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China Locks in its Net-Citizenry

Posted by timothy on from the welcome-to-china dept.

DatedNews writes "China's registry CNNIC teamed up in March with registar i-DNS.net to provide "Internet domains completely in Chinese characters" to the Greater Chinese Internet community. What at first might look like a localization issue could potentially become a powerfull user lock-in and turn out to be a very effective addition to The Great Chinese Filtering."

42 of 217 comments (clear)

  1. In other words by winkydink · · Score: 3, Funny

    It is therefore natural for us to ensure that foreign entities who wish to protect their Chinese language domain names in the .˾ and .ÍøÂç extensions are able to participate early on in the process. Therefore, we are very pleased to partner with i-DNS.net to bring this early opportunity to people outside of China now."

    We have figured out a way to extract yet more money from the running capitalist dogs.

    --

    "I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey

    1. Re:In other words by ShaniaTwain · · Score: 2, Funny

      Potential registrants who cannot speak or type Chinese can also register names via an on-line transliteration service provided at a modest fee.

      OK, who want a really rough translation of their domain names into chinese? .. Bite the wax tadpole anyone?

      --
      Starsucks
  2. Great Chinese Filtering? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    surely it's called the Great Firewall of China?

    1. Re:Great Chinese Filtering? by Duncan3 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Fear not!!! This will be fixed in the dupe.

      --
      - Adam L. Beberg - The Cosm Project - http://www.mithral.com/
    2. Re:Great Chinese Filtering? by DuBois · · Score: 2, Interesting
      It really *is* the Great Firewall of China. I'm in China right now, but not behind the Great Firewall (which prevents any kind of real-time access, making all access to the "outside" running-dog slow).

      Fortunately, where I am, you can actually get Hong Kong-connected ADSL, thus bypassing the GFoC and making "real" Internet access possible.

      --
      The IPCC has purposely engineered a massive scientific fraud.
  3. I can see it now by Raul654 · · Score: 5, Funny

    Your attempted to access taiwan.gov.ta has been logged. Reeducation teams are now en route to your location. Please do not flee, you traitorous capitalist.

    --


    To make laws that man cannot, and will not obey, serves to bring all law into contempt.
    --E.C. Stanton
    1. Re:I can see it now by Enoch+Root · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Ya know, I'll take Slashdot's China-censoring rants seriously the day the Chinese government actually, you know, censors Slashdot...

      As it stands, I've been healthily losing time reading anti-Chinese ramblings on Slashdot for two years from Shanghai.

      I have yet to run into any t#*#&$&$[NO CARRIER]

  4. Of course... by Bananatree3 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    99% of all filtered websites out there have English domains. It would seem that Chinese who are just starting with the internet would go first to chinese domain names. They might go so far as to have a "white" list for english domain names

  5. How do I do research? by Indes · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Being a Canadian student with very little experience in Chinese, I think that it may be harder now to get localized information about specific things in China as they'll be oddities in the dns names..

    Does this mean everyone is gonna have to go to UTF-8? What about those in some BSD camps that don't have full chinese support?

    1. Re:How do I do research? by Uber+Banker · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Being a Western person who happens to speak fluent Mandarin (and Cantonese) as well as 'type Chinese' as well as English:

      Does this mean everyone is going to have to type English when accessing URLs? Why shouldn't URLs by Chinese characters first romanisation after.

      Of course a section of the internet written in Chinese readable in Chinese will have profound impacts on me.

      But what if I only understand/comprehend English, then I must be locked in. Damn this user lock in that is dependent on my knowledge. Damn those French, Italian, Iranian speakers who are also 'locked in' by speaking their own languange.

    2. Re:How do I do research? by 2Bits · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Well, let's rephrase that for a Chinese student:


      Being a Chinese student with very little experience in English, I think that it may be harder now to get localized information about specific things in Canada/USA as they'll be oddities in the dns names..

      What's wrong for a country to try to promote technologies that work better in the local languages?

      What would Canadians and Americans think if they have to learn Chinese to use the Internet? That's what Chinese people (and all other people) have to do, i.e. learning English, to go online.

      The world is a beautiful place, with all its differences and disparities. It would be really boring if everyone has to speak english and eat big macs, don't you think?

    3. Re:How do I do research? by fearofcarpet · · Score: 2, Insightful
      What would Canadians and Americans think if they have to learn Chinese to use the Internet? That's what Chinese people (and all other people) have to do, i.e. learning English, to go online.

      While I have absolutely no problem whatsoever wth Chinese URLs/webpages, whatever, you have to know that this is a specious argument. The Internet was developed in English, therefore people who wanted to partake had to learn English. Now China is addressing that problem by creating Chinese URLs. When China creates the next big global technology (as I'm sure they will in the not-too-distant future) they can make it Chinese-only and the shoe will be on the other foot.

      --
      Actually, I wrote my thesis on life experience.
  6. I can't take it any more! by veg_all · · Score: 4, Funny

    potentially become a powerfull user lock-in

    Arrgghhh!!! Even on the front page now? THERE'S ONLY ONE "L" IN "POWERFUL!"

    Ooops. Guess I'll have to change my sig now.

    --
    grammar-lesson free since 1999. (rescinded - 2005)
    1. Re:I can't take it any more! by grolschie · · Score: 2, Funny

      What's a "registar"?

    2. Re:I can't take it any more! by Fjornir · · Score: 2, Funny

      Actually it's just that the space was mis-placed. It was supposed to read "powerful luser lock-in".

      --
      I want a new world. I think this one is broken.
  7. Dupe? by John+Seminal · · Score: 5, Interesting
    What at first might look like a localization issue could potentially become a powerfull user lock-in and turn out to be a very effective addition to The Great Chinese Filtering

    How so, this would lock out people outside of China, not inside China. I don't have any chinese character set installed on my pc, and I would not have a way of typing in that domain name.

    If I owned a company in China, and wanted to do buisness in other countries, I would not want a domain with just Chinese characters, my non-Chinese customers would have a more difficult time finding me.

    I just don't see how this locks Chinese people into anything. It gives them more choice.

    --

    Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."

    1. Re:Dupe? by Enoch+Root · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Don't fret. Here's how this article came to be:

      - A random Slashdot reader stumbles upon an article;
      - Realizing it's about China, he suspects this could make the front page;
      - BUT! It's not anti-Chinese, just about allowing Hanzi URLs! What to do!
      - The random Slashdot reader adds a RANDOM ANTI-COMMUNIST BASTARDS slant. Voila!
      - Editors approve the article in the blink of an eye.

      And that, my friend, is how Slashdot front pages are made.

  8. Quick! by mikeophile · · Score: 2, Funny

    What's "porno" in Cantonese?

    1. Re:Quick! by blueZhift · · Score: 3, Informative

      Please forgive the poor transliteration!

      Porn Video: haam di (hah-mm dee)
      Horny: haam suup (hah-mm s-uh-p) literally salty and wet

      At least, those are the colloquial expressions I'm told.

      --
      To the making of books there is no end, so let's get started
    2. Re:Quick! by Glowing+Fish · · Score: 2, Informative

      It is "se qing", with se being a word meaning "form", but also meaning "lust". Qing means "passion". not neccesarily in a sexual sense, but sometimes in that way. So together, se qing means "pornographic".

      --
      Hopefully I didn't put any [] around my words.
    3. Re:Quick! by sydneyfong · · Score: 2, Informative

      As mentioned by a (currently) 0-score poster, this is Cantonese instead of Mandarin.

      Anyway, I'd like to say that for "Porn Video", the pronounciation is "haam dai" ("dai" rhymes with "fly")

      ("dai" in this context means "tape".)

      Hope that helps ;-p

      --
      Don't quote me on this.
  9. Ah... by Dan+Up+Baby · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I love watching China shoot the wings off of its much-prophesied ascendency to world superpower, one authoritarian move at a time.

    Remember, CHINA: "It worked for the soviets, right?"

    1. Re:Ah... by elsilver · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, it seems to be working for the US, so why shouldn't they give it a try? E.

  10. tempest in a teapot by fliptout · · Score: 5, Informative

    I read tfa and saw nothing about locking in the chinese netizens.

    Look, English literacy is on the rise in China in a major way. With all the influx of foreign investments and foreigners into china, the chinese people are having more contact than ever with the western world. Filtering out everything but chinese characters, while a technical possibility, is simple improbable.

    I lived in china a few months last year, and I'm going back for the long haul soon- from what I have seen, the young, college educated Chinese like their access to information, albeit san porn, Taiwan, etc. To restrict their information flow even more would cause an outcry.

    --
    A witty saying proves you are wittier than the next guy.
    1. Re:tempest in a teapot by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 3, Funny
      The young, college-educated Chinese make up a tiny fraction of China's 1,300,000,000 people. The ones who speak English are an even smaller fraction of that, and consist mostly of those who have chosen careers in export trade. Let me guess, you were an English teacher. No surprise there...such a cloistered environment. Businessmen in manufacturing, like me, get out to the factories in the countryside and see the real deal.

      You don't get it. When have the outcries of people on the internet ever accomplished anything?

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
  11. I'm not getting something by coupland · · Score: 4, Insightful

    How does allowing domains to be registered using Chinese characters have anything to do with censorship? The linked articles just prove that China already filters web traffic, regulates content, and shuts down sites they don't like. How is the ability to use Chinese characters in your location bar an indication of a sinister new plot? Sure, there is a sinister plot afoot, but I don't see how this is an astonishing new development...

  12. Some tech details, and a question by nstrom · · Score: 5, Interesting

    These LGA people claim to require a browser plugin to use these Chinese domain names. However, it just seems that they're implementing the names using punycode and some new (presumably non ICANN-approved) TLDs.

    For example, the domain name "." resolves via punycode to xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d. Now we can check this domain via whois:

    $whois -h whois.i-dns.biz xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d

    i-DNS.net WHOIS Server Version 1-2-0

    This service may be used to query the availability of
    multilingual domain names. Please visit http://www.i-DNS.net/
    for more information about multilingual domain names.

    For help with the i-DNS.net WHOIS service, type 'HELP'.

    Domain ID: D1148313-IDNS
    Domain Name (Native): .
    Domain Name (ACE): xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d
    Created On: 14-Nov-2004 19:58:54 GMT
    Last Updated On: 02-Mar-2005 06:12:50 GMT
    Expiration Date: 14-Nov-2006 19:57:30 GMT

    ... [snipped to get past line-length filters] ...

    Name Server: ns1.i-dns.biz
    Name Server: ns2.i-dns.biz
    and we can actually resolve this name if we use the right DNS server:

    $dig xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d @ns1.i-dns.biz

    ; > DiG 9.2.2 > xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d @ns1.i-dns.biz
    ;; global options: printcmd
    ;; Got answer:
    ;; ->>HEADER ;; flags: qr aa rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 2, ADDITIONAL: 2

    ;; QUESTION SECTION:
    ;xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d. IN A

    ;; ANSWER SECTION:
    xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d. 86400 IN A 203.81.44.27

    ;; AUTHORITY SECTION:
    xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d. 86400 IN NS ns1.universal-names.com.
    xn--eqro3ot1fkxx.xn--55qx5d. 86400 IN NS ns2.universal-names.com.

    ;; ADDITIONAL SECTION:
    ns1.universal-names.com. 117755 IN A 203.81.44.40
    ns2.universal-names.com. 117774 IN A 203.81.44.27

    ;; Query time: 821 msec
    ;; SERVER: 203.81.44.40#53(ns1.i-dns.biz)
    ;; WHEN: Tue Apr 26 19:49:06 2005
    ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 148
    The question raised here then is the following: why use a browser plugin at all if all is needed is to configure the user's DNS resolver to consult alternate root servers for the new TLDs? The paranoid conspiracy theorist in me suggests spyware, or something else that's not quite kosher.

  13. spam consequenses by dj245 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Great, instead of spam from a fake address at a pump-and-dump english domain, we can have spam from fake email addresses on domains that appear as a bunch of random characters to those without the language set.

    --
    Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
    1. Re:spam consequenses by patio11 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      No, it will appear as punycode to you. You'll end up getting a domain name which looks like xn--tdali-d8a8w.lv (always starts with xn, tends to end up with a lot of - signs). Which is great for you, because if you work in an environment where its possible you can just redirect to /dev/null/ any messages which come from one of those domains, or set SpamAssassin to consider that a very spammy token.

      --
      Help poke pirates in the eyepatch, arr.
  14. Re:Will this affect IPv9? by jerometremblay · · Score: 4, Informative

    No, because IP and DNS are not on the same network layer. IP is part of the Network Layer (3), while DNS is part of the Application Layer (7).

    A lower layer does not care about what's going on in an higher layer.

  15. It always happens by ded_si_luap · · Score: 3, Funny

    I look at a Chinese site, and an hour later I'm hungry again.

  16. Would you like some FUD with that? by hunterx11 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    China is not implementing their own IDN scheme in an attempt to lock people into it. This is based on existing work on internationalized domain names. The largest country putting their weight behind IDNs is only going to encourage their rapid universal adaptation, and eliminate localization issues.

    --
    English is easier said than done.
  17. Chappelle's show joke... by VolcomPimp · · Score: 2, Funny

    Ching chang chong! I can't understand yooooooou!

  18. Re:In this morning's news... by leandrod · · Score: 2, Insightful
    > KMT party chairman visits Beijing. I wonder how the PRC press handled that, characterizing the ROC as a rogue province as long as they have

    Easy. China has already cowered KMT to abandon the 'reconquer the mainland' policy. Now the KMT just wants to wait the mainland dictatorship to crumble down on its own. But on the other hand China's fear is now Formosan nationalism, and against that the KMT is an ally.

    --
    Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA
    DA, DBA, SysAdmin, Data Modeller
    GNU Project, Debian GNU/Lin
  19. Turnaround by iendedi · · Score: 3, Insightful
    How so, this would lock out people outside of China, not inside China. I don't have any chinese character set installed on my pc, and I would not have a way of typing in that domain name.
    I was thinking the same thing, actually. This shouldn't affect anyone inside of China attempting to access sites outside of China. But how does this affect those outside of China resolving addresses inside of China? Does it matter?

    In this day and age, I believe that you would probably be watched closer if you were american and looking at chinese sites than if you were chinese and looking at american sites. Propaganda is such a strange thing.
    --

    It is your personal duty to fight for what is right on a daily basis. Ignoring injustice is identical to approving
  20. Re:The 60's called by AHumbleOpinion · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The 60's called. They want their paranoia back.

    Was Tiananmen Square in the 60s? No.
    Was the Navy EP-3 midair crash in the 60s? No.

    While you can argue that localized domain names are not much of an issue and that things are being blown way out of proportion, it is asinine to declare that the days of being wary of communist china are long gone. When the chinese citizens can vote anyone out of office then we can revisit the trust issue.

  21. Wacky pro-English conservatives by alienmole · · Score: 2, Informative

    That's the only explanation I can think of for the spin on the Slashdot posting. I think it's a legitimate question to raise, but to present it with the headline "China Locks in its Net-Citizenry" is just ludicrous, and extremely inflammatory. Only on Slashdot, where the term "editor" has a unique definition. Timothy ought to be ashamed of himself.

  22. Just tried to register a domain... by L0stb0Y · · Score: 4, Informative

    Ok, speaking pretty good Chinese, and for an experiment I just went through the process of registering a domain with these guys-

    Interesting things about the process:

    When you are registering, they state that the Chinese government has 30 days to reject your domain...maybe to keep domains they don't like the sound of from going live...

    They force you to a min of 2 years, and the cost is $125.00 - when you register a domain, they give you the domain plus the domain.cn as well (they call it a 'free gift')-

    After you register a domain they tell you that you have to install their software for your browser (no Mozilla, only IE)- With the plugin installed your new domain won't crap out when you type in characters (either GB or BIG5)-

    I'll post an update in my /. journal of the process - what happens, etc....

    Should be interesting at the very least to see what happens with this...

    --
    "We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of dreams."
    1. Re:Just tried to register a domain... by 2Bits · · Score: 2, Informative

      No, that's not true. Please provide the name of the registrar where you tried to register your domain. You probably get scammed by some unknown registrar outside of China.

      I own 2 chinese domain names (one for .com, the other for .cn). The registration fee is the same everywhere in China, namely, 280 RMB/year. That price is set by the government.

      And no, you don't need any other software. What's wrong with your Firefox/Mozilla?

      The only problem is, the government does not allow personal chinese domain name (registered by individuals for individuals), only corporations/organizations/institutions, etc.

  23. "Lock in"? by sydneyfong · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Rather, say the InterNIC locks in the whole world by forcing netizens to use English characters!

    There is no reason why people have to learn English to use the internet efficiently, especially where there's more people speaking Chinese (Mandarin) than English.

    That's lock in.

    --
    Don't quote me on this.
  24. No lock-out, either by ragingmime · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...newly-government approved Chinese names of the form . (i.e. 'name.gongsi') and . (i.e 'name.wangluo')... The purchase of Simplified Chinese names from the i-DNS.net/CNNIC partnership will automatically allow the corresponding web-site to be accessed by an equivalent, computer-generated domain name in Traditional Chinese characters (i.e. used in Hong Kong and Taiwan) free of charge. Conversely, one can also buy a Traditional Chinese name directly and get an automatically assigned Simplified Chinese version free.

    Maybe I'm missing something, but it sounds like a non-Chinese user could type in .gongsi or .wangluo instead of traditional Chinese characters and get the same website. In other words, this system doesn't lock users in or out... I really don't see how this is that big of deal. Not to be a jerk, but do the editors read these articles? I'm not a very big fan of China's internet policies myself, but the newspost's threats of lock-in are totally unfounded.

    --
    I produce electronic music and write little games. Have a look.
  25. Re:The 60's called by AHumbleOpinion · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Smart of you to limit the US starving of people to "its own citizens". It's much cleaner that way, as it leaves out the starving of quite a few hundred thousand Iraqis since the beginning of the US sanctions in the early 90's.

    Uh, the US didn't starve those people. Saddam starved those people. He impeded United Nations inspectors. He diverted Unitied Nations Oil For Food money. He manufactured his people's suffering so that he could use them for propoganda. He went on a palace building spree. He spent money on weapons systems.

    Whether or not the US invasion was justified is one topic, don't let any hard feeling you have about that delude you regarding what Saddam did to his people.