Posted by
Hemos
on from the There-is-always-smoke-rising-from-Isengard-these-days. dept.
JC writes "It looks like Tolkien fans will get one of their biggest dreams with Turbine's Middle-Earth Online. Originally expected about November, we're now looking at a Northern Hemisphere Autumn release date. The New Zealand Herald has a good article."
Re:I want to be a Men class.
by
Nos.
·
· Score: 5, Informative
That's just the way Tolkien wrote. The books were writtin in the 50's I believe, and at that time there wasn't as much an issue referring to humans as men. In the Tolkien world, we had dwarves, elves, and men as the main 3 races. I don't think it was meant to exclude or even discount females, it was just used as a generic term at the time.
MEO Officical Site
by
JasdonLe
·
· Score: 5, Informative
-- ** A Sketch a Week **
http://www.sketchplease.com
Re:I want to be a Men class.
by
david.given
·
· Score: 5, Informative
Now, I didn't RTFA, but I really hope that they don't make it like MERP (the Rolemaster based pnp rpg), where any player can just be a high-elf, or a half-elf, or a wizard, or an ent, or something else that's supposed to be rare as diamonds. Its a stupid world where the rare peoples outnumber the normal, common humans. Same thing for magical artifacts - and notice that Gandalf primarily fights with a sword and staff, not "lightningbolt!" and "I'm gonna cast magic missile."
Tolkien wrote primarily about spiritual magic.
Gandalf was the master of fire. Partly, this manifested itself through his skill with fireworks and magical fire, but that wasn't the important bit. What Tolkien felt was far more important, and was stressed over and over again, was the fact the Gandalf could 'kindle the fire in men's souls'. Look at the way he can muster enthusiasm in practically everyone. The classic example is the way he brought Théoden back from the brink in _RotK_ (ignore the lousy movie effects --- this is one of the few bits that Peter Jackson got totally wrong). Even more impressive, to my mind --- he managed to talk Bilbo into going dragon-hunting in The Hobbit.
(Saruman's power was his will and his voice. He could talk practically anyone into doing anything. He had very little power of his own; once the Ents destroyed Isengard, he was shafted. Again, another bit the film got completely wrong was his fight with Gandalf. In the books, it's a battle of wills, and pre-Moria Gandalf is definitely Saruman's inferior.)
The rest of Tolkien's world is similar. The difference between Elves, Dwarves, Men and the other races? They're races, not species. Tolkien wasn't interested in their outward appearance, or whether they could interbreed, or the shape of their ears. The fundamental, crucial difference, intrinsic to Middle-Earth's entire philosophy, the thing that is hammered home over and over again, is the shape of their souls.
When Elves die, they're reincarnated. When Dwarves die --- actually, I forget. I believe they end up in some classical afterlife. When Men die, however, the souls leave the universe entirely. Nobody knows what happens to them. By Tolkien's view, Men are specially favoured. They get to move on to whatever Eru has planned for them next, and are unique in that aspect. All the other races are bound to Arda until the end of time.
(This is the reason why Arwen had to become human. She was a descendent of a Man-Elf cross. All such people had to choose between following the Elven path or the mortal path, because you have to pick what kind of soul you have. All the rest follows from there.)
(If you're interested in such things, read The Silmarillion. It's tough going, but rewarding.)
Tolkien just doesn't go in for material magic very much. He didn't find it interesting. While this makes his universe incredibly rich and rewarding to study, it doesn't really fit a modern game where the player wants to trigger some flashy effect and kill loads of orcs... I await the MMORPG with some trepidation.
Slashdot Mirror
That's just the way Tolkien wrote. The books were writtin in the 50's I believe, and at that time there wasn't as much an issue referring to humans as men. In the Tolkien world, we had dwarves, elves, and men as the main 3 races. I don't think it was meant to exclude or even discount females, it was just used as a generic term at the time.
For all who were looking for this link:
middle-earthonline.com** A Sketch a Week **
http://www.sketchplease.com
Tolkien wrote primarily about spiritual magic.
Gandalf was the master of fire. Partly, this manifested itself through his skill with fireworks and magical fire, but that wasn't the important bit. What Tolkien felt was far more important, and was stressed over and over again, was the fact the Gandalf could 'kindle the fire in men's souls'. Look at the way he can muster enthusiasm in practically everyone. The classic example is the way he brought Théoden back from the brink in _RotK_ (ignore the lousy movie effects --- this is one of the few bits that Peter Jackson got totally wrong). Even more impressive, to my mind --- he managed to talk Bilbo into going dragon-hunting in The Hobbit.
(Saruman's power was his will and his voice. He could talk practically anyone into doing anything. He had very little power of his own; once the Ents destroyed Isengard, he was shafted. Again, another bit the film got completely wrong was his fight with Gandalf. In the books, it's a battle of wills, and pre-Moria Gandalf is definitely Saruman's inferior.)
The rest of Tolkien's world is similar. The difference between Elves, Dwarves, Men and the other races? They're races, not species. Tolkien wasn't interested in their outward appearance, or whether they could interbreed, or the shape of their ears. The fundamental, crucial difference, intrinsic to Middle-Earth's entire philosophy, the thing that is hammered home over and over again, is the shape of their souls.
When Elves die, they're reincarnated. When Dwarves die --- actually, I forget. I believe they end up in some classical afterlife. When Men die, however, the souls leave the universe entirely. Nobody knows what happens to them. By Tolkien's view, Men are specially favoured. They get to move on to whatever Eru has planned for them next, and are unique in that aspect. All the other races are bound to Arda until the end of time.
(This is the reason why Arwen had to become human. She was a descendent of a Man-Elf cross. All such people had to choose between following the Elven path or the mortal path, because you have to pick what kind of soul you have. All the rest follows from there.)
(If you're interested in such things, read The Silmarillion. It's tough going, but rewarding.)
Tolkien just doesn't go in for material magic very much. He didn't find it interesting. While this makes his universe incredibly rich and rewarding to study, it doesn't really fit a modern game where the player wants to trigger some flashy effect and kill loads of orcs... I await the MMORPG with some trepidation.