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Happy 100th To The Vacuum Tube

williamw83 writes "Today, November 16, 2004 has been declared as the centennial of the birth of modern electronics by the American Vacuum Society. As the AIP Physics News Update reports, this marks 'British scientist John Ambrose Fleming's 1904 invention of the first practical electronic device. Known as the thermionic diode, this first simple vacuum tube, containing only two electrodes, could be used to convert an alternating current (AC) to a direct current (DC).' Today's celebration takes place as part of the AVS's 51st Annual Symposium & Exhibition in Anaheim, CA. Being a guitar player myself, I've come to truly appreciate the technology of the vacuum tube every time I crank up my amplifier. This 100-year-old grandfather of electronics, used by musicians and audiophiles across the world, has proven that profound advances in technology do not always render old technologies obsolete."

31 of 431 comments (clear)

  1. Relays by spike+hay · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Vacuum tubes, as big as they were, were a huge improvement of the mechanical relay-powered early computers.

    --
    If you don't understand any of my sayings, come to me in private and I shall take you in my German mouth.
  2. Amplifiers... by Roguelazer · · Score: 4, Funny

    Yes, amplifiers are definitely the most important uses of vacuum tubes. I can't think of a single more important use in all of history that I would put down on the article had I written it...

    1. Re:Amplifiers... by Wouter+Van+Hemel · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Clearly, you don't play guitar, or you would know that the raw, warm sound of a guitar crying through a tube amp close to meltdown is as sweet a sound as a woman close to orgasm.

      But please, PLEASE, do tell us about those other undoubtedly equally interesting applications you had in mind. ;)

    2. Re:Amplifiers... by calidoscope · · Score: 4, Informative
      Can you name a more widely used application of tubes now days?

      High power RF amplifiers. Tubes have several advantages here, better high frequency response, can run a LOT hotter and are typically more electrically rugged (i.e. a tube can recover from an arc).

      --
      A Shadeless room is a brighter room.
    3. Re:Amplifiers... by Profane+MuthaFucka · · Score: 4, Informative

      When high power semiconductors fail, you need to worry about shrapnel. When high power tubes fail, they look great on a shelf.

      --
      Fascism trolls keeping me up every night. When I starts a preachin', he HITS ME WITH HIS REICH!
    4. Re:Amplifiers... by Inspector+Lopez · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Actually that is not so. Tubes are the most linear amplifying devices. http://www.dogstar.dantimax.dk/tubestuf/miniblk1.h tm

      Bzzzzt. This is absolutely false. In terms of dynamic range, the most linear amplifiers are *clearly* transistors. In my line of work, you'd be laughed out of the room if you dared to use vaccuum tube amps. For RF situations requiring very high dynamic range, vacuum tubes are *not* an option. Tubes are *not* used for truly high dynamic range applications.

      Audiophiles do *not* have high dynamic range demands compared to some radar applications; and in these radar applications, there is no room for parlor quibbles about soft-clipping and warmer sounds and harmonics. There is only reality, in the form of whether or not you notice the incoming missile. So, please. I think it is a fine thing for audiophiles to blow kilobucks on tubes to make their guitars sound optimally crappy.

      Everyone needs a hobby.

  3. Who cares? by Lobo · · Score: 5, Funny

    Vacuums suck!

    --

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    Bite Me Fanboy!!
  4. Please don't! by maeka · · Score: 5, Funny
    This 100-year-old grandfather of electronics, used by musicians and audiophiles across the world...

    As a musician I resent being in the same sentence as an audiophile.
  5. modern electronics? by Jrod5000+at+RPI · · Score: 5, Insightful

    i find it interesting that vacuum tubes are considered _modern_ electronics. wouldn't the transistor be a better first milestone in modern electronics? what sort of electronics existed before 1904 anyway?? i would suggest that vacuum tubes marked the beginning of electronics in general.

  6. Re:Obsolete! Get a grip! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Vacuum tubes in all forms are pretty much the base of our electronic world, from the tube inside your microwave oven, to the transmitter tubes in TV and radio stations, to the power tubes for radar, to the ceramic triode inside the Pioneer and Voyager probes (still working after 30 years, tubes: unreliable?), to the CRT you're probably staring at right now, to the electron microscopes and the vacuum deposition chambers that build your semiconductors, I'd say you need to open your mind a little bit.
    Oh, and tube amps? Go to the closest audio shop you can find and go audition a Carver with some Totem Acoustics speakers...

  7. More than just Audio Amps by Malluck · · Score: 5, Informative

    Lets not forget the single largest use of vacuum tubes today, the CRT (cathod ray tube). There in your old TVs and moniters.

    Also every radio station and high power transmission you listen to is transmitted by large vacuum tubes. Silicon may never be able to replace these 10KW+ monsters.

  8. Aah, vacuum tubes by bigberk · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Our only hope in case of an EMP (/nuclear). Vacuum tubes may be ugly and power hungry, but they are much more likely to withstand huge electromagnetic pulses (malicious or otherwise).

  9. Vacuum tubes are just simply too by PotatoHead · · Score: 4, Interesting

    cool.

    They glow. Seriously, that's why I think they are cool. Anything that warms up has a nice feel to it. Old radios sound very interesting as they come to life. After the click of the power switch, first nothing, then a low hum that is replaced by subtle noise as it drops, then finally the audio creeps into the foreground. Soon after comes the smell of dust burning..

    I had a chance to build some vacuum tube projects in the late 80s. (We had lots of tubes and nothing else to do.) Made a power supply for the older speakers that featured electromagnets on the back to revive an old tube radio.

    Tubes forever!

  10. Will anyone improve tubes further? by Thai-Pan · · Score: 4, Interesting

    As a guitarist who is a tube nut (currently own a Mesa Mark IV and a Rivera TBR-1SL), I'm a bit disappointed to see that nobody has improved the vacuum tube at all since it was abandoned in the mainstream for the solid state transistor. It's a well known fact that guitar amplifiers produce more pleasing sounds when the tubes run hot, but amps which are known for running the tubes hot (such as the Vox AC30) are also known for blowing tubes. Why haven't we made tempered glass (Pyrex?) tubes built to run at higher temperaturesr. Why haven't we applied newer technologies to produce better tubes? It also seems odd to me that tubes made today don't seem to last any longer than tubes made 50 years ago.

  11. Audiophile nonsense! by Bilestoad · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Actually solid-state does render vacuum tubes obsolete, to the rational mind. Once you've admitted that the sound you really like just involves lots of second order distortion it's no big deal to make a processor using opamps or discrete transistors to add that distortion to a reliable, efficient, cheap amplifier. As many manufacturers have done! Boss, Line 6, and Roland to name just 3.

    You're also forgetting that the biggest contribution to the sound comes from the cabinet, speaker and transformer. Like I say, the valve just adds some nice distortion.

    You're not one of these people who believes in gold-plated connectors and $2500 power cables too are you?

    1. Re:Audiophile nonsense! by T-Ranger · · Score: 4, Informative

      Are you talking about sound PROduction, or sound REproduction?

      If you are talking about production, what you say is true. Electric guitars sound "better" with tube amps, because thats how they sound. The player is not "distorting" the sound, the guitar+amp is the sound. A harmon mute "distorts" a trumpet sound, but when you are trying to make that sound, kick ass.

      If you are talking about sound REproduction, bullshit. Discrete transistors distort the signal less, and you are trying to play back the recording AS CLOSE AS POSSIBLE TO HOW IT WAS RECORDED. Transistors will do that better then tubes, and have done so for decades. Tubes will fuck up the signal.

    2. Re:Audiophile nonsense! by antiMStroll · · Score: 4, Informative
      No one's playing "numbers games". You miss the point entirely, which once again is: neither amp is 'scientifically' audible at normal listening levels. The grandparent post's claim that tubes are prefered for their high second harmonic content is wrong, even at face value. Most tube amps are push-pull, a topology which cancels even harmonic distortion quite effectively.

      Your statement about distortion spectra is a funhouse mirror of the facts. Harmonic distortion is harmonically related. Transistor amps, having much higher open loop gain and therefore much higher feedback (which is how they achieve those low distortion numbers, some of the most linear simple gain devices every made are low gain 1930's direct-heated tubes) will have a harmonic distortion content shifted much higher because of it than typical tubes but it's still based on the excitation signal. Bass signals don't magically generate distortion between 10 kHz and 20 kHz. And this is far from an advantage, the least audible distortion is second harmonic. Higher odd-ordered harmonics are audible at levels much, much lower than second.

    3. Re:Audiophile nonsense! by Lisandro · · Score: 4, Insightful

      There's more to "amplifier sound" than just adding harmonics. If you like that sound, theres's a gadget called exciter that would do it for you. The distortion discussion is long and i feel, IMHO, than an amplfier that adds excessive unwanted distortion can't be called Hi-Fi to start with. But still...

      Valve amplifiers have a number of design implementation characteristics that make them desirable for audio. For starters, almost every single valve amplifier is transformer-coupled at the output, which gives it a distinctive sound "coloration". Valves have much better slew rates and open-loop freq. response than transistors, which are desirable characteristics in audio devices. And, for a number of reasons, valve amps usally drive speakers much better, resulting in, yes, better sound. Class-A amplifiers (specially the so-called "single ended ones", where just one device energizes the speaker) exhibit a similar behaviour, which is why they are usually agreed to "sound more valveish" than regular ones.
      Of course, valves have limited life, become microphonic over time and require manteinence. But that's part of the fun of it...

      The truth is, most valve amps DO sound better. It might not be by much, but the difference is appreciable, and some people are willing to pay for it. A special case is instrument amplifiers, where valves are still unmatched. If you ever played an electric guitar, you'll know.

      That being said, yes, i agree that a good set of speakers can make a bigger difference than a new amp. And the people who spend $2500 in interconnects and power cables (yes, they do) are insane, but don't think valves are obsolete. They have their place, even when in most areas transistors are more practical. For audio gear, instrument amplifiers, and power communications valve designs are still the norm. And, if you're using a CRT, you're pretty much looking at a huge device which works by the same principle as a vaccum valve.

  12. Toronto Star Section by tyman · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The Toronto Star did a front page write up in their @Biz section.

  13. vacuum leakage by flyingsquid · · Score: 4, Funny

    My professor told me how once he had a radiograph machine that wasn't working, and when he asked for an explanation, the repair technician pointed to the tube and patiently explained to him that "All the vacuum leaked out."

  14. Re:The quality of music is dropping by rco3 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I would disagree with that. Not that I'm a Cobain fan, but there's no reason that you should have to be a master of the Stratocaster in order to have a good-sounding amplifier. 0.001% is way too low a number. Maybe half or more of the people who own electrics are so hopeless that the amp doesn't matter, but not 9,999 out of 10,000.

    Having worked as an amp tech at a guitar shop for 6+ years, I can tell you that I saw a lot of poor and mediocre players with nice amps... but I almost NEVER saw a good player with a crap amp or a crap guitar.

    It's like saying that poor drivers shouldn't have good tires.

    OTOH, I had a customer with a small-box Marshall 50W head that was ASTONISHING. You put it on about 3, and it was as if you were... I don't know, man, it was just beautiful. Tone, responsivity, everything. and then you pumped it up to about 7... Smoothest and creamiest, most perfect overdrive I've ever heard to this day. It was that 0.001% amplifier that cried out for a 0.001% player. When I played it for the guy who owned it (after I put new tubes in and biased it), I played it as God intended - and he was flabbergasted! He'd never actually let the amp do the dirty work, he was using some crappy ADA tube preamp! That Marshall was like Anna Kournikova in a nunnery - a complete waste of natural perfection.

    Obviously I've got a bit of bias (HA! Bias! Get it? HA!) on the subject, but having two degrees in EE , 6+ years of guitar shop experience, and about a dozen albums recorded as musician or producer/engineer or both gives me what I consider to be a pretty good background in the science and art of guitar amplifier sound. However, it's all subjective. A good sound is the sound you like.

    --

    Ce n'est pas un vrai mouvement de robot!
  15. Re:Why did they make relay-based computers? by Propagandhi · · Score: 4, Funny

    Why didn't they make silicon based processors? Sand has been around forever..

  16. Don't forget who perfected them. by tie_guy_matt · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Yes vacuum tubes were invented 100 years ago, but it wasn't until much later that Howard Armstrong perfected them such that they could be used as amplifiers. I think he was certainly an un-sung hero. He perfected the vacuum tube, then he invented the super hederodyne circuit used in modern AM radios. Later he go so upset at the static and poor quality of AM that he turned around and invented FM. A great story with a tragic ending -- he ended up killing himself by jumping out of a tall building. This is of course after years of patent battles with RCA (the microsoft of their day.)

  17. Radio and TV Transmitters? by toonerh · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'm surprised no one realizes nearly ever radio or TV transmitter outputting 1,000's of watts or more uses tubes, albeit ceramic tubes rather than glass ones in most cases. And this is today in late 2004. Although in the most technical sense they are "amplifiers", they aren't audio amps. The transmitter tubes often have metal fins to radiate heat and a "chimney" to air cool the tube. This technology could be adapted to "hot" guitar amps, although they would be pricey.

  18. Re:Why did they make relay-based computers? by Bahumat · · Score: 5, Funny

    Actually, that's a myth. Sand was invented by the British shortly before World War I, as something to fill all their at-the-time useless surplus "cannonball catching bags".

    Unfortunately, even in the height of wartime, mass production far exceeded supply, and in a desperate move to cover up the multinational financial boondoggle and rescue what they could of the struggling world economy, the "sand" was dumped unceremoniously across africa and most of asia, as well as most poor, equotorial regions that thought the wealth of inventory would translate into increased economical benefit for their country.

    By the time they realized the sand was nearly worthless, the newly formed UN began work on quietly covering up and brainwashing the world into believing that "sand" had always been around. Often tankers continued to run aground for a few years, or jettisoned their now-worthless cargo of sand into the ocean, where it washed up and covered beaches.

    Tell everyone, before they silence you t]H]H]H NO CARRIER

    --
    "To pass through the jungle; silence, courtesy, ferocity, as the occasion demands." -- Kamau, "Proper Passage"
  19. Tubes are still used... by hpa · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ... and not just for "the warm sound." They're used because they can be built arbitrarily large much easier than you can build power MOSFETs. You can build them to produce hundreds of megawatts of RF energy with a single klystron; a linear amplifier tube can easily be built to handle megawatts.

    I haven't heard of any 1.22 GW vacuum tubes, but they certainly could be built. They'd be large.

  20. Re:Why did they make relay-based computers? by hpa · · Score: 4, Informative
    They (e.g. Konrad Zuse) built computers based on electromechanical relays because they were more reliable than vacuum tube circuits. I, like most people, thought that it was due to the vacuum tubes themselves, until I had the opportunity to meet Maurice Wilkes of EDSAC fame. He explained that, no, the tubes were plenty reliable, but the solid-carbon resistors used in those days didn't handle the high voltages used in the tube circuits very well, and thus constantly failed.

    Since relays are inherently switching elements as opposed to amplifier elements, they did not need resistors; the only necessary resistance is the one inherent in the relay coils themselves.

  21. De Forest made it all possible by Nick+Driver · · Score: 4, Informative

    The Fleming diode might have been the first electron tube (valve) but it was Lee De Forest who put in a control grid between the filament cathode and the anode plate and created a device that could amplify voltage, which made the whole world of useful electronics circuitry all possible. The 100th anniversity of De Forest's "Audion" triode is not until 2007.

  22. Re:Why did they make relay-based computers? by westlake · · Score: 4, Informative
    So why use relays, which are slower and less reliable?

    Telephone switches and relays were reliable and remanined in service for decades. Bell had a functional elecro-mechanical calculator using 450 relays with teletytpe output in 1939. Ballistic calculators built for WWII had 9000 relays, and there lies the problem. 9000 vacuum tube relays are power-hungry, hard to cool and need constant replacement.

  23. Tubes were mass produced, but not anymore by N3Bruce · · Score: 4, Interesting

    In all seriousness, the tube market today is relying on the sale of tubes that for the most part were made 50 years ago, or with tubes imported from the former Soviet Union or China. The Soviet/Chinese tubes have become a mainstay for hams running 1KW class linear amplifiers, and there is a steady market for types such as 4CX500, 3-500Z, and so on.

    Sadly, for many antique radio restorers, the prices and lack of availability of certain tube types keep many promising projects on the shelves, and many of the radios that used those tubes are usually found stripped of them. A late '20s or early '30s console will almost always have the type 45 tubes stripped out.

    At the same time, just about anyone who has acquired box lots of tubes will tell you that 90 percent of the tubes will never get used. A lot of these tubes were manufactured as replacements in 1960s era TV sets, and in a way were the first "integrated circuits", but have little use outside these roles. They were made by the tens of millions, but were made obsolete by the quick adoption of solid state circuitry in the 1970s. Few people collect or maintain 1960s era TV sets, but the old tubes stay around just as the 1mb memory sticks collect in many modern day geeks junk boxes. Other tubes, such as the combinations used in many '40s and '50s radios are available in adequate supply, either with tube vendors at hamfests or online for the forseeable future, or could be pirated from undesirable radios.

    It is just too expensive to do small scale tube production to satisfy the needs of a few thousand antique radio collectors and amplifier restorers. Inquiries were actually made to one of the Russian manufacturers to start producing new Type 45 or similar tubes. A run of a few thousand would satisfy the needs of collectors for years, but the unit costs are as high or higher than buying New Old Stock where it can be found.

    I have been somewhat inactive at the restoration game for a few years, but I remember when a major antique radio club looked into having one of the Russian or Eastern European manufacturers build some new highly sought after types, the combination of minimum quantities and unit cost would have risked tens of thousands of dollars, for a product that has a very limited market. Perhaps the ability to sell to a worldwide market easily, ala eBay might make it feasible today, but it would still be a risky proposition.

    There are other tube types that would be welcome if they could be produced economically with a limited run, such as 7360, 1L6, and probably a couple of dozen other types. Perhaps a modern cottage industry could pick up the slack.

  24. Tube Amplifier Emulation != Actual Tube Sound by TibbonZero · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This goes out to all of those that say there isn't a difference in tube amplification, and modelings of just extra 'distortion'. I offer two examples of such failures.

    As proof of this, I offer the Vox AC30HW, which I have had plenty of experience playing. Now the same company, has created a Vox Valvetronix amp or whatever crap they call it. I'd only assume that the company the manufactures the AC30 would be able to emulate it the best, however they do a terrible job. Hook up an A/B amp switch, and try to achieve similar sounds. Now push the Solid state POS to higher levels, how does it react. Try different playing dynamics, etc... Now try the same with the Vox. The vox only gets better, and the emulation, doesn't act at all like the real deal, nor sound ANYWHERE as good in depth, tone, or musical dynamics. In other words, it sounds like shit.

    Take a Cybertwin amp by Fender, and put that against a real 64 or 65 Fender Twin with great tubes in it, that has been maintained well. Not even in the same ballpark.

    So if the manufactures themselves can't even get it right, who can? I'm sure at some point it can be done, but just the A/D and D/A conversion and poor clocking on these digital amps kills it from the start.

    --
    Tibbon
    tibbon.com