Slashdot Mirror


Securing Personal Data in Small Companies?

lohmann asks: "I was recently paying rent in my apartment office when I noticed several of the rental agents frantically shaking a nearby keyboard. Being a geek, I intervened... and plugged the mouse back in. A barrage of performance questions ensued, so I checked their system for any issues. The results were astounding: Windows 95, no firewall, no AV software, and no backup software on a machine containing thousands of individuals personal information (including mine). I ran some utilities and removed dozens of viruses and instances of spyware. I voiced my concerns over security issues, but was told that 'there is no budget for such things' and that 'we haven't had any trouble in the past.' Have any of you run across similar instances of small companies refusing to protect your data? What can I do to convince them to secure the network?"

26 of 90 comments (clear)

  1. IT for rent arrangement? by mind21_98 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Maybe your landlord will take you on as a system administrator for their network in exchange for a reduction in your rent. Both of you will benefit, and you'll make sure your personal information doesn't fall in the wrong hands. :)

    1. Re:IT for rent arrangement? by bscott · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Cutting a deal? While I genuinely applaud your impulse towards finding an amicable solution via barter, I don't think you're being anywhere near cynical enough... You didn't read what he quoted them as saying - "We haven't had any trouble in the past" That's a psychology which is very, very difficult to fight against.

      If you become a victim of identity theft, it would be difficult if not impossible to trace back to negligence on the part of your landlord (or anyone else in most cases); so unless they are predisposed to worry about it, they're not going to - and they'll probably never really suffer from this attitude. Good luck trying to make a deal with them.

      Then again, I live in an area which is just about the most densely populated in the US; it's possible you might find property managers in less expensive areas who have not lost their souls and brains and might be amenable to reasoned argument. I can't count on having hot water, electricity or the hallway outside my front door to be free of homeless people (getting in via the broken security doors), so I've learned a healthy disrespect for landlords.

      --
      Perfectly Normal Industries
  2. gym by ralphus · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I once went to my gym, where they know me as the local computer geek. Obviously they have all customer information on their computer systems, including their photos and credit card numbers for billing. They were complaining that their computers had gotten slower recently and they didn't know what was going on. I said I would check it out. They didn't have a firewall, they didn't have anti-virus. What they did have was just about every virus and trojan under the sun and their little cable modem was working overtime just sending data to god knows where. I cleaned them up and installed everything they needed to get protection and clean up the mess. Small business is hopeless on a lot of occasions. It isn't their fault IMO. The vendors should be making more secure solutions for them to at least protect against all predictable threats.

    --
    Revolutions are never about freedom or justice. They're about who's going to be top dog. -- Kilgore Trout
    1. Re:gym by flacco · · Score: 2, Funny
      I once went to my gym, where they know me as the local computer geek.

      undoubtedly because you only went once, weighed 105 or 328 pounds, had a protruding adam's apple and thick black-rimmed glasses, and fell off all the exercise equipment jerry lewis style.

      --
      pr0n - keeping monitor glass spotless since 1981.
    2. Re:gym by ralphus · · Score: 2, Funny

      All while wearing a 2600 t-shirt. :)

      --
      Revolutions are never about freedom or justice. They're about who's going to be top dog. -- Kilgore Trout
  3. It's not just small landlords by dacarr · · Score: 2, Insightful
    The apartment complex I live at has similar problems - although our management company is the largest in Orange County, CA. All machines are running XP of some variant, however the IT department has seen fit to not restrict internet access and never did bother installing spyware proofing, AdAware, etc. Though they did install a commercial AV package. I wound up installing Spybot and AdAware on one of the boxen, and should check with the complex manager

    I think it comes down to an important thing - it's a case of general ignorance of facts, but what's scary is that it's the system adminstrators that seem somehow lacking this key data in some cases. I don't know if it's some bit of arrogance that comes with an MCSE or what - but it's kind of scary how that works at times.

    --
    This sig no verb.
  4. Well... by FooAtWFU · · Score: 3, Funny

    Imagine what would happen if they opened up their Rent Due spreadsheet and read something like "If you are reading this, than I could have altered the amount I owe. You need better security. Kthxbye."

    --
    The World Wide Web is dying. Soon, we shall have only the Internet.
    1. Re:Well... by toygeek · · Score: 2, Funny

      INCONCEIVIBLE!

  5. sue? by Apreche · · Score: 2, Interesting

    IANAL. However it makes sense to me that maybe you can sue. If a doctor doesn't keep your medical records safe and secure, then I imagine they could be held liable. If this is true, then I assume the same can be true of an employer. If they don't keep your personal information safe and secure, then you can sue them for being negligent or some such.

    Of course, if you just want to give some convincing give them the old risk benefit analasys. If all our computers got hosed how much would we lose? Then prove how likely it is and how often it happens. Then tell them the solution.

    --
    The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
    1. Re:sue? by james11111 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Under the Data Protection Act (UK) all buisnesses storing personal data must be registered with the Data Comissioner, and take reasonable steps to make that data secure. If they don't they are open to prosecution.

  6. Here's what you can do... by Spoing · · Score: 3, Insightful
    1. Find a huricaine.
    2. Step outside during the hurricane.
    3. Scream.

    You can't protect people from themselves.

    The only thing that works is mentioning that they may be liable -- they could be sued -- if they are found neglegent in not doing something to protect the data they have. Usually, this makes them concerned...and they still do nothing.

    --
    A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.
    1. Re:Here's what you can do... by Ubertech · · Score: 2, Funny

      For what I am about to do, I humbly apologize, and beg your forgiveness. Now then...

      Find a hurricane
      Step outside during the storm
      Scream like little girl

      The last line should, of course, be spoken with a fake Russian accent, like the one from the Rocky and Bullwinkle cartoons of the 1970s.

      --
      Be quick to listen, slow to speak, and slow to anger.
  7. Backups, A/V, firewall, and spyware by darkone · · Score: 2, Informative

    For windows boxes, there are 4 things I do/suggest to users:
    1> Backups - spend the $150 for a Maxtor OneTouch that comes with Retrospect personal. Once a week they press a button, backup done.
    2> A/V - If they don't want to spend $70 for Norton or McAfee, then for free you can try AVG ( http://www.grisoft.com/us/us_index.php )
    3> Firewall - Avoiding XP SP2's, www.zonealarm.com has a good free firewall.
    4> Spyware - AdAware does a great job detecting and removing spyware. ( www.lavasoftusa.com ) Free version requires that you run it manualy once a week/month/day.

    1. Re:Backups, A/V, firewall, and spyware by binaryspiral · · Score: 2, Informative

      Spybot does not require manual operation - I have startup scripts to update itself, scan, remove, and close the app without ever showing itself to the user.

      AdAware requires commercial licenses when used on non-residential computers. Spybot does not.

      I agree AdAware is polished and more refined, but spybot does a great job and has lots of Admin friendly programming.

    2. Re:Backups, A/V, firewall, and spyware by cyber0ne · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That's all well and good, but the problem is that the business doesn't want to bother with these things. You might as well suggest that they secure the machine by unplugging it. It'll be 100% secure, but the business isn't interested in such measures.

      He'd have better luck trying to find a precedent somewhere to show them. Maybe another small business in the area has had serious problems. I know one of the small businesses in my area absolutely refused any kind of protection because "it had never been a problem before." Then they got hit by some trojans, and hit hard. Their entire business was halted for a few days because their data couldn't be accessed. After the dust settled, their data was downright gone.

      Your suggestions are good and would help protect them (emphasis on help... someone else said it best earlier that "security is a process, not a product"), but your suggestions can't protect them from not wanting to be protected.

      --
      http://publicvoidlife.blogspot.com
  8. Re:now you got me worried. by Yaztromo · · Score: 2, Funny
    What am I to do? Will a small company (Radio shack down the street) lose my personal info? They must have asked me like 20 times...is that because they lose my info each time and have to get it again?

    Bah. Just do what I do. Everytime they ask me for my name and address, I just give them yours.

    Uh, on second thought, maybe you shouldn't do what I do :).

    Yaz.

  9. You poor USians by samael · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If you lived in a reasonable part of the world then you could report them under Data Protection law. If only you didn't let your corporations run the country.

  10. I volunteered for a day at a local non-profit by quintessent · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I was helping them install some digital camera software.

    The system was running horribly slow. When I opened a web browser to Google and got a pop-up, I knew exactly what was up. Ad-aware (Not to be confused with Ada-ware, which also claims to be an anti-spyware program) found about 6 different spyware apps. Once I had cleaned those off, the system ran 3 or 4 times as fast. Those apps had really cloggled up its limited RAM.

    This was a fairly busy non-profit helping clients pretty much continuously throughout the day.

    1. Re:I volunteered for a day at a local non-profit by Piquan · · Score: 2, Interesting

      How do you volunteer as a sysadmin for a day? Is there some sort of clearing-house for these things, or do you know somebody at the charity, or what?

      I think it'd be great to do... using my talents to help charity in an effective manner.

    2. Re:I volunteered for a day at a local non-profit by quintessent · · Score: 2, Informative

      I found them on VolunteerMatch. They were asking for computer help. Turns out, all they really needed were data entry monkeys. But then they asked about doing a one time gig, so I went in for that.

  11. What I've seen by dtfinch · · Score: 3, Informative

    A lot of multiuser POS/Point Of Sale systems store their data on a network file share, in dbase or some other ISAM format. And on top of that, few do any sort of encryption of customer information, like credit card numbers. The result, anyone at a computer that can access the application can steal sensitive customer information and anything else with minimal effort.

    1. Re:What I've seen by simplypeachy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      How dare they use such unsecure systems! Why, they could pay a few more pounds/bucks and use a password-protected MS Access database!

      </satire>
      I've seen that too. Same with back office systems. Worse, actually; some back officies have 5+ years of unencrypted credit card transactions

  12. Wireless also a problem by Thyamine · · Score: 2, Interesting

    My friend's old complex had a similar problem. Living right next to the office and the model, he noticed one day that they had installed a wireless router, but had absolutely no security for their network. All their busines information to any who wandered by.

    How do you address problems where the technology is getting easier to use, but where the users aren't spending the time to really learn the technology? I don't want to have to learn how to repair my car just to drive it, so can I expect much more from users who don't understand networking and security?

    --
    I will shred my adversaries. Pull their eyes out just enough to turn them towards their mewing, mutilated faces. Illyria
  13. Re:Annual safety inspection for cars. by hab136 · · Score: 2, Informative
    Two seconds with Google would tell you that.

    I did Google it:

    1. Motorola
    2. Motorola
    3. Museum of Tolerance
    4. Larz Anderson Car Museum
    5. Motorola again
    6. Motorola yet again
    7. The Ministry of Trade for Vietnam
    8. UKMOT with no explanation from Google on what that is (and thus no reason to investigate that page)
    9. Cambodia Tourism
    10. Microarray Databases

    I finally figured out that "UKMOT" is what you're talking about, but no, it wasn't obvious, even after Googling.

    Interestingly, Google UK doesn't even return UKMOT as a result on the first page. Though if you click "Pages from the UK", you get not UKMOT, but this page

    With the amount of cross-Atlantic traffic, you could've helped us Yanks (not to mention the non-native English speakers) out with at least the full name .. which, even after reading their FAQ I still don't know what MOT stands for.

    You could've also said "annual saftey inspection" in the original post instead of the UK-specific "MOT".

    You're obviously trying to express information (by posting), which I applaud; you'll reach many more minds if you make your post self-explanatory, or at least provide a link.

  14. Patient records by mrph · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Working in Medical IT, I can tell you that that several large vendors of systems holding patient information take second
    to no precautions when setting up servers. Software ship with built-in administrative account using default passwords,
    installation people use easy-to-guess root passwords and so on.

    And we're not talking about Dr. Jones down the street but enterprise-grade installations that can handle really large quantities of patient data.

  15. Talk to Your Neighbors by kmb · · Score: 2, Interesting

    See how the other people in your building feel about the situation. If enough people are pissed off, er, concerned, then you might be able to put some pressure on your landlord.

    Possible repercussions:

    1. Your toilet takes longer to get fixed.
    2. Everyone's rent goes up to pay for $300 worth of software.