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Gentoo 2005.0: A Live CD And [No] Graphical Installer
Sunsetbeach writes "zdnet.co.uk reports in this article that 'The next version of Gentoo, 2005.0, will also include a graphical installer that will allow users to automatically install the same set-up of Gentoo on multiple machines, according to Gianelloni.' " The article distinguishes the upcoming live disk from the (available) Gentoo Live CD; the new one will contain a fully functioning system ala Knoppix. Update: 11/30 23:09 GMT by M : Gentoo now has a clarification posted; the next Gentoo release will not have a graphical installer, although it is planned for the future.
ummm, vida linux is gentoo with a graphical installer. i fail so see how the next 2005 release will be any different from vida.
http://gentoo.vidalinux.com/
What's planned for 2005.0 is an experimental test release of the new graphical installer. It'll be there for people who want to test it, but don't go relying on the thing.
I first switched to Gentoo because the bloody fonts "just worked". How sad is that. On a serious note, the user base is one major reason to stick with Gentoo. There is always excellent help and support in the forums, and snobby attitudes are kept in check.
In Soviet America the banks rob you!
You'll see pretty much any Linux distro use a "full gig" of RAM just running KDE if you let it sit long enough. It's how linux manages memory.
so I could still idle on IRC and such
You know, the 2004.3 livecds (or at least the x86 and amd64 ones) do include irssi for that...
Ingrid took the things I said completely out of context and ran with them.
At no point did I ever tell her that we would have a graphical installer on 2005.0's release media. I also did not tell her that the 2005.0 release would be a Knoppix-style LiveCD, as it will, in fact, be exactly like the 2004.3 release with the Minimal, Universal, and Packages CD images.
What I did tell her is that we will have an experimental LiveCD with our first limited functionality beta of the installer, which will most likely be curses-based only and not have any enterprise-ready features available for use.
This is exactly why you demand to have interviews done via email and not the phone, especially when speaking with someone from another country, and be sure to ask to proof read the article for accuracy before it prints.
If I see one more of this In Korea.... I'm going to add it to the slashdot subculture on wikipedia!
...In Japan
In fact it's already available on wikipedia
Profit!
Parent is 100% correct. Even on the new CD, one would have to type "setup" to load up the installer and use it.
It depends on whether reiser 4 makes it into the vanilla kernel in time or not. Gentoo no longer patch their kernels with large patchsets that are likely to breaks things.
I use KDE on gentoo and have a gig of RAM. With several windows open KDE uses 10% (100MB) of that RAM. I have another machine that uses KDE with 512 MB of RAM and KDE hogs a little less on that (60-80 MB). I hardly ever hit swap on either machine. Application data often sits in RAM after being closed, and will just get re-allocated down the line if RAM is needed.
Actually the worst memory hog (by far) is Java. Java seems to be the only thing that makes me hit swap on a regular basis.
So what if its not being developed? Many video postproduction houses and even Networks use the Video Toaster/Flyer (from NewTek, who is now making PC NLE systems with live switching capabilities) switcher/NLE which run on the Amiga. I personally have 2 Amigas on my desk over there (one of them is down right now as my toaster card needs to go out for recalibration). Without Amiga, there would be no LightWave!
--
Let it be, let it be, my Amiga works for me </SIG>
Video Production Support
Except that under Linux it's because of caching and gets freed up as soon as it's needed.
- Leon Mergen
http://www.solatis.com
the real advantage is being able to "turn off" certain sections of the code with USE flags. Did you know bitchx can be compiled to use gnome? when the debian maintainers compile bitchx for you, they decide whether or not to include it. you don't have the choice.
/etc/make.conf file. my flags on my workstation are the following:
with gentoo, you can use the USE flags
USE="-gnome" emerge bitchx
USE="gnome" emerge bitchx
This allows me to say if I want gnome installed or not if it's just an optional feature on bitchx. Since I mostly use kde, I can do without installing all the gnome dependencies.
to see a list of flags for any given package (and their default status)
emerge -vp bitchx
[ebuild N ] net-irc/bitchx-1.1-r1 -cdrom -cjk -debug +esd -gnome +gtk -ipv6 +ncurses +ssl +xmms 2,473 kB
Then you can choose to enable them or not.
There are a lot of common flags, USE flags which you can set in the
USE="3dnow amd alsa bzlib cddb cdparanoia curl dnd dvd -dvdr ethereal flash gd glut -gnome gstreamer icq image magemagick imap java javascript kerberos krb4 ldap lm_sensors maildir md5sum mime ming mmx -mozilla mplayer msn jack ooo-kde openssh pdf rtc samba sasl threads type1 tiff usb xvid"
and this isn't even close to all of them.
If you'd like to learn more, let me know. I try not to be a zealot:)
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There's a good reason that the X configuration stuff is in the Desktop section: for some uses, linux doesn't need (or even have any benefit from) a gui.
That said, I do think the install docs should provide a link to the X configuration under a heading like "Where do I go from here?"
Y'know, you blow up one sun and suddenly everyone expects you to walk on water.
As far as I know portage doesn't update configuration files for you. It tells you to run etc-update if there are (possible) updates to configuration files.
/etc/fstab to the installation default when I update baselayout (or whatever package fstab comes in), so I could tell portage to just keep its claws away from that file.
etc-update allows you to review the changes and apply or ignore them as you see fit.
I believe you can even protect certain files so portage stops bugging you about them, i.e. I'm pretty sure I do not want to revert
Seriously, Gentoo doesn't overwrite your config files, it drops updated files with the ._cfg prefix in the directory with a number and the name of the file as a suffix. You simply have to do a find in /etc to find them all diff them to see if something important has changed in latest version. But this has nothing to do with the distro. If a package is changing its configuration files format o is adding or removing important stuff you will always have to modify your config file if you want to use the latest version. So, if you don't want to spend time migrating a package version to another one, just don't upgrade in the first place...
Achille Talon
Hop!
You'll also still have to compile all the software for your system, something you don't have to do, but can do using FreeBSD.
No you don't! Have you used gentoo? "emerge -k" installs the binaries if they are available. For most packages, they are available.
Not everything is analogous to cars. Car analogies rarely work.
"Gentoo's current installation process makes it impossible to have a functioning system without knowing the following:
* How partition and disk structure works
* How GCC actually functions
* How the kernel is installed and configured
* At least something about runlevels and init scripts"
That's utter rubbish.
The partitioning / disk structure is basically a 1-time following of the Gentoo manual. You can get through it without knowing anything other than the simple fact partitions reside on a single hard disk. That's hardly knowing how it all works.
How GCC functions? Don't make me laugh. "emerge foo" does not induce an in-depth understanding of GCC. Copying the basic CFLAGS from the documentation doesn't either. I'd wager the majority of Gentoo users (bearing in mind I'm a Gentoo user who has accumulated >2600 forum posts) don't really understand GCC at all other than knowing it's a tool that compiles.
As to how the kernel is installed and configured, most people somewhat bumble through that and a little thing called 'genkernel' is making said bumbling a lot easier to do.
As for runlevels and init scripts, again it's just a case of following the docs rather than knowing what they are and how they work.
Please, do not confuse "being aware they exist" and "understanding", with the term 'knowing' implying the latter. And Gentoo is a MILLION miles away from LFS. Aside from the fact (almost) everything gets compiled and they are both Linux, there really just aren't that many similarities.
I would suggest that it's more the time taken to set up Gentoo rather than the difficulty of it (which isn't that difficult for the majority whom the docs serve well) is what provides the entry barrier. Don't get me wrong, for the willing it can be an invaluable process that does introduce them to the fundamental Linux concepts. BUT the majority of users who get through the installation process are still woefully short of the knowledge needed to maintain a healthy system and you get a lot of silly posts in the forums as a consequence. I should know, I've made a few myself.
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not really the speed. At the time I tried it, early in 2004, it seemed to be the only readily available distribution that actually worked with AMD64. Fedora Core claimed to have a distro for it, but I read a lot of horror stories; Mandrake and others only seemed to have commercial payware products for the platform.
I did have problems with Gentoo (when using USB2 the whole computer slowed down, hotplug didn't seem to work right, etc.), so perhaps this was more a reflection of the maturity of Linux distros in general on the AMD64 platform. I also didn't really find it much faster that other distributions I've used on x86 machines.
I guess I'll have to try again soon. I'm currently stuck on WinXP since I needed something that worked, but it may be time to survey the current 64 bit landscape.
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In X-Windows the client serves YOU!
Not necessarily. The great thing about Portage is the ability to interactively update config. files using the utility 'etc-update'. This tool will list all updated config. files, automatically merge inconsequential changes like whitespace, allow the useer to compare the differences side by side, pick one version over the other, manually edit the final result, and, most importantly, undo the changes when things go horribly wrong (provided you don't delete the temporary files).
This version of *GENTOO* (a reasonably new distribution, typically used by hardcore linux geeks) now has a graphical install.
Redhat (now Fedora), SuSe, and others, have had graphical installs since.. Well.. I honestly dont remember. Several years, at least. I know Redhat 6 had it, and thats pretty ancient now.
Comparing Linux install to Windows install is a red herring, since *MOST* windows users wouldnt be able to install *EITHER*.
But my telling you about it is going to do nothing for you - you need to try yourself. Find yourself a spare machine (doesnt have to be bleeding new, some old 500Mhz machine would be fine), and grab a copy of Fedora Core2 or 3 (may not be the 'perfect' choice, but for getting an idea of Linux, its probably a good choice), and install it. Play with it. Install some apps. Break it. Reinstall it. etc.
See: this follow up posting under the original article
The 2.6 kernel will become the default kernel, not just for the liveCD, (which as been that since 2004.3) but for the distro. Instead of emerge gentoo-dev-sources for 2.6, it will be emerge gentoo-sources.