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NASA Recovers Genesis

zjango writes "CNN carrying this... 'The Genesis capsule which crashed in the Utah desert Wednesday has been lifted out of its impact crater and moved to a holding area, NASA reported on its Web site. Scientists were cautiously optimistic that the payload -- dozens of fragile tiles that had collected particles of the solar wind for about two years -- could still yield viable material.'"

32 comments

  1. Great news.... maybe. by keiferb · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I had the pleasure(?) of being off on a sick day yesterday, so I was able to watch the landing live. I felt terrible when the thing hit, I can only imagine what the folks who've been involved with this thing for several years must have felt. It'd be great to see something useful come out of the whole project.

    1. Re:Great news.... maybe. by Randolpho · · Score: 2, Funny

      Heh... it's kinda like when you miss the game and your favorite team loses. It's all your fault because you weren't there to cheer them on!

      YOU JINX!!! You broke Genesis! It was planet forbidden!!!! ;)

      --
      "Times have not become more violent. They have just become more televised."
      -Marilyn Manson
  2. Quarantine. by torpor · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Yes, I understand the 'contamination of the valuable samples' issue, but what about the other angle - that of quarantining Earths valuable ecosphere from whatever particles were floating out there in the Solar Winds?

    Are we really absolutely sure that there's nothing on those plates, awfully petri-dish'y to me, which doesn't eat gold or platinum or carbon ferociously, has not been able to survive gravity/atmosphere so well, but which we just gave a free ride down here to a land of milk and honey?

    Well, I guess not. Otherwise we wouldn't be doing the science, right, to find out whats up there?

    Yeah, the Andromeda Strain puns were rampant, but now, 24 hours later, have we really thought enough about our return-to-earth of foreign space particles?

    --
    ; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
    1. Re:Quarantine. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes we really absolutely sure.
      Too many science fiction movies.

    2. Re:Quarantine. by Otter · · Score: 3, Funny

      It's not like the probe went through some Star Trek-ish continuum rift. If there were something like that out there, not all that far away, it would have hitched a ride down on a meteorite a billion years ago.

    3. Re:Quarantine. by bcattwoo · · Score: 2, Funny

      Just to be safe, send all your gold and platinum possessions to me for safe keeping.

    4. Re:Quarantine. by bcattwoo · · Score: 0, Troll

      Just to be safe, send all your gold and platinum possessions to me and I will store them for you. Then wrap yourself in foil starting with your neck (I heard they don't eat aluminum and I assume your head is already protected by your hat) to protect your personal carbon reserves.

    5. Re:Quarantine. by Otter · · Score: 1

      By the way, my comment wasn't intended to be funny -- and his was thought-provoking, and certainly not a troll.

    6. Re:Quarantine. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about the other angle - protecting ourselves from pagan/heretic particles that came outside of God's green Earth? Who knows what demons this pandora's box will unleash when examined? Best leave the capsule unmoved, untouched, and fenced off in the desert.

    7. Re:Quarantine. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This just in..... ...scientists report that no quantine is necessary [COUGH] with the Genisis [COUGH *HACK*] probe.

      [COUGH][ACK][GURGLE] LOST CARRIER

  3. 3 posts from sci.space.news by noselasd · · Score: 3, Informative

    MEDIA RELATIONS OFFICE JET PROPULSION LABORATORY CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE F TECHNOLOGY
    NATIONAL AERONAUTICS AND SPACE ADMINISTRATION PASADENA, CALIF. 91109 TELEPHONE (818) 354-5011 DC Agle (818) 393-9011
    Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif.

    Donald Savage (202) 358-1547
    NASA Headquarters, Washington, D.C.

    RELEASE: 2004-219 September 8, 2004

    Genesis Mission Status Report

    The Genesis sample return capsule entered Earth's atmosphere at
    9:52:47 a.m. Mountain Daylight Time and entered the preplanned entry
    ellipse in the Utah Test and Training Range as predicted. However, the
    Genesis capsule, as a result of its parachute not deploying, impacted
    the ground at a speed of 311 kilometers per hour (193 miles per hour).
    The impact occurred near Granite Peak on a remote portion of the
    range. No people or structures were anywhere near the area.

    "We have the capsule," said Genesis project manager Don Sweetnam of
    NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. "It is on the
    ground. We have previously written procedures and tools at our
    disposal for such an event. We are beginning capsule recovery
    operations at this time."

    By the time the capsule entered Earth's atmosphere, the flight crews
    tasked to capture Genesis were already in the air. Once it was
    confirmed the capsule touched down out on the range, the flight crews
    were guided toward the site to initiate a previously developed
    contingency plan. They landed close to the capsule and, per the plan,
    began to document the capsule and the area.

    "For the velocity of the impact, I thought there was surprisingly
    little damage," said Roy Haggard of Vertigo Inc., Lake Elsinore,
    Calif., who took part in the initial reconnaissance of the capsule. "I
    observed the capsule penetrated the soil about 50 percent of its
    diameter. The shell had been breached about three inches and I could
    see the science canister inside and that also appeared to have a small
    breach," he said.

    The safety of recovery personnel has been the top priority. The
    capsule's separation charge had to be confirmed safe before the
    capsule could be moved. The recovery team is in the process of preparing to move the capsule to a clean room.

    The Genesis mission was launched in August 2001 on a journey to
    capture samples from the storehouse of 99 percent of all the material
    in our solar system -- the Sun. The samples of solar wind particles,
    collected on ultra-pure wafers of gold, sapphire, silicon and diamond,
    were designed to be returned for analysis by Earth-bound scientists.

    JPL manages the Genesis mission for NASA's Science Mission
    Directorate, Washington. Lockheed Martin Space Systems, Denver,
    developed and operated the spacecraft. JPL is a division of the
    California Institute of Technology.

    For information about the Genesis Sample Return Mission on the
    Internet, visit http://jpl.convio.net/site/R?i=CPQk9GcuEylO-3BCLCX xIg.. . For background information about Genesis, visit http://jpl.convio.net/site/R?i=Cu7MSKOwBElO-3BCLCX xIg.. .

    MEDIA RELATIONS OFFICE JET PROPULSION LABORATORY CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE F TECHNOLOGY
    NATIONAL AERONAUTICS AND SPACE ADMINISTRATION PASADENA, CALIF. 91109 TELEPHONE (818) 354-5011 DC Agle (818) 393-9011
    Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif.

    Donald Savage (202) 358-1547
    NASA Headquarters, Washington, D.C.

    RELEASE: 2004-221 September 8, 2004

    Genesis Mission Status: Canister Moved Into Cleanroom

    The science canister from the Genesis mission was moved into the
    cleanroom at the U.S. Army Dugway Proving Ground in Utah early
    Wednesday evening. First, a team of specialists plucked pieces
    of dirt and mud that had lodged in the canister after the mission's
    sample return capsule landed at high speed in the Utah desert. The
    Genesis team will begin examining the contents of the canister

  4. Pyros never triggered by Somegeek · · Score: 5, Informative
    New Scientist is reporting that the pyros never went off to trigger the parachute sequence. NASA doesn't know yet why they didn't go off; batteries, sensors and the electronics responsible are being looked at as possible causes.

    http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns999 96379

    --
    And as you tread the halls of sanity, You feel so glad to be, Unable to go beyond. I have a message, From another time..
    1. Re:Pyros never triggered by wetlettuce · · Score: 1

      NASA doesn't know yet why they didn't go off;

      BBC News is reporting that a faulty battery is the best likely cause.

      http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3643346.stm

  5. Another CNN Story, More Pictures by AndyCampbell · · Score: 4, Informative

    Here's another CNN story with a few more pictures of the capsule after being recovered and brought back to a hangar.

    1. Re:Another CNN Story, More Pictures by ackthpt · · Score: 1
      Here's another CNN story with a few more pictures of the capsule after being recovered and brought back to a hangar.

      The picture suggests they actually brought back a large armadillo... maybe it broke Genesis' fall.

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
  6. Sorry to burst your bubble by Royster · · Score: 4, Insightful

    But particles from the solar wind interact with and penetrate the Earth's atmosphere and have been doing so for billions of years. Perhaps you need to modify your tinfoil hat to include a mask and rebreather device so that you can be safe from those alien particles.

    --
    I have discovered a truly marvelous sig, unfortunately the sig limit is too small to contain i
    1. Re:Sorry to burst your bubble by torpor · · Score: 0, Redundant


      Yes it is paranoia, but shouldn't there be an ounce of it in the face of such 'certainties' that all we do is infallible?

      I know and understand that 'particles from the solar wind' are all over the place, but what else is there in 26 million miles of space that we don't know about?

      All I'm saying is, we seem to be mighty sure of ourselves to be making such great petri-dish'es crash-land into our mineral-rich deserts...

      --
      ; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
    2. Re:Sorry to burst your bubble by Royster · · Score: 2, Interesting

      There's no real mystery about chemical reactions and which reactions are exothermic and can provide energy for creatures to use. We know this stuff. If creatures could get energy from raw ores, they would already have evolved on the earth's surface to take advantage of that energy source. We do have some bacteria which can reduce sulfur and emit sulfur hydrides (rotten eggs smell) but those all mostly working off sulfur which is not in its lowest energy state. These occur where geothermic activity brings heat to underground rocks and raises the energy state of the sulfur present making some of that energy available for organisms to use.

      Minerals found in naturally occurring ores are already at a low energy state. There isn't anywhere else for them to go. There isn't going to be some magical space beastie which can create a new, not found in nature, energy states for minerals itself to exploit to our grqave detriment.

      Your fears are science fiction, not science.

      --
      I have discovered a truly marvelous sig, unfortunately the sig limit is too small to contain i
    3. Re:Sorry to burst your bubble by torpor · · Score: 2, Funny

      Your fears are science fiction, not science.

      okay, if you say so, fine by me. don't blame me if this statement ends up in a .sig file, or scraped on a cave wall somewhere, but ...

      --
      ; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
    4. Re:Sorry to burst your bubble by nounderscores · · Score: 1

      sort of true. The earth's magnetic field deflects most of the charged stuff away, with only a small amount of the total solar wind hitting the north and south poles.

      I wouldn't be so worried about exobiology coming down to eat us, but the point about the genesis capsule was to get outside our magnetosphere and see what was out there.

      If only we had a robot version of the shuttle. We could have parked the capsule in orbit and then analysed it in the science module in the shuttle bay. Then we could have beamed back the data, before attempting re-entry. That way, if it burns up, we get the data back. No people on the robot shuttle, and no big loss if we lose the original artifiact because we have some more data out of the mission in addition to what genesis already sent while it was en-route back to earth.

      I heard that the shuttle has an autopilot ability. We could retrofit them to run unmanned and get some use out of them.

    5. Re:Sorry to burst your bubble by Royster · · Score: 1

      Sure the magnetic field deflects a lot of charged ions, but the space beastie or correspondent is afraid of is a lot bigger than an ion and would not likely be (a) charged or (b) deflected.

      There wasn't really anything wrong with the design of Genesis. It just failed to deploy its parachutes on reentry. It appears that Murphy is an astronaut.

      It's my understanding that a pilot needs to actually land the shuttle on the ground.

      --
      I have discovered a truly marvelous sig, unfortunately the sig limit is too small to contain i
  7. This just in... by MasterDirk · · Score: 5, Funny
    Preliminary research on the materials recovered from the probe lead scientists to conclude that the sun is indeed composed mainly of sand and broken glass.
    </badjoke>
    --

    "Programming is like sex: one mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life."

    1. Re:This just in... by boofums · · Score: 1

      Do you suppose my son could apply design elements from the Genesis capsule to his school egg drop content?

  8. Re:Are we sure it was an accident? by Ayaress · · Score: 1

    Yeah, yeah, replying to flaimbait, I know.

    Anyway... It's really a straightforward problem where you'd need seriously good proof to even suggest sabotage. This recovery was a chain of events that had to go off flawlessly, or this would happen. First, the reentry had to be spot-on. Second, the parachute had to work. Third, the recovery aircraft had to snatch it in mid air with a hook. The reentry, parachute, aircraft, pilot, hook, and any one of dozens of instruments used to get them all into the right alignment had to work right, or it the whole show would end with a dull thud.

    Even if it were, it's not a blow to our scientific credibility (unless we go the way of the joke below, and announce that the sun is in fact composed mostly of sand and broken glass), just a minor commentary on our engineering credibility. So we failed to get a sequence of time-critical events to go off within obsecnely narrow margins of error. Big deal, Europe MISSED MARS two times out of four.

  9. Re:uhm... by Somegeek · · Score: 1
    Exactly why was this obvious? I believe that NASA itself was previously unsure on this point. To the best of my knowledge, (and the reason that I posted it), was that this had not been known/reported before.

    There could have been various other failure modes where some or all of the pyros did fire but the chutes were not seen and it still crashed;

    pyros fire, drogue not released

    pyros fire, drogue released but tangled due to spin,

    pyros fire, drogue released, line broke off not pulling out main chute....

    etc. etc.

    Do you have any information to back up your reply with?

    --
    And as you tread the halls of sanity, You feel so glad to be, Unable to go beyond. I have a message, From another time..
  10. I know who done it! by Pamplemousse · · Score: 1

    It was those Mormons! They all live out in Utah right?

  11. Re:Are we sure it was an accident? by wetlettuce · · Score: 2, Funny

    Big deal, Europe MISSED MARS two times out of four.
    Technically, the last time the landing craft (Beagle-2) actually landed on Mars...just a little quicker than planned. If fact almost exactly the same as the Genesis payload except there was no-one to dig it out.

  12. Re:Are we sure it was an accident? by Ayaress · · Score: 2, Informative

    Speaking of Beagle, Genesis and Beagle were both designed in part by the same guy.

  13. My hopes for NASA by kjones692 · · Score: 1

    With any luck, this won't deter NASA's plans for a manned expedition to the Sun.

    --

    Love the Third Amendment?