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Realistic Driving Simulator Games?
modoquasi writes "I have a son approaching the age when it is legal to hurtle through the air at insurance-raising speeds. I would like to educate him to hurtle safely and legally as soon as possible, and not use my car to do it. I thought I would find a number of driving simulator/educators for teens at home. but all I found are the likes of GTA Vice City and Crazy Taxi. Though Big Mutha Truckers might educate him on correct parking procedures in tight spots, I don't think it covers four-way-stops and passing on a double yellow line. Do the readers of Slashdot have any clues where to find this type of software?"
how bout you just spend some time with the kid & go teach him yourself? there will never be an electronic substitute for what a kid learns directly from his parents.
Not everything can be simulated. Not everything that can be simulated should be simulated.
I can't say that I don't give a fuck. I've just run out of fuck to give.
Investigate advanced driving courses, road safety. Try and find an advanced driver to take him out as a passenger, road commentry, go/no go decisions etc.
Track day, take him to a race track and pay for him to have a days instruction. Also pay for him to be driven round at speed.
Buy one book for him. Roadcraft: the police drivers handbook. Quite simply the best manual for driving. It's a UK publication, has been going for 80 years with revisions.
Make him buy the car and pay for the insurance. If you are going to pay for this make sure it goes through his bank account, so he has the money and has to write the cheques.
I used driving simulators but never with a steering wheel and pedals. Instead I used a joystick, or even the keypad. This dampened my interest, and so I waited until behind-the-wheel training.
No matter how realistic the software, the lack of a realistic input device destroys the idea of practicing.
I'm sure lot of people will recomend Gran Turismo (1, 2 or 3). And while it is an amazing simulator, there is one big issue that might not help your son learn how to drive. Mainly, that there is no damage modeling. You hit a wall at 120mph+ and you bounce backwards, perhaps spin a little. There are some benefits to the game, but I don't think it'll be the best way to teach someone how to drive.
I learned to drive at 16, and didn't play GT2 until I was 20 or so. I already knew how to 'drive' (commuting wise, not racing wise), so in a sense, it helped fill up my driving dictionary, rather then helping me to start writing it. I really don't know how much GT would have helped me if I played it before I was 16. Further, I've found that any time I drive after playing a racing game, I tend to drive too fast on the streets. Maybe its the adrenaline, but I also sometimes fool myself into thinking that driving that fast is 'safe', because if I crash nothing will happen (or at worst I have to hit the reset button).
All in all, I really don't know if there is any better experience then real experience behind the wheel of a car. The fear/excitement/etc I remember the first time I sat in the drivers seat has never been matched by any virtual enviroment.
I really think GT (and other simulation based racers) really helped teach me about the differences between FWD, RWD, AWD, understeer, oversteer, driving on ice, rain, mud, snow, etc. In that sense, I found GT very helpful, but I bet sitting behind a wheel helped even more.
"However," replied the universe, "The fact has not created in me A sense of obligation."
Kinda hard to miss honestly
Kinda hard to miss this in the submission:
I thought I would find a number of driving simulator/educators for teens at home.
Gran Turismo isn't a driving simulator/educator and doesn't cover "four-way-stops and passing on a double yellow line." Gran Turismo is a racing game.
I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate.
Sorry, but I actually drive a real car, and Gran Tourismo is nothing but a caricature of physics. Particularly where rear-wheel drive cars are concerned.
And, yes, I've done power drifts in a real car (I was young and foolish then).
Moreover, the LAST thing you want to teach a sixteen year old is how to drive fast. Because what a beginning driver really lacks is the judgement to know WHEN they can drive fast safely. Far better to teach them safe driving, and do the race car course next year or the year after.
Jon Acheson
All opinions expressed herein are my own, and not those of my employers, who are appalled.
You're seeking the wrong solution. Using a computer isn't going to teach your son a damn thing about driving.
:)
Why don't you take him out to an empty parking lot show him the basic controls? Have him drown around a bit w/o even touching th gas pedal (presumably you have an auto trans and the car gets rolling as soon as your foot is off the brake). Teach him how to gently use the break to keep the car from going too fast w/o stopping it all together. Once he learns how to work the brake gently, teach him how to do the same with the gas.
Once he's good at making circles in the empty parking lot in a controlled fashion, do not take him to the street - even though he's ready. Get some orange cones or something, set them up in a box and have him park in the box. Teach him to park backwards and forwards, and force him to use the mirrors to do so. Teaching him to use the mirrors before he ever gets onto the street is the best thing you can do. Once he's been driving around the streets, he's going to see the mirrors and the whole parking thing as an annoying hastle. But if he learns to park and use mirrors first, he'll have a better appreciation for the dimensions of the car before he is ever out on the street.
Now take him on an empty road. Teach him that if a car gets behind yours, to signal right and pull over a bit so the car can pass. This will let your kid drive around on a real street but without having to worry too much about other traffic. Teach him to do stop signs, making sure he understands the right of way in the various situations.
As he gets more experience and confidence, you can take him into roads with higher speed limits, red lights. Teach him how to make left turns. Go out with him in the middle of the day and tell him which turns to take. Without him knowing it, take him onto the freeway (do pick a time when it's likely to be empty) and guide him through merging. This is what my dad did when I was learning. He didn't make a big deal out of it, we just "ended up" on the freeway, and he's like "you just did what is probably the hardest aspect of driving - merged into freeway traffic"
In general, use your brain and have patience with your kid. Make sure he knows that cars are dangerous. Explain to him that hitting pedestrians and byciclists is an expensive amusement. Tell him that if the brakes ever fail, aim to crash into the cheapest car rather than the shiny new Benz.
No video game is going to replace your having to go through it with him. Do use your car. Start off in a completely safe area. Let him get a feel for the controls and the dimensions of the vehicle. Then take is gradually from there.
Next thing you know he'll be able to do the 500 mile drive from Cleveland to NYC all on his own, a week after getting his licence, like I did.
If he DOES do that, do teach him how to parallel park first. Because I had to figure it out on my own once I got to Brooklyn
Ecce Europa - Web Design for Business
Translation: I have a son. He will soon be able to legally destroy my car. How can I make a token effort to avoid this with the least effort possible?
Here's a hint: the rules of the road are boring That's why I keep getting speeding fines. Who in their right mind would make a video game full of them?The games will give him quicker reflexes. That's about it.
Fork out for an advance driving course if you really want him to learn something.
Over here the typical driving instructor's car has brake pedals on the instructors side, so the instructor can slam on the brakes if the student does something stupid/dangerous. A handbrake just doesn't cut it, if your kid really sucks.
And if your kid adds some "unusual wear and tear" on the car it isn't to your car.
That's what my parents did - they sent me for about double the typical hours of instruction - just to gain real road experience - even though my driving instructor was a bit unconventional - for the later part of my driving lessons, much of the time was spent driving my instructor from place to place as he did his errands (buy groceries, send them to his mom, miles away) - even driving in rush hour traffic. It kinda worked out - I passed first try.
Go look at the plane flying scene - after you learn the basics (and are in less danger of killing yourself or others), it's the hours of flying time that count. Of course you could go for the advanced driving stuff - that's useful too.
Most people where I am try to go for the minimum number of lessons to save money, but what happens is they can pass the tests, but they can _barely_ drive safely.
Heck I know a few kids who've crashed their family cars soon after passing their driving tests. And I wouldn't trust their driving. They treat it like it's a _game_.
So I'm not sure if a "game" would be good.
After the instructor is done with them, you can teach them how to be safer.
Try stuff like distracting them whilst they are driving (in safe+controlled conditions)- drop something on the mat, if they should NOT get distracted overly by that. I mean something dropping on the passenger side mat is unlikely to be a bomb or anything dangerous.
If you're travelling at 100km/h, or 80km/h in heavy traffic, if you spend one or two seconds looking at the floor, it could be your last few seconds of your life as a fully abled individual.
Through the game, my son has picked up the basics of driving. He's learned a few things about traction, speed and cornering. But I've noticed that there are some things that he simply can't "get" no matter how much he practices and I coach.
I think one of the biggest reasons for this is, as another poster noted elsewhere, GT may be the best driving simulator, but it's really not all that great when compared with the real thing. GT doesn't supply a big enough field of view, it doesn't supply G-forces or enough kinesthetic feedback, and it certainly doesn't make you scared of hitting things.
The limitations of the gaming platform mean that, at best, Gran Turismo will remind an experienced driver of certain events/actions -- it doesn't provide enough feedback to provide that experience. For instance, if you're driving (in GT) a normal car with a loose suspension and brake hard, you'll see the car nosedive. You won't feel it nosedive, you won't feel the G-force pushing you toward the steering wheel, and you won't feel the sudden lack of those forces if your tires break traction. An experienced driver will see the dip in GT and know what it means, and react to it. To my son, it's just a visual effect.
So, I plan to load my kid into my hopped-up '94 Integra and take him to a parking lot. That will probably provide a lot more real-world experience than Gran Turismo ever will.
There are karting facilities all over the country (my local one is F1 Boston). Not only is it a fun experience (and you can experience it TOGETHER), it is a great introduction to motorsport.
In addition to open racing, most facilities have leagues in which your son could compete (league racing is much more economical than open racing).
While you're at it, drop Going Faster! in his lap. This is a fantastic book which brings driving down to a science. Maybe he can even use it to counter all the crap they teach you in Driver's Ed (IMO, driver's ed causes as many accidents as it avoids).
Okay, so I know. "I don't want my kid racing!" Tell you what. Do a survey of race drivers at all levels vs. soccer moms. Drivers are fully aware of the dangers of driving and are by FAR more knowledgeable in how to deal with not only standard driving situations, but also extraordinary situations.
I've always had problems with people who DON'T know how to race, because they don't understand the dynamics of taking a turn (racers maximize the radius of a turn, allowing more speed in a race situation or more "wiggle room" in a street situation) or how to deal with a problem (most drivers hit the brakes, as they were taught to do in drivers' ed., usually resulting in a lock; brake lock = no traction, race drivers recognise the situation, adjust their driving line, and just keep on keeping on). Ever notice that screeaching brakes often ends in a THUD? Those people never learned to race.
And for the love of God, teach him to put down the goddamn phone!
:wq