must say that so far, the Gentoo handbook is the best manual for linux I've ever read. They show you exactly what to type, and where, as well as telling you WHY you're typing it. I learned a lot about linux simply by installing and troubleshooting Gentoo.

  3. Knoppix can be as usable as Windows by WarmBoota · · Score: 5, Informative

    Recently, when my hard drive borked, I had to resort to using Knoppix to check my email, et cetera while waiting for the spare time to get things working again.

    With a Knoppix CD, I could:

    • instantly boot into Linux (look Ma, no install!)
    • Access my USB Memory stick
    • Create a word processing document
    • Print to an HP Inkjet (the configuration was actually less painful than the Windows procedure which dumped hundreds of megs of junk on my hard drive)
    • Access web-based email with Mozilla

    Now this was incredibly usable to me since I am familiar with Linux in the first place. There are only a few places where things fall apart.

    1. Knoppix can be installed to the hard drive, but typing "knoppix-install-hd" at a root prompt isn't the most discoverable interface.
    2. I know that k3b burns CDs and Mozilla is used for the Web. Until Linux applications have brand-name recognition of things like QuarkExpress or Excel, I think that application names need to be more descriptive, or some other mechanism is required for users to discover the application purpose. KDE is pretty good with sorting applications into Internet and Graphics folders, but it could be done better. I wouldn't find a hand-holding introduction useful, but others might.
    3. I was able to use konqueror to browse a Windows network, but again, this is only because I knew that I could type smb://ipadress/share.

    I think that the Harmony Remote concept would be useful for Linux Configuration. For those too lazy to Google for it, the concept is this:

    1. Answer some questions on the devices that you actually have (e.g. Do you have a TV, Stereo Recevier, DVD Player, etc).
    2. Identify the model numbers (I know that this is a stretch for basic users, but bear with me).
    3. Answer some questions about how you want things to work. (e.g. Do you control the DVD volume with the TV or with the Receiver).
    4. Once that's complete, activities appropriate for each device are created. The Linux equivalent would be a walktrhough tailored to their machine (Printing, Scanning, Internet, Local Network, etc).
    --
    90% of everything is crap. Also, crap is relative.
  4. Re:Simple by johannesg · · Score: 4, Informative
    There is a distinct overuse of the 'advanced' button in GUI's these days. You click to open a config window, and immediately click again to see _all_ the options because some asshat decided that you should initially see only three instead of all four.

    Slightly better GUI design for config windows would help a great deal. What we need:

    - make the damn windows resizable already! Especially if you want to put in a three-line selection box with 3000+ items! (this is of course a point mostly aimed at Windows).

    - Do NOT use tabs, *especially* if you need more than one row of them. Instead, use a Mozilla-style category list on the left side of the window. That allows you to group together related 'tabs', and use longer (and more descriptive) names.

    - Group options together in a logical fashion. Disable controls that are made irrelevant by other choices.

    - Provide a fscking help option for EVERYTHING, describing the finer nuances of setting or unsetting that option. Don't write "LPGR: sets the LPGR option". Describe what it is, why I want it, what happens if I set it and what happens if I do not set it. If a value is a string, provide examples and full BNF syntax.

    - Do NOT use acronyms or abbreviations unless you are REALLY certain they are common words. And even then it is probably better not to.

    - Never invert the meaning of a checkbox. Checkboxes ENABLE things. If you check them something should be turned ON, not OFF. "Disable debugging" is incorrect. "Enable debugging" (with inverted state) is. If you do it right you will find you can drop the "enable" without losing meaning.

    - While I'm on the subject anyway, checkboxes are for on/off choices. There are plenty of things that masquerade like on/off choices but really aren't (for example, the choice between 22KHz and 44KHz sound has only two options but a checkbox is utterly inappropriate since 22KHz is not the logical opposite of 44KHz even if your application only has those two options). Use radiobuttons or a combobox for those, even if there are only two options.

    - Do not hide options behind three layers of windows, tabs, subwindows, and more tabs. You are allowed one layer only. It is provided by the navigation choices in the left-hand column. This allows any user to navigate to his option of choice in ONE click.

    - Remember the last location of the user. Select it for him, next time he opens the configuration window. This will probably save another click.

    And most importantly, there is this:

    - Work with your own software. Try to _feel_ what is annoying; what works, and what doesn't. If some task is unpleasant to accomplish, redesign the GUI so it is no longer a problem.

  5. Re:I Disagree by RAMMS+EIN · · Score: 5, Informative

    I agree with that. At the time I installed Gentoo, a lot of UNIX commands were still abracadabra to me. Still, I managed to get Gentoo up and running without a hitch, and learned a lot in the process. What this means is that Gentoo, typically considered for advanced users, is a good way to kickstart newbies.

    I really think that, in general, one of the best ways to learn about computers (any part of hardware and software) is by diving into it at the deepest level with a good walktrough. This not only teaches you how to do things, but also why you do them that way. With strong knowledge of the low level, it is easy to come up with any solution for the high level.

    Of course, the _quickest_ way to learn how to use a computer is to learn just the things you need to use. However, do not confuse this with the easiest way. For example, there is a widespread belief that GUIs are more intuitive, and therefore easier to use than the command line. I disagree. I can hardly think of anything more intuitive than pressing the key which has the character that you want on the screen. From there on, you build up the complexity until you have a command that does what you want done, and press the key that causes the command to be executed.

    In a GUI, one typically moves the mouse (in a different plane!), to the location where an action is to be performed, then does one of clicking, right clicking, holding a key and clicking, double clicking, etc. Often, the command to be performed is selected from a menu, which sometimes appears in a completely different location from where the action is performed. Intuitive?

    The strength of GUIs is that they are discoverable. Once you learn how to move the mouse, select items, and navigate menus, you can discover pretty much everything a program can do by doing just that. There is a lesson here for CLI designers: make your interfaces discoverable. Tell the user how to get a list of commands and how to find out what they do.

    --
    Please correct me if I got my facts wrong.
  6. Re:I Disagree by mrroach · · Score: 5, Informative
    OK, I call shenanigans on all of you. You're putting me on, right?

    You did not even read this documentation that you are claiming is no good.

    You also did not look for it very hard.

    Let's see...
    • go to samba.org
    • click on USA
    • click on documentation
    • choose the html version of the howto guide (the first link on that page)
    • skim through the index and see "2. Fast Start: Cure for Impatience" and click it
    • Lo and behold, the two configurations you just mentioned are configurations #1 and #2 on that page.


    Now, have a look at that documentation, then come back and tell me that it sucks and why, or tell me that it doesn't but that you just couldn't find it, or tell me that you were really just not looking that hard.

    -Mark