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Ph.D Employment?
Dr. Nik asks: "As a recent Ph.D graduate in EE, I am curious to know where other Ph.Ds are employed. More specifically, I would be interested in knowing if you have moved into careers other than academic. Have you veered from the path? Are you still working in the field, or have you completely changed direction?" A couple of months ago, Slashdot was polled for PhDs in IT. How well do other areas of the workforce compare when it comes to hiring Doctorates?
Google hires a lot of doctors. Granted, most of them are doctors of CS. But still.
The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
Go back to school and get an MBA as well... should only take you 3 years... then you can a) have an awesome number of jobs to pick from or b) start your own company and do what you really want to do.
Having an MBA and a PhD in EE will guarantee you plenty of funding for any idea you have. VCs and Traditional lenders will be knocking down your door to give you money.
A fool throws a stone into a well and a thousand sages can not remove it.
I have never worked in academia and have never seriously considered it, other than as a part time adjunct faculty member. Industry has a strong need for PhD's; you have to look hard and be somewhat creative to find the opportunities but they are there.
>> As a recent PhD graduate in EE, I am curious to know where other PhDs are employed
Uh...shouldn't you have thought about this a couple years ago?
VCs never "knock down your door to give you money." Even if you are God's own biotech researcher.
Personally, I think if you want to go the entrepreneurship route, you'll learn in 3 years from starting your own business and bootstrapping (even if it ultimately fails) than getting an MBA.
MBAs are for middle managers.
VC's don't knock on doors. You knock on theirs, hat in hand, while you smile and wonder to yourself if these bozos have clothing that isnt black and is not in turtleneck styles.
And no, most of them will waste your time, will happily tell others of your ideas, and will be perfectly happy to go through the due dilligence to the point of the term sheet, only to pull back because their oat bran did not work that morning.
After all, its not their time and money they are wasting by dragging you through these processes. Its not like you have work to do, like, I dunno, generate revenue so you can pay your staff.
Not that I am complaining or anything.
Yeah, been down the vulture capital market a few times. No, it has never been anything but a waste of time. Yes, our idea/product is pretty cool, getting some attention. Yes, it will wind up being self funded.
Revenue (and equity) are terrible things to waste. Maybe there are some good VC's out there. I just haven't met them yet. Until one comes along which offers something of value (not just the capital), it is just not worth dealing with them. Too bad they are one of the few markets for capital. You can always use another business to fund your ideas. I would strongly recommend you stay away from VC's. Even if you have a great idea, wonderful business plan, and all that. The pain, loss of control, and dilution are not worth the capital that you need.
At the end of my degree I had come to the conclusion that academia wasn't for me. Too many long hours with all the ridiculous politics of every workplace. So I joined the industrial workforce and am quite happy working in the general area of my research. But you'll find that wherever you go, it won't be exactly the same thing you've been working on. Nor should it be.
My degree enabled me to pick exactly the kind of job I wanted. I felt completely comfortable turning jobs down if they weren't what I was looking for. Because no matter what else, the fact that you finished a Ph.D. is a big plus in your portfolio when it comes to reliability and dedication.
There are plenty of EE/CS companies looking for Ph.D.'s. But don't go looking on Monster. Talk to your advisor and get "ins" where you need them. That's how it works. No one in H.R. has any idea what you did or how it applies to the company you may be looking at. Get a technical contact and pursue it.
Where I work (Lincoln Labs www.ll.mit.edu) all of the job openings require a masters or a phd (usually a phd). Any place like that would be a good place to start.
this is the most important sig ever! In your face 446154!
The question posted is "How well do other areas of the workforce compare when it comes to hiring Doctorates?"
How the hell do you hire a doctorate?
Go into the private sector if you don't like any of the above reasons
..........FULL STOP.
If you are job hunting, try applying to companies run by people with doctorates; they seem more likely to hire based on that degree, since they understand the pain and effort it takes to get one. I have been at a couple of start-ups with PhDs in prominent positions, and they were respectful and gave large consideration to applicants with similar academic accomplishments.
It's not to say that you need any sort of degree at all to succeed in the IT field; indeed, some of the best programmers I have ever met scarcely possessed a high school diploma. I'm just recommending this strategy because people have a natural tendency to hire their own.
it's = "it is"; its = possessive. E.g., it's flapping its wings.
all the super-genius PhDs were employed as story editors by Slashdot . . . ;>
This is unbelieveable. A PhD is a license to print money. With what you know, you create your own job. You never work for someone else for as long as you live.
If this isn't patently obvious, then your education was a waste and you don't deserve the title Doctor of Philosophy.
[o]_O
Interviewed for professorships, took a research job (microbiology) with the federal government instead. Decent gig - the pay is not what I'd get in industry, but the job security is better, and I don't have to teach or constantly hustle for grant money the way my univerisity colleagues do.
The man who does not read good books has no advantage over the man who cannot read them. - Mark Twain
do not sell your mind. go do your own thing.
if you have a phd in engineering... stop. relax, take 6 months and THINK about what you want to do with the next 30 years of your life. Think really big. Got that? OK next take another 6 months and create a 5-year plan to make the first step of the 30-year plan work. then go do it. When it's done, repeat (but this time use 25, not 30)
Trust yourself. your ideas will be just as good as anyone else's, probably better. DO NOT go look for a job. you will be very disappointed.
in my case I worked 2 years, then 1 more, then started the above plan and I've never had a "job" since.
and I'm a Taxi Driver
Reality has a liberal bias
Engineering profs start with 9 month salaries closer to $90k...typically going up to a 9 month salary of $120-150k after 10 years at full prof, with summers to work on research or on the side. With tenure, you become un-fire-able, and can choose side work such as
1) editing journals
2) writing books/chapters
3) consulting/business
4) banging TAs
Some of these are more lucrative than others.
Now, for sure, non-academic engineers tend to make more money. But academia has its benefits. And, it is always easy to walk out of academia and into the commercial world - the other direction is quite a bit tougher. With an EE PhD and the ability to be focussed and work hard, you are going to eat fine either way you go.
Remember:
You get better tips if you wear raggedy clothes and print "god bless you" somewhere on your sign. Doubleplus points if you have a baby carriage (don't get a real baby, or CPS will come and get you).
Make sure you stand on the corner just off an off-ramp that leads to an affluent area. Poor people don't give sh~t for "donations."
"Will work for food" is played out; don't use it. Come up with something original & funny and you'll get a laugh and maybe a fiver.
Yeah, right.
Strange, I've never heard this question before, perhaps most of my friends and collegues took the answer for granted.
;) In normal cases, you should be able to be dropped in a project and absorb what has been done and be a constructive member faster.
... We're all working on software optimisation for speed and power consumption, conception of new devices and implementation of OS's on these devices, ...
;)
:) I just tried to abstract a rule from the bulk of the ppl I know in CS and EE.
To my experience, there are a number of reasons a prospective employer would hire you:
1. You have specific knowledge, difficult to come by and often (or not) a result of your PhD work. Considering that PhDs are often high level research and often not ready for direct use in industry in the next few years (typical planning of management), you might be out of luck here.
2. He has confidence in your abilities to take in a lot of information in a short period of time and use it: you are able to learn fast. This should indeed be true
All my collegues that I know of that have graduated over the last years, me and from what I know, the collegues that already have a job and will graduate in the coming months; are all employed in the same industry working on the hardware/software boundary.
This is a particular area where you need a deep insight on several hardware components, memory usage, power consumption, clocks, busses,
Part of e.g. designing new platforms is being able to absorb existing devices compare them and make a good choice in this large number of possibilities (quickly); see point 2
To my experience, this is a particular area where PhDs in EE have a much higher added value when compared to CS PhDs (granted, they have a much higher competence in high level modelling; I guess this difference is exactly what explains their affinity to Java and ours to C).
And yes, there are exceptions of course; I at least know one CS PhD who has done _a lot_ of linux kernel work
Genius doesn't work on an assembly line basis. You can't simply say, "Today I will be brilliant."
. But academia has its benefits. And, it is always easy to walk out of academia and into the commercial world - the other direction is quite a bit tougher
I really think it is the other way around. It is much much easier to go back to academia if you have tons of experience in the commercial world, than to go to the commercial world from the academia.
An example is the recently hired Dean of my previous university. He only has a master degree. I'm serious with that, but he has a truckload experience in the industry, especially in the photonic switching, free space optical interconnect. I'm pretty sure the DWDM technology being used much in networking nowadays involve one or two of his patents.
Pretty much any investment bank on Wall St. is going to hire you straight off and give you about 3 years head start on the salary curve compared to BS and MBAs. Phd with knowledge of stochastic calculus of variations is exactly the kind of mathematical background that these people are looking at. Expect a six figure starting salary before bonus. Hours may be a little long (but so would they be in academia) but given your background you should be able to get in the research side translating to a less stressfull job. Especially in company like G-S this would be close to an academic environment (well as close to it as you can get in wall st. anyway).
I'm working at the National Library of Medicine, part of NIH. I'm doing research in medical visualization and computer graphics. After finishing my Ph.D. in computer science I took a job as a research staff member at another university. Then after a couple years I came to NLM.
I always knew I didn't want to be tenure-track faculty. It's a lot of things I don't like (teaching, grant writing, committees, trying to churn out papers) and not much time for what I do like (hacking code). As a researcher I get to do what I like, for the most part. I might try an industry job next, since it might be more focused and product oriented.
To be more specific, I have specialised in the area of wireless systems designing high data rate systems (physical layer, radios, etc.). I also have experience in industry designing wireless products for a well-known company in North America. I am also currently employed in what many here would consider a low paying job (making wages that are below industry standard for those interested in knowing).
My purpose in asking this question was to get an idea of what people with PhD's are doing these days.
As one poster said.. shouldn't I have thought about this before doing a PhD? The answer is NO.
I believe that the quest to understand oneself and what makes one tick never ends. A PhD is never "SET FOR LIFE". Just like anybody else, we simply look for what challenges us most. Money is never the reason for doing a PhD. No one in their right mind would think of a PhD as a licence to print money.
thank you and I look forward to your responses.
regards,
Dr. Nik
To be more specific, I have specialised in the area of wireless systems optimising high data rate systems at the physical layer. I also have experience in industry designing wireless products for a well-known company in North America. I am basically a 'radio-subsystem-guy'. I am also currently employed in what many here would consider a low paying job (making wages that are below industry standard for those interested in knowing). But I digress. My purpose in asking this question was to get an idea of what people with PhD's are doing these days. Is academia the preferred route these days or are EE's finding industry at the forefront of technology? As one poster said.. shouldn't I have thought about this before doing a PhD? The answer is NO. I did a PhD for the love of it, not because the market told me to do so. A PhD is never "SET FOR LIFE". Just like anybody else, we simply look for what challenges us most. Money is never the reason for doing a PhD. No one in their right mind would think of a PhD as a licence to print money. thank you and I look forward to your responses. regards, Dr. Nik
Here in Syracuse, NY Lockheed Martin just landed a lucrative contract with the government to create the next generation of radar. They are hiring over 500 people in the next few months. If you can't find it via google or just need some more info, email me at trompelamort AT gmail.com.
I would never hire someone who had
a question like that.
Well, I interviewed for a semiconductor company that was looking for a Ph. D. Electrical Engineer to fill the position.
For the record, I have a B.Ch.E. And it says as much on my resume. No idea what the fuck they were thinking. It was an awkward interview. "Soo...uh...I see you don't have a doctorate, or...er...um...any eduction in Electrical Engineering at all...er...I don't know what I'm supposed to ask you."
Andyway, I suggest you look around. Maybe you'll find a company looking for a PhD EE that actually interviews PhD EEs
My dingo ate your honor student.
This is funny not only because it is true, but also because it is (intentionally?) self-parody.
Way to go!
I tried to add something about software "engineering" having to ship products while lit-crit types don't have to write a novel anyone would ever read. But in the world of ESR and Slashdot, you are free to judge technological matters without ever doing much more engineering than unwrapping boxes from NewEgg. Your logic still defeats me!
While #4 is promising, remember that the TAs he deals with would be most likely EE graduate students. Not exactly the finest pickings.
After two years of soul-crushing work in a university for far less than I was worth, I switched into quantitative finance. I've never been happier.
The pay is better, the hours are better, I'm treated with a degree of respect. Never would have happened if I had stayed in academia.
At least most of my PhD friends got into that. This will allow you to broaden your horizons, as well as getting paid well.
- This and all my posts are public domain. I am a Physicist. I am not your Physicist. This is not Physically advice