Slashdot Mirror


Kaleidescape CEO Speaks Out About CSS Lawsuit

An anonymous reader writes "Engadget has an interview with Michael Malcolm, the CEO of Kaleidescape, which you might remember as the high-end DVD jukebox manufacturer that was sued by the DVD Copy Control Association for violating its CSS license. Despite the fact that anyone who can afford a $27,000+ DVD jukebox also usually ends up buying hundreds of movies to load onto it, the DVD-CCA wants them to redesign the Kaleidescape to require the presence of the physical DVD disc in the drive during authentication and playback. Besides defeating the whole purpose of having a jukebox in the first place (none of their jukeboxes allow for copying, streaming, or sharing DVDs), Malcolm says he can't find any clause in their CSS license which would require them to implement this "feature" anyway and they're about to file a counter-action against the DVD-CCA."

18 of 212 comments (clear)

  1. What they are afraid of by EmagGeek · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "I just loaded my DVD into my Jukebox... I don't need the DVD anymore, so I guess I'll go sell it on ebay or give it away..."

    That's what they're afraid of, and they're probably right.

    1. Re:What they are afraid of by halivar · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's what they're afraid of, and they're probably right.

      I don't think they're right to be afraid of the all of two people who actually by this thing.

    2. Re:What they are afraid of by OS24Ever · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If someone can afford a $27,000 system (starting price) I really doubt they're going to be worried about recouping their $19.95 investment on a DVD or screwing with eBay to do it...

      --

      As a rock-in-roll Physicist once said, No matter where you go, there you are.

    3. Re:What they are afraid of by chill · · Score: 5, Insightful

      DVD's I haven't watched in over 6 months get donated straight to my local public library. Then LOTS of people can watch them for free.

      I've donated over 100 movies in the last year. I'll bet the DVD consortium will just love that.

      How much are you going to get on a used DVD on E-Bay? Considering damn near every new DVD is $15 at WalMart (Lord of the Rings and multi-disc sets being the exception), what difference does it make?

      Hell, I've filled in a lot of my "must have" collection from Walmart spending $10 a disc, including tax. They're now an impulse buy.

      The Kaleidescope product isn't exactly a threat to that.

      -Charles

      --
      Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
    4. Re:What they are afraid of by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I just loaded my DVD into my Jukebox... I don't need the DVD anymore, so I guess I'll go sell it on ebay or give it away..." That's what they're afraid of, and they're probably right.?

      If you RTFA you would note that they covered this. In the current storage medium, this system costs $40-$60 in hard disk space, per movie. It is cheaper to buy two DVDs. This could be a concern in the future, but don't fool yourself, that is not what this lawsuit is about. This is about a loophole that was not dreamed up by the big media companies when they went with DVD as their DRM format. The idea is to sell multiple copies of every movie for multiple locations, and multiple new players. If you can just store an exact image of a DVD on a new player, why buy another copy in DVD-purple-ray-extreme-DVD3 format in a few years? And if you can back them up, there goes all the new copies to replace worn, scratched, broken, or misplaced movies.

    5. Re:What they are afraid of by bubba451 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      "I just loaded my DVD into my Jukebox... I don't need the DVD anymore, so I guess I'll go sell it on ebay or give it away..."

      This describes the situation that many digital audio fans currently find themselves in: "I just ripped my CD onto my computer, why do I need the CD?" The thing is, those shiny discs make excellent backups, especially since, if they're just sitting in their cases, they're pretty well-protected against dust and scratches.

      I rarely pull actual CDs out of my cabinet anymore. But there's no way I'm going to sell them (the ones I like anyway).

    6. Re:What they are afraid of by Richard_at_work · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Two people? With the advent of Netflix and other rental by mail services, there are already a LOAD of people doing this exact thing, so to be afraid of it in a proper jukebox system designed for it is quite valid.

    7. Re:What they are afraid of by norminator · · Score: 3, Insightful

      And if you can back them up, there goes all the new copies to replace worn, scratched, broken, or misplaced movies.

      But the Kaleidescape isn't much of a backup solution. If you lose your original disc, the file on the Kaleidescape server is only good for watching on a Kaleidescape player. There's no way to get back a new copy for the server.

      Also, a disk imported now will always have the limitations of the current format, so the motivation is still there to buy "another copy in DVD-purple-ray-extreme-DVD3 format...", or one with newer, *specialer* features. The only way the Kaleidescape is a threat is that the same movie can be watched in multiple locations of a house at once, and I still think that's a weak argument. It's so frustrating to see the MPAA or the DVD-CCA avoid the evolution of the home multimedia experience.

  2. Thank god by __aaitqo8496 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's nice to see companies standing up to the class bully...

    One day everyone will realize that the bully just had a self-esteem problem. Let's hope that day comes soon.

  3. Re:27k? 400 dvd carousel $300 by haagmm · · Score: 5, Insightful

    umm did you RTFA? A 400 dvd carousel isnt going to power 8 diferent plasma screens and a huge projector all with different movies all in 1080i now is it. nor is it expandable and adaptible like this system is.

    dont get me wrong i'm not going to buy one, but the is alot more to it.

  4. Forgotten passwords by ndogg · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Their suit says that Kaleidescape must redesign its system to require the presence of the physical DVD disc in the drive during authentication and playback.

    "I forgot my password. Can you reset it?"

    "Sure, what's your password?"

    --
    // file: mice.h
    #include "frickin_lasers.h"
  5. The types of people who would buy a Kaleidescape by norminator · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The truth is, that someone that pays over $30,000 for a DVD system (the people that can afford the system are probably going to not settle for the bare minimum $27,000 configuration) are not interested in screwing over the MPAA. Many of these customers are probably music and movie stars anyhow. They buy it for the unique experience of the well-built UI and the convenience of the system. They don't care if a DVD costs $20 or $100.

    Of course, the lawsuit is more about the long term possibilities... that someday this type of system will be available at lower prices, and then the studios will get ripped off. But still, the lawsuit is absurd. Especially since the complaint is that this device permits the "wholsale copying of DVDs, which CSS was designed to prevent." If that were true then any DVD-ROM drive would be in violation. I think CSS is not so much to prevent copying of DVDs, but to prevent unauthorized playback. I wish the DVD-CCA would stop abusing the purpose of their precious CSS.

    The Kaleidescape is a great device, I would be very sad to see it get buried by people who see it as the threat that it isn't.

  6. Kaleidescape + Netflix or blockbuster subscription by doormat · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Basically all the movies you'd ever want. As quick as you can get them from your company of choice.

    --
    The Doormat

    If you're not outraged, then you're not paying attention.
  7. Price is irrelevant. by McSpew · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Rich people don't know better.

    Know better? They don't give a shit. When your house costs $10 million, and you've got $500,000 worth of custom-installed home theater gear, plasma screen TVs, multiroom audio and video, etc., an additional $27k or even $100k isn't that much to spend to ensure that you can watch any of your movies from any of your screens any time you want. It's a helluvalot more elegant and intuitive than some hack-it-together-yourself DVR or DVD caching box. Besides, you're going to be taking your family on a holiday to Barcelona or Shanghai or Aspen during the couple of weeks it takes to get that whole thing installed, configured, tested and debugged. And you probably will pay Kaleidescape the money to duplicate your entire DVD collection onto the hard drives so you don't have reload them yourself, or have your personal electrical engineer spend a week loading your DVDs onto the system.

    Besides, if I'm some rich guy who's spent that much on his house and electronics, I'm showing off my latest "I'm cooler-than-you" gadgets to my other ultra-rich friends before we head off to cruise the Mediterranean in my private yacht. The people who buy this are the same people who buy the Ford GT (~$140k), the Mercedes SL65 AMG (~$140k), the Bentley Arnage T (~$250k), the Maybach 57 ($~$330k) or the Porsche Carrera GT (~$440k). The cost is irrelevant--it's all about the cool.

    BTW: The CEO of the company I work for has recently bought both a Ford GT (~$140k) and a Mercedes SL65AMG (~$140k). That's to go along with the BMW 760Li (~$90k) he already owns, his $14 million Learjet, his $12 million house, etc.

  8. What are they scared of??? by laughingcoyote · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Why sure, I'm going to buy a $27,000 machine to copy DVD's that I actually bought, because I can't afford them. That would be much smarter then using a $400 PC to get them off of Bittorrent.

    Once the **AA's decide to embrace digital distribution instead of attempting to squash it, they'll make the same killing they have off every other technology they fought at first. Remember, radio and, later, the cassette tape were going to be the end of the music business. We're tired of hearing that the sky is falling. Start adapting your business model to technology, and quit telling us to adapt technology to your business model.

    --
    To fight the war on terror, stop being afraid.
  9. George Lucas Guilty of Pirating his own films by StateOfTheUnion · · Score: 5, Insightful
    George Lucas has a Kaleidescape box . . . He mentions it in a Sound & Vison interview [soundandvisionmag.com] (Its on page four of the interview about halfway down the page. Just a brief mention.)

    I guess Lucas is guilty of pirating his own films . . . The concept of extreme protection of digital content is really getting out of hand when someone like Lucas can't legally "backup" his films onto another media. I don't really understand this when no one prosecutes the average Joe from copying a CD to tape or CD to MP3 player for convenience . . . Isn't this all that the Kaleidescope box does? Copies from one media to another for ease and convenience?

    If you can do it with music, then why can't you do it with movies?

  10. Wealthy people don't steal? by msblack · · Score: 3, Insightful
    I love all these arguments that assume someone wealthy enough to purchase a $27,000 system is not about to steal DVDs, especially since many are probably movie stars already. Have you forgotten about the SAG member in 2004 who gave away his screeners? What about Martha Stewart and her attempt to save $30,000 with her ImClone stock. Winona Ryder convicted of shoplifting. The list goes on and on.



    People at all income levels can be thieves. I doubt you could find any correlation between income level and thievery. As one poster commented, why not just add every NetFlix rental to their jukebox?

    --
    signature pending slashdot approval
  11. BOO FUCKING HOO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Listen folks, it's really fucking simple here.

    YOU created this monster. Just like South Park's "Walmart" episode--who is number 1? YOU are.

    The "threat" of DVD has been known for years. The DVDCCA came up with consumer-hostile garbage from day one: CSS, Region Encoding (aka RESTRAINT OF TRADE), and Macrovision in every pot (sorry, under every TV). YOU BOUGHT INTO IT. You just HAD to have your fucking "Matrix" DVD, didn't you? Nevermind all the problems with DVD--look at DIVX! HAH what fools! Right.

    And now we have "big brother" DVD-CCA clubbing people over the head for violating their bullshit license for their bullshit "encryption" which has already been compromised 100 ways from Sunday. We STILL have region encoding despite the fact that it IS restraint of trade. And YOU allowed it. Every one of you that ran out to get a DVD player and filling your shelves with boxed-sets of whatever--you allowed this to happen.

    So do NOT bitch about the DVDCCA. You fucking gave them the power. And you know what? Now that you let them stick their foot in the door JUST A LITTLE, they're going to try and see what ELSE they can get away with...the "broadcast" flag, the bending-over of TiVo...it's going to get worse because YOU, the drooling hordes, couldn't stop for ONE moment to say "hey, this is just a candy-coated fish hook!" Nope, GOTTA have that latest anime collection! Just GOTTA get that Matrix DVD Boxed Set!

    Now go ahead--do your Slashdot duty...whine about the DVDCCA and how they "don't get it." Contradict me by saying "so? You can just get a hacked player!" (Yeah, and Apex is SUCH great quality too *snort*). Somehow tie Bittorrent into the conversation (it's just not slashdot if you're not blathering about how great bittorrent is). Mod me down to nothing. Continue preaching to the choir.