Student Logs Teachers Keystrokes

handy_vandal writes "A 16-year-old student has been charged with a misdemeanor for rigging a keystroke-recording device onto a teacher's computer. School district police received a tip from students that the boy was trying to sell answers to final exams. The District Attorney's Office has charged the teen with breach of computer information, a Class B misdemeanor punishable by a fine of up to $2,000 and up to 180 days in jail. This sort of thing has happened before. The problem is so pervasive that the GRE board has switched from computers back to paper and pencil."

Comments

My wife just started teaching...

[AdamTrace]

My wife just started teaching 9th and 10th grade high school math. I gave her a little crash course on basic computer security (including watching out for keyloggers!)

It's common knowledge that the kids are smarter than the teachers, computer-wise... but hasn't it always been that way?

Re:My wife just started teaching...

[CaptainCarrot]

Not before computers became common household items it wasn't. If your house had a TTY clacking away in the corner, connected up to the good ol' Data General Nova (my high school's computer lab setup before they dumped it for a room full of TRS-80s) then you had an extremely unusual childhood.

Re:My wife just started teaching...

[Techguy666]

Kids tend to be better than teachers - or adults in general - at certain skills because they have the time to tinker and explore.

As a teacher or other professional, you are employed to do a specific job for 8 hours a day. You then go home and have only about another 8 hours to shop, clean the house, cook, visit friends, etc... When you are on the computer, it's to complete a task such as responding to e-mail and then you're off to another task such as laundry. Kids get on the computer and they *play*. They'll meander about, doing various tasks on the machine while exploring and experimenting. That gives them several hours of hands-on time per day compared to the average adult, plus what they've learned are not limited to e-mail or word processing.

Security

[captnitro]

Most people I meet don't necessarily think computer security is a problem past virii and adware -- and it shouldn't necessarily be their problem, it requires better design. But could their be a lesson here as to the importance of real-life, practical security needs?

Re:Security

[CAIMLAS]

The problem here, though, is that it's difficult to design a better human - humans being, after all, the biggest footfall in physical security, largely due to not knowing shit about physical security or proper passwords.

It takes many years (about 12 + 4 here in the states) to program a human, and for years the quality of that programming has decreased drastically due to bored, underpaid programmers and poor programming procedures in general. I'm not sure how you want to make the humans better, but currently there's no practical method aside from the non-profit "open source" method of human programming.

Re:Security

[gad_zuki!]

> The problem here, though, is that it's difficult to design a better human

Actually, I'd argue that both humans are designed quite well, its just one of them has a skill set that allows him to victimize the other with near impunity, as this case is a deviation from the norm.

A great deal of law is based on the concept that there will be those who have some power to take, coerce, hurt, etc others. In this case the student used his skills (albiet pathetic in terms of hacking) to vicitmize the teacher and make a profit off of stolen information.

In the context of a society where the world is shifting from property-based to information-based transactions and wealth, this is a very important distinction. The world is very much changing and it is up to the legislature and the judiciary to keep up with the changes. It wasnt too long ago where electronic identify theft wasnt really seen as a problem and now most states have specific laws on targetting this.

Of course, one can argue "well laws are already in place for x or y" but that is a half-truth at best. Many wiretap laws and false identification laws are worded in a specific way which gives the offender an unfair advantage. Telephone based wiretap laws do not protect people from sniffers (usually). Its also easy to imagine a lot of people screaming "We already have these laws for the telegraph" or somesuch when these laws were proposed. They fail to realize the fundamental difference between these technologies and their expliots.

Now, this case does involve a minor, which of course leaves the DA to opportunity to try him as such. It also leaves the jury the option to give a low sentance if they believe the defendant is worthy of it. This is a built-in checks and balance system to help control over-zealous prosecutors. In fact, a jury has no legal obligation to obey the law and can use a method called jury nullification to toss out the case on the premise that the law is unfair in itself.

The "wild west" mentality of information technology has to fold as more and more vital and important things are trusted to computers, networks, etc. The "hackers ethic" from the 70's and 80's certainly does not apply when we have people putting their lives on their computers, be it all the financial transactions, bank passwords, or even baby pictures. In short, the stakes have been raise by quite a bit and sending violators to county jail or even state prison cannot be dismissed out of hand as being a dystopian ideal.

A misdemeanor, frankly, for information theft and sale-of isnt that bad. Many computer crimes are felonies and personally I think the use of keyloggers should automatically be a felony as they void encryption schemes are are promiscious, thus unable to tell the difference between homework answers and bank passwords or pgp passphrases.

I would also like to see the hardware keylogger made illegal to sell, transport, or posses. And I would love to see a user's "bill of rights" which protects them from these threats wherever they originate, be it from the kid in some class or from the government doing something unethical without a warrant.

Re:Security

[Anonymous Coward]

is a problem past virii and adware

Enough, already!

virus (vrs) n. pl. viruses

virii is *not* correct, not even if you think you're writing Latin. If you want to pretend to be smart, use viri (altough that's not entirely correct either). (see also here)

Oh, and while I'm at it:

it's box, boxes. Not boxen, not boxi, not boxii..

You reap what you sow

[Dancin_Santa]

Every computer added to a classroom is another nail in the coffin of modern teaching. There is nothing added by adding a computer, but much is taken away.

Computers ought to remain in "computer labs" and perhaps on the desks for specialized "computer classes", but they definitely don't belong anywhere else.

Creative usage of computers for teaching is a copout on the kids. By removing the teacher/student relationship and replacing it with an inanimate object, the kids lose out on a great deal of education. This is why home-schooled kids typically do better in college than "computer schooled" kids do.

Is it any surprise that the more technology becomes a part of these kids' educations, the more likely it is that the bad apples are going to find ways to exploit the system?

Re:You reap what you sow

[sunami]

I disagree. A computer can be used to enhance the teaching environment, if used correctly. I do however realize that this will not always happen. But, why can the computers not be used for aiding the teaching process. A power-point of notes that you are explaining, allowing the kids both visual, written, and audio versions of the information.

Even if the computers are not used for teaching, they are used for grades. This by far speeds the process of getting grades back to the kids. It also has led to teachers putting grades online (passworded) so that students and their parents can, at any point, look up each individual grade that has been entered. This allows for parents to get more involved in the guiding of their kids, realizing when grades are falling, before it's too late to pull them up.

Re:You reap what you sow

[I am the Bullgod]

Yeah, kids have suffered over the ages by depending on inanimate learning tools(books, blackboards, pencils, etc.).

I agree that education should not degenerate to the point where kids are plugged into them all day (like the clones in Star Wars Episode II). However, computers can (and should) be used to complement the teacher's lesson plan and to allow the teacher to spend less time on busy work (manually grading papers, etc.) and more time interacting with the students.

As for abuses of technology, kids have always found ways to cheat and always will. Anyone remember Bluto dumpster-diving for the mimeograph negative?

Re:You reap what you sow

[Derkec]

It's hard though. A lot of times school budgets get grants (government and otherwise) that can only be spent on technology. It's not always the school's dumb decision on where the money gets spent.

Re:You reap what you sow

[Geekbot]

That is such a giant blanket statement. You are way so far to the extreme it makes it hard for people to accept the good points of your post.
Computers are misused by many teachers. I work for a school and my job is to make sure teachers understand how to use their computers, and when and why.

Homeschooled kids will do better. One of the reasons is that a homeschooled kid isn't competing with 29 other kids for the teacher's attention. Sometimes a computer can give a student instant feedback that is just not otherwise possible with the size of current classrooms.

Computers in the classroom allow teachers to present information in different ways, 3-D modeling, conferencing, visualizing abstract concepts, etc.

Federal law states that by the end of 8th grade that a student should be computer literate. There are many research skills that are necessary to understand on the computer. When was the last time you saw a card catalog that was not on a computer?

And how is a school district going to keep track of all of their attendance, discipline issues, etc, without a computer in the classroom? Districts are becoming more efficient and saving money by using programs to enter and track student information including grades and attendance. How would this happen without a classroom computer? And are you suggesting that every teacher should be forced to handwrite every assignment and test they give to the student? Where are they going to type it up without a classroom computer?

Technology is just a word for the tools we use. Tools are not evil, they are not detrimental just for existing. Isn't it more true that the problem is that students aren't using how or when to use the correct tools? Do I understand that you are stating that computers should be used for computer classes but not used to enhance the core curriculum? What a waste of time and money to teach a kid to use a computer if you don't believe computers are beneficial.

Re:You reap what you sow

[IO ERROR]

Is it any surprise that the more technology becomes a part of these kids' educations, the more likely it is that the bad apples are going to find ways to exploit the system?

Whatever happened to actually studying and learning something? We've always had these "bad apples" who would rather cheat than learn, and the computers certainly do make things more interesting, but the real question is, why are these people more inclined to cheat their way through school, and what can be done to solve the underlying problem?

Re:You reap what you sow

[WebCrapper]

This has always annoyed me. When schools spend more time and money on their sports program than any other aspect of the school, there is something wrong. They all strive to be the best at sports...gag.

I went to a high school that spent several million on thier sports program each year, but would have run of the mill computers around and not keep them up to date. They ran the very first version of Windows 95 (the one where you could close the start button) until late 1998 when I graduated. 2 years later, I visited the school and found they where using the same OS - couldn't believe it. But oh my, the parents would scream if they let the football program slip a little...

Re:You reap what you sow

[808140]

As someone who majored in pure math, I have to disagree vehemently. Computers don't belong in math classes, period, and overhead projectors (ack) aren't a whole lot better.

No, a good math class contains an engaging teacher, students with pencils and paper, and one of a blackboard or white board -- both of which have advantages and disadvantages for the teacher, but are mostly the same to the students. Models may be useful as well, if you're doing something low-dimensional that benefits from visualisation.

Computers can't do math -- all they can do, really, is computation. Which is not to say that they can't be useful, but to introduce them into a math class is to underscore computation in mathematics, when what is important is logic. Math is much more a subset of philosophy than science, a fact commonly misunderstood by non-math people. These non-math people unfortunately include administrators, who in the interest of "bringing computers into the classroom" are wont to force math teachers to use these new-fangled gizmos.

There is no substitute for explanation, for discourse, or for student/teacher bond. Any subject can be exciting and interesting to any student as long as the teacher is able to communicate his or her love of the subject in a way that the student can identify with. Looking at a computer screen in a classroom is tremendously dull, and while it might be manipulated effectively by the teacher, it cannot be manipulated effectively by a student that might want to jump in with his or her insight. Math is not a spectator sport -- student involvement is essential to proper understanding of the subject matter, especially at more advanced levels.

This, incidentally, is one of the reasons that I hate overhead projectors -- they project an 8x11 sized scrap of transparency onto a light surface. This might be great for the teacher, but when you want to bring a student up, it's much harder to find a place for him or her to find a place to write on that tiny scrap.

Further, overhead projectors encourage what is without a doubt the most sinful teaching style -- note preparation. Especially in math, which requires a great deal of thought -- a lubricated brain, so to speak -- boring lectures cannot be tolerated, if you expect your students to come away with an even cursory understanding of the material you present. A teacher that writes out all his notes on transparency is able to simply put up the notes, one sheet at a time, and comment. You know the style! God, just thinking about it makes me want to puke. It encourages a rut, discourages tangential conversations, proofs, and forays -- in other words, it's no better than just reading the textbook to the student, which he or she is quite capable of doing him/herself, thank you very much.

The thought of powerpoint is even worse -- all the fun of the overhead projector with even less editability.

Furthermore, the use of calculators is just silly. Counting is for computers. Proof is for mathematicians. Why on earth would you ever need to cope with numbers more complex than a few rather small natural numbers as coefficients? You might have a case in a trigonometry class but you said you were doing multivariate analysis.

Computers' place in math: a computer lab somewhere with Mathematica/Maple for the undergrads that haven't yet learned to divorce the abstract from the tangible. Certainly not in the classroom, except for very specific purposes (visualisation of recurrences, differential equations, vector fields, that sort of thing, in low-d situations).

Re:You reap what you sow

[Anonymous Coward]

I can't believe you think that's a good idea. What's the point of the teacher even being in the classroom then? We could have all the teachers in one big room, and have them efficiently check the work of hundreds of students each, remotely, over the Internet! Sure would be efficient!

Hello Oversight?

[NoTheory]

Who is letting kids install stuff on school gear?

What kind of idiot...

[FireballX301]

...uses a keylogger DONGLE?

Seriously. Did he think that the teacher wouldn't notice a DONGLE that was added to the computer?

Please. At least use a trojan-type keylogger, or something even slightly covert.

Of course, they could stay with computers

[RLiegh]

if they placed the computers (with the tests) someplace better. As /.ers know, the most important part of computer security is physical access.

Remove the computer (with the tests) to somewhere that only teachers' can go, and you'll mostly eliminate the problem, without resorting to pen and paper.

Calm down

[Pan T. Hose]

Before we all start to scream bloody murder this, fascist law that, I would like to say that this kid got what he deserved. He is not a victim here. The victim is a teacher whose privacy was violated and the attorney deserves our support this time. This case is completely unlike the one of DVD John or Kevin Mitnick. The 180 days in jail is nothing in this case. So please, let's stop our knee-jerk reactions and congratulate the law enforcement just once when they in fact have done a good job. No need to panic here, no need to remind about 1984 or the Third Reich, because this kid was the one who was spying on his teacher and who belongs in jail. This story is only about "Your Rights Online" because your rights could be as easily violated like the rights of that teacher were violated by his student. We need to be protected from spies, be them MIAA, NSA or our students.

Re:Calm down

[Sheetrock]

I humbly disagree. I think that just about everybody here has in some way or another violated a computer law, be it stealing music online, peeking at somebody else's e-mail account, or even using a library machine in a lavicious manner.

Computer crimes are elevated well beyond reason by a public afraid of the boggyman that technology represents to a luddite populace. We've been throwing people in jail for decades, whether it's a "phreaker" who can whistle a 2600hz "red box" tone back in the days of Ma Bell or a social recluse that demonstrates a flaw in a school computer security system only to face "justice" far harsher than hardened shoplifters or even carjackers might face -- all in the name of setting an example to legions of pasty youth who might wreak havoc on the Internet and by extension a number of normal people by their exploits.

My suggestion is to drop all computer laws until they can be evaluated by competent unbiased professionals in computer science for logic and reprecussion. Things have gotten out of hand.

Re:Calm down

[gad_zuki!]

I think youre wrong, the kid should be charged with a felony for this. This is exactly like breaking and entering and spying on someone. Until people see the real world analog to computer crimes we're going to have to deal with very casual law breaking and victimization. I dont think we've given deterance enough of a chance when it comes to things like these.

Re:Calm down

[Kadmos]

Without objecting in any way to your point, I do wonder how many hardened crim's this 16 yr old will meet in jail and what he will learn. Of course, we really have nothing to worry about as I have no doubt he will be a good reformed citizen when he emerges from jail 6 months from now.

Re:Calm down

[hunterx11]

I think what the grandparent was pointing out, is that there was a crime here regardless of the involvement of computers. Computers are just a tool. Should a burglar get a longer sentence for using a glass cutter to break into your house instead of smashing the window in with a baseball bat? The tool is irrelevant.

Re:Calm down

[Jessta]

I just wonder...if the kid had stolen the test after it was printed out would he still be facing 6 months in jail?

Here we go!

[Saeed al-Sahaf]

Not a thing. It has to do with a dishonest kid who got busted doing something wrong. But sure as the earth turns, someone here will twist it into some dark big brother scheme to strip the common man of our rights. Somehow.

My rights online? WTF?

[jdreed1024]

Um, this is simply an electronic version of stealing the answer key from the teacher's office. And I'd expect a student to be charged with a crime for breaking into a teacher's office to steal an answer key. This, of course, is even worse, since the student could easily have obtained other information, such as credit card numbers (plenty of teachers order supplies online), usernames, passwords, etc.

This isn't some poor misguided kid who got thrown in jail because the "lab monitor" saw him using "that Linux hacking tool" on the school Windows machines. Nor is it some grey-hat hacker pushing boundaries. When you actively go and install a keystroke monitor on a machine that is not yours, you're out to get information that you shouldn't have, period. It's totally premeditated, too - it's not like he was poking around in /tmp and found a MS Word auto-save backup file with the answer key in it, or was rummaging around in the trash can because he dropped his retainer and found the answer key - he deliberately went and got a keystroke logger and put it on the machine. There's no possible way to spin this as an innocent kid getting screwed.

Jail time would be overkill.

[Ghostgate]

Jail time for minors is almost never a good idea. There are some very rare cases where it's necessary, but this is not one of them, so I hope it doesn't come to that. We usually go easier on minors because it's widely believed that since they are still young, they still have time to change their ways, and so they deserve another chance. After all, most of us did some fairly stupid and/or illegal things as teenagers, many of which would've gotten us arrested or otherwise in serious trouble if we had been caught. But that doesn't mean we turned out to be criminals. We simply "grew up" and grew out of pulling those kind of stunts. Jail time for something like this is just going to set this kid's whole life back a LONG ways. So let's hope it doesn't happen. He should get a long community service term or something.

Teacher = you

[westendgirl]

Perhaps I'm way off base here, but I assumed the person with violated rights was the teacher. I'm sure people in other professions risk having their clients log keystrokes or otherwise violate privacy. Of course, the school board (employer) could log keystrokes, but that's entirely different.

Re:Teacher = you

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe for the same reason people expect privacy when they use someone else's bathroom/changing room/etc.

Re:Teacher = you

[Lumpy]

so if they put the teachers on powerbooks running OSX this would not happen so easily.

first 99.9% of all these kiddies are confused when their scripts or "hack pak" does not work on that non-windows machine. secondly a hardware logger does not work on a laptop.

Schools usually have no IT department and what they have is usually a teacher doing it part time or someone who is horribly inadoquate because the school refuses to hire someone that is qualified by making the salary liveable (I checked out school IT positions before, you get incompetent boobs if you only pay $29,500 a year...)

Yes there are exceptions, some school boards understand that hiring and keeping decently paid IT professionals is important, but those are extremely rare.

The Kids in school have much higher knowlege of the computers than the entire staff put together, It's an arms race that the schools will continue to lose until the boards pull their heads out of their asses and hire competent IT professionals at wage levels that ATTRACT competent IT professionals.

Re:Hm

[Jim_Callahan]

Not to be a troll, but since when did children need a strong teacher/student relationship? Back in high school, one of my favorite teachers showed up at the beginning of class, handed us lab sheets and reading assignments, then went out for coffee. And of the 10 home-schooled kids I know, fully five of them couldn't handle real college and ended up in local community colleges to stay close to their parents. I'd say a strong connection to one's teachers is as likely to be harmful as useful.

Re:Responsibilty

[YrWrstNtmr]

I think that the punishment being proposed is way too harsh (don't get me wrong).

A Class B misdemeanor. Maximum punishment of $2000 and 180 days in jail. When ever there is a crime reported in the news, they always list the maximim possible punishment. Makes it sound much worse.

How much you wanna bet he gets a fine and community service? Not all judges automatically give out the max punishment, especially for a first time HS kid offender, and especially for a crime where there was no physical harm or actual property/monetary theft

Bad kid. No cookie.

[BigZaphod]

Hey, this kid should get in trouble, yes, but I fail to understand why this is such an amazingly huge deal that it has to involve police and possible jail time. He was looking for test answers and then he tried to sell them and got caught. It appears that was the extent of his crime, too. There's no mention of stealing credit card numbers, account logins, etc.

Yes, he *could* have done that. The article, though, seems pretty clear it was just about the tests. Shouldn't the punishment fit the crime? Does potentially sending a kid to jail and giving him a huge fine fit the crime of trying to cheat on a couple tests in school?

I'm sure there's going to be many claims of "but he could have done more!" Except, by all accounts, he didn't do more. So.. I don't understand the idea of having extensive punishment for something he *could* have done if he had just been a smarter or more patient criminal. This is about as serious as finding a copy of the answer sheet sitting on the desk and copying it down while the teacher is busy somewhere else, isn't it? Isn't that the crime that was alleged and admitted to? Would a kid get charged with "breach of teacher's desk, a class B misdemeanor" in that case these days?

Maybe school has just changed a lot from when I was there. Scary world we live in.

Re:Computer Security

[general_re]

If Windows were properly locked down (ala User rights for students) then Windows wouldn't be able to properly detect and use said hardware device.

Ummm, what? I don't think you understand how these things work - it's basically some flash memory and a microcontroller. All the thing does is record the keystrokes that it receives and passes them along to the computer - it's totally OS-independent. There's no way to "lock down" the OS to prevent something like this from being installed, as it neither needs nor uses any resources on the host computer. The only way to prevent it is to prevent physical access.

Re:So?

[BigZaphod]

Do the consequences of cheating on a test in school involve possible jail time these days? Wow...

No, seriously

[Sycraft-fu]

How ofteh do you check the connections to your computer, I meann REALLY check them, like close enough to see if there's something extra there? How about a work computer, where it's under a desk? How about one that you don't manage, that someone else takes care of?

When you get down to it, most people won't notice for a long time. My computer is even exposed, and I walk past the back of it every time I go to sit down and use it, and I have to admit, it'd probably escape my notice unless I was doing some maintenance. I simply don't look closely at the cables regularly, no reason to, and a casual glance wouldn't register a small difference in the bunch that comes out the back.

It's quite effective, on PS/2 computers at least. Main problem is decyphering the data later, since all you get is keystrokes, in the order they came in. IF it's someone who multitasks ans switches apps a lot with the mouse, or does lots of mouse cut n' paste, you can get a real jumble that's hard to understand. However for a username/password combo, usually easy to find.

Re:My rights online? WTF?

[roju]

What's the typical jail sentence for stealing an exam key in a school? Hell, when was the last time someone got convicted for cheating during during a school test?

Re:My rights online? WTF? Remember Watergate?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, it all seems inocent until you recall stories like this. You have to draw a line somewhere. The burglars in the Watergate break-in probably thought it was harmless too... after all, all they wanted was a little information.

Nice strawman.

[xstonedogx]

From TFA:
Campus police referred the case to the Fort Bend County District Attorney's Office, which has charged the teen with breach of computer information, a Class B misdemeanor punishable by a fine of up to $2,000 and up to 180 days in jail.

What's the difference between that and say, holding the teacher at gunpoint to get the answers? In both cases he's doing more than cheating on a test. He's committing a crime to cheat on the test. He's being charged with the crime, not cheating on a test.

Re:Nice strawman.

[PsiPsiStar]

The difference with holding the teacher at gunpoint is that you're holding the teacher at gunpoint.

The law distinguishes between violent and non-violent crime.

The question is, what is the non-technological equivalent of what he's done, and what are the consequences for it?

jail

[delirium of disorder]

School years are around 180 days in the US... What an intresting coincidence that he could be put in jail for that ammount of time.

Jail is a prison for the body, compulsory education a prison for the mind. Given a choice between the two, I'll take jail any day. The student was more then justified in his actions. Most schools have extensive monitoring of students including the use of security cameras, random "drug" searches, and varous other methods of privacy invasion(a friend of mine who was kicked out of HS for subverting network security showed me a web accessable section of the school lan...(this was the best funded public school in the state) they had a secret searchable database that contained a psychological profile of every student along with standard information: age, grades, ssn, address). If you dare attempt to transcend the passive role assigned to you; if you even look like your going to help other students learn about history (you must be an anarchaist), chemestry (you will be accused of making bombs and drugs) or computer science (you'r a hacker), you will be interogated or expelled. Public education is a system that imposes ignorance on those too young and therefore too curious and independent minded to be good workers. It breaks them down to either drug induced apathy, or complacent submission. If we are ever to have a population with some conception of how technology, society, and self function, we must destroy the high schools. A just, equitable, and sustainable society cannot be built when our fellow citizens are subject to the forced indoctronation of dogmatic bullshit like nationalism and religion. Both public and parocial high schools are amoung the most destructive forces facing creativity, intellectual development, and society itself.

Re:way to go kid!

[Rotten168]

So some kid is too dumb or lazy to actually learn something in school and for that he's a hero? No wonder computer jobs are moving to India.

Re:Happens all the time

[HeghmoH]

You sound just like the admin at my high school. Totally unable to see things from other people's perspectives, and trying to fix everything by locking accounts.

You serve the teachers, and you serve the students. You are support for them, not the ruler of your own private kingdom. You apparently aren't even competent enough to keep people from installing software on your systems, but instead of fixing the problem, you just kill the messenger.

Re:way to go kid!

[HeghmoH]

The AP CS exam doesn't qualify as anything beyond "Intro to Programming". I took it in high school even though the school had no class for it. I studied for half an hour the night before, and aced it. I'm not trying to pump myself up, it's just that the exam was useless.

Not everybody has a local community college. I certainly didn't when I was in high school. My school had absolutely no idea what to do with me. You might have been in a better position, and people in large cities near universities may be as well, but not everybody is that lucky.

Re:way to go kid!

[HeghmoH]

I never said it excuses him. I'm simply explaining that, contrary to the original poster's assertion, the kid is not necessarily too dumb or lazy to learn in school.

Re: Happens so often the charge is ridiculous!

[Horse Rotorvator JAD]

but a fine and the threat of jail time isn't the answer.

I disagree. People seem to think that commiting crimes on a computer is somehow "not as bad" as the normal physical crimes of theft, tresspassing, etc. People need to be taught at a young age that doing things like putting a keystroke logger on a teachers computer is a real crime and not just harmless fun.

If that kid gets a job in an office and throws a keylogger on his bosses computer he will get into some real trouble and rightfully so. They need to learn early on that this kind of behaviour is unnacceptable.

But this is slashdot so I expect a bunch of replys saying that it is not the kids fault but it is the schools fault for not securing their computers.

Re: Happens so often the charge is ridiculous!

[Grishnakh]

I disagree. People seem to think that commiting crimes on a computer is somehow "not as bad" as the normal physical crimes of theft, tresspassing, etc. People need to be taught at a young age that doing things like putting a keystroke logger on a teachers computer is a real crime and not just harmless fun.

Excuse me? I'll agree that computer crimes aren't "harmless fun", but do you actually think any computer crime is as serious as assault, rape, or murder? If you do, you have some seriously screwed-up values. Trespassing, at least in a private home, is up there too. I'll happily shoot dead anyone that breaks in my house, but I'd never advocate death for any computer crime (except maybe something extremely large-scale, but I doubt it).

How about a hypothetical question: if you had a choice of living in two societies, one where violent crime is commonplace, but computer crime is nonexistent, or another where computer crime is rampant, but violent crime is nonexistent, which would you choose? I'll happily choose the latter. At least my life isn't at risk, and I can always exercise caution and use appropriate security measures to avoid being the victim of a computer crime.

But this is slashdot so I expect a bunch of replys saying that it is not the kids fault but it is the schools fault for not securing their computers.

A criminal is always liable for his crime, but that doesn't excuse not taking measures to avoid being the victim of the crime in the first place. Do you leave your doors unlocked? Do you leave valuables inside your car, with the doors unlocked, and a sign outside saying "please don't steal the valuables inside this unlocked vehicle"? You can whine and point fingers all you want after becoming a victim, but you're still a victim. I'd rather avoid that.