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Interview With Lucas Gonze of Webjay

Posted by samzenpus on from the have-some-metallica dept.

Richard MacManus writes "I've published an interview with Lucas Gonze, creator of the P2P music-sharing web app Webjay. Lucas was an early developer of peer-to-peer applications and back in 2000 he created a P2P start-up called World OS (the product was called Goa). In this interview we discuss World OS / Goa, how it compared to other P2P apps such as Gnutella, the 'Internet as Platform' concept, how Webjay works, some P2P History and Decentralization Theory, and ways around the legal hassles of P2P."

15 of 62 comments (clear)

  1. How in the world... by JoeLinux · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Do you see p2p becoming anything other than an academic plaything? It's inherent "sometimes" nature (Sometimes you'll find the file you are looking for, sometimes it's busy/not found due to you not having the right connections) would seem to run counter to most business' requirements for reliability. How do you plan on redressing this?

    Joe

    1. Re:How in the world... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      On the other hand I dont see why the BitTorrent model with some very fast connection seeds (and some modification maybe for the seed upload algorithm to be fair to everybody regardless of their connection speed) hasnt gained more support for content distribution.

    2. Re:How in the world... by RealAlaskan · · Score: 2
      It's inherent "sometimes" nature (Sometimes you'll find the file you are looking for, sometimes it's busy/not found due to you not having the right connections) would seem to run counter to most business' requirements for reliability.

      I don't think that companies will ever use this for getting mp3s over the web. On the other hand, companies could use this to disseminate their own internal stuff. Search for ``joes spreadsheet'' on the internal p2p network, and if you don't find it, Joe is in trouble. Academics are using these networks to disseminate their papers and data sets, too, though I can't give you link to an example.

      --
      See what I've been reading.
    3. Re:How in the world... by DanteBlack · · Score: 2, Informative

      P2P is certainly more than a 'play thing' it has enormous potential for distribution. Take Debian for example, they use p2p to distribute install CDs (http://www.debian.org/CD/torrent-cd/), the benefit is that they've effectibly reduced the load on their servers. The problem with p2p is that it's gotten a bad rap, by large un-named organizations, not the technology proper.

      --
      I am invisble, and you can't see me.
    4. Re:How in the world... by Glass+of+Water · · Score: 4, Informative

      Yeah, man, the basic principles of decentralization are still quite sound. I mean, how'd you get here? typing "66.35.250.150"?

      The thing is, Webjay (Gonze's current project, for those who skipped the article) isn't a decentralized service. It's a centralized index of audio from all over the net. It provides tools to aggregate disparate and far-flung audio into a single playlist, and lets users judge. It's pretty cool, actually, because it solves (or tries to solve) a big problem with online free music, which is that nobody wants to weed through the crap to find the good stuff.

      --
      There are no trolls. There are no trees out here.
    5. Re:How in the world... by D+iz+a+n+k+Meister · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Many Earth Science types have been using the LDM for quite some time now. The LDM always struck me as the academic's BitTorrent.

      Granted, the LDM is geared more towards providing data in "near real-time," as opposed to delivering static content. . .but you can download and upload from/to just about anybody else with the LDM.

      --

      He painted a unicorn in outer space. I'm askin' ya, what's it breathin'?
  2. p2p is dying. by zerdood · · Score: 3, Interesting

    P2P is becoming viewed more and more like warez. Whether or not there are thorny legal issues, it will still die. Joe User doesn't know his rights, he just listens to the propaganda.

    --
    My sig would have been a lot cooler if /. didn't filter out HTML tags 0.o
    1. Re:p2p is dying. by Drakonian · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It is dying like all illegal things eventually do - speeding, jay-walking, drinking during the prohibition, etc?

      --
      Random is the New Order.
  3. Lucas gone Gonzo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    when I first read this, I thought it was going to be another negative Star Wars thread:
    "Interview with Lucas gone Gonzo"

  4. Re:A side thought by gordyf · · Score: 4, Informative

    BitTorrent doesn't just use a "line". You download from multiple people simultaneously, and those peope change over time, so you're not just downloading from a single person. Also, the more you upload to others, the more you'll be favored when clients are choosing who to upload to.

  5. music industry revolution by ozloy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    i'm sure it's been said before, but i haven't seen it put this way:

    why don't artists just give away their music, and charge for concerts?

    the cost of distributing used to be the promotion of a cd, the making of the cds, yadda. but with p2p those costs go to nothing.

    artists don't make much on cd sales anyways
    they make most of their money on concerts as it is.
    (from what i've heard)

    1. Re:music industry revolution by gregmac · · Score: 4, Insightful

      just playing devil's advocate here, but:

      why don't artists just give away their music, and charge for concerts?

      the cost of distributing used to be the promotion of a cd, the making of the cds, yadda. but with p2p those costs go to nothing.

      the cost of a CD is more than just distributing: it is also the manufacture of the cd (ok, this again goes to $0 when you just go via P2P), cost of recording, administrative overhead, ....

      Recording music is not cheap. While yes, it is possible to setup a home recording studio fairly inexpensivly that sounds decent, to get really good quality sound you're paying lots of money (for example, a good studio mic can run thousands of dollars). Building a studio is expensive, and thus renting one is expensive. Not to mention, you have to pay your sound engineer, support staff, etc.

      Also, someone's gotta figure out how you're doing with fans (which is much harder to do with P2P than CD sales). Are you popular enough in Toronto that it's worth looking into playing a concert there?

      You've also got to pre-pay for a lot of the production - renting a stage if required, sound gear, lights, trucks (if touring), paying security, roadies, hotels, food..

      Now, here's the big problem. Where do you get that money? Do you go to the bank and say "hey look, I need $80,000 to put on this concert.."? Perhaps mortgage your house or sell your car.. what happens if you only sell 20% of the tickets you expected, because 5 other bands that are bigger than you are playing the same city the same night (since that's the only way they can make money now)?

      While I disagree a lot with the way record companies work, there's not many places that will spend $1-million on you, and if you don't "make it", just let it go..

      --
      Speak before you think
    2. Re:music industry revolution by ozloy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      ok, so then current music industry corporates embrace p2p to get around the problems.
      they provide the best p2p network with the highest quality files and broadest range
      in return you lose privacy. they want to know who you listen to, where you physically are, other stuff that helps them determine which artist is the best investment

      music execs invest the money for concerts on artists they think are worth it. if the concert is a success, the artist gets paid.

      everything shifts from promotion of cd to promotion of concert.
      all money exchange is done at the concert.

      piracy issues avoided. it's not easy to download the concert experience.

      plus i want to download and not feel guilty about it, damnit!
      i'm hungry, gonna go eat.

  6. WebJay isn't "p2p" (as in Napster, Kazaa, etc.) by turnstyle · · Score: 2, Informative
    For those unfamiliar with WebJay, it's worth pointing out that it's not an "app" (it's a Web site), and it's not "p2p" (at least not in the Napster, Kazaa sense of the term).

    Instead, it lets you build and publish playlists that point to content served by other boxes -- it doesn't "share" anything as much as it shares pointers to those things (a big difference from conventional "p2p" apps).

    Also, I believe Lucas' intent is that it only share authorized work (another big difference from conventional "p2p").

    --
    Here's what I do: Bitty Browser & Andromeda
  7. Don't Steal Music by SiliconEntity · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Gonze has a good perspective on piracy:
    I don't believe there is a moral duty to stick to authorized music. I do believe that politeness is the only path to a political solution. If somebody wants me to stand on my head while listening to their music, I will either stand on my head or find other music. If somebody wants me to listen to their music, they will have to make it available under terms that I can accept.

    Politeness is a winner tactic. It forces the crappy businessmen in the recording industry to stop hiding behind piracy. It makes the good guys smell serious. It's a dignified way of living. It helps musicians who respect listeners get popular at the expense of musicians who don't. The sole problem with politeness is that the technology and culture to filter up the best music libre is still immature.
    In other words, don't steal music. Take music from people who give you permission to do so. It's common decency and politeness. Gonze's technology is supposed to help you find music like this which is just as good as the crap you've been stealing.

    Sounds to me like it's worth a try.