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Thin Client With OSS for Developing Nations
FridayBob writes "The BBC has a story on a new, ultra-thin client that a group of not-for-profit developers, Ndiyo, hope will open up the potential of computing to people in the developing world. Not surprisingly, their system uses open source software. The system runs Ubuntu Linux with a Gnome/KDE deskto and OpenOffice. From the article: 'Licences for software are often a significant part of expenditure for smaller companies which rely on computers. But a recent UK government study, yet to be formally published, has shown that open source software can significantly reduce school budgets dedicated to computing set-ups.'"
What about thin clients for models? They regurgitate whatever information you feed them.
Such a bootable cdrom (based on Slackware) is already available from LocustWorld.
Maybe the Ubuntu guys should port it over from Slackware.
Seastead this.
I have no idea what this story is about. Seriously.
Why are these cheap entry-level systems always targeted at the "Third World", rather than poor people here in the US? They'd have much better chances of success in our society, already geared for computer-readiness, in becoming popular - or gaining entry at all. Poor Americans have less of a culture gap to close to become computer users, and are much more able to bootstrap themselves into becoming unsubsidized computer consumers like the rest of us. And American products filter out to the rest of the world after they're out of fashion here, so feeding the American poor would eventually feed the foreign poor, too. Without setting up the foreign poor as better competitors to our domestic poor, upon whom we all depend. The products would be easier to produce and distribute. Aren't our own poor people worth helping?
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make install -not war
The benefits of thin-clients are many. First, the client can be really bare bones (i.e. no HD, minimal RAM, low-end graphics, low processesor speeds, etc) so they can be cheap ($170 + monitor from WalMart or donated machines). Second, to upgrade all your workstations (perfomrance-wise) all you need to do is upgrade or add another server - not hundreds of workstations. Third, to upgrade all you clients (software-wise), you just upgrade the software on a few servers. Managing one or two Win2K3 servers for viruses, patches, malware, etc, beats the hell out of 200 WinXP workstations!
There are other benefits, but these are the ones that have really made a difference for us. Don't get me wrong, thin-clients aren't the answer for everything. There are many situations where you need to have a fully functioning workstation. However, with the money you save on thin-clients, you can afford to get really good workstations, which in turn can be turned into thin-clients when they are needing to be upgraded.
Most of our users simply need a means of doing basic office tasks like word-processing, spreadsheets, email, web-surfing, etc. Those are perfect for thin-clients.
What would I want to have to make it better? Easy. First, get OpenOffice to work properly on a Win2K3 terminal server, It's not real good in a multi-user environment like that (unless I'm doing something wrong - possible). And the number 1 thing that would make it better: can you say "Tiger Terminal Server Edition"?
"terrorism" and "pedophilia" are the root passwords to the Constitution
The people you're targeting get paid $50 a month, my friend, and their kids go to a school which is basically 4 walls, a floor, and a roof if they're lucky.
Oh yes, a server and some thin clients is really what's needed there.
Not paper and pens. Text books. Teachers. Electricity (what are they planning to plug these things into?).
The thing about developing nations, is not that they're poor, it's that the divide between the rich and the poor is vast.
At the other end of the scale, here, you have your rich, your ex-pats, etc - and you have your $5,000/term "International School" organisations who have wireless internet, computer labs, international standard teachers, and they don't need this. Nor do the businesses, most of which are thriving, thank you very much.
I'm sitting here next to a 3Tb server in my office and a server room full of Dual Xeons next door reading about how developing nations need some sort of solution for cheap computing?
These people have so lost direction they couldn't find it with both hands and a map.
It actually looks like a nice system, that would be ideal for reducing costs in schools and some businesses world-wide, I have NO idea what they're doing thinking they're doing this for the good of the "third world".
If they really want to do something "not for profit", try volunteering for an aids project, a humanitarian project, or a teaching project.
Sometimes I look at my driver - I pay him $65 a month, and I wonder what he would have been if he'd had the education I did. HE would be sitting in this chair, for a start. I could teach him in front of this PC for a month of Sundays, and it wouldn't make up for the fact he has no basic education.
"The truth is that in "third world" countries, bare bones PCs that run your choice of Windows or Linux simply don't cost a hell of a lot more than $100, and often less."
Welcome to the land of Generalisation, where one anecdotal observation trumps any need for actual data!
Sorry to be so crude, but what you're saying is so hopelessly wrong that it just about made me jump out of my chair. How do I know it's wrong? Because I'm sitting right now in a developing nation that adds a 40% duty to all imported computer goods. I cannot buy a new PC of any kind for less than USD 1000. (That's about 6 times the legal monthly minimum wage.)
I've spoken with officials from the department of trade, and they've been extremely receptive to the fact that high computing costs are a huge barrier to development. In fact, they're in the process of lowering those barriers. But even then, the best we could expect would be a roughly $4-500 computer, which still represents a huge amount of money for the average person. When you're earning very little money, every dollar has to count.
So guess what? We used 8 year-old Pentiums to operate as thin clients to connect to 'modern' PIII 450s running Ubuntu. Here's the press release we just published.
In fairness, there are a number of countries where computer hardware is cheap. But the fact that some developing countries have cheap computers does not mean that 'the developing world has cheap computers'.
Crumb's Corollary: Never bring a knife to a bun fight.
"Jesus. What kind of box are you trying to buy? $1000 US? Maybe you should set your sights a little lower and realize that not everyone needs a game box."
I wasn't going to reply at first, but then I realised that you genuinely don't get it. The country where I live cannot survive on income tax revenues, because the cash economy is almost non-existent. This means that it relies on import duties, business license fees, etc. for its revenues. This means that things like computers have hugely inflated prices. PCs, for example, have a 40% duty slapped on them. Vendors also add large markups because they pay extremely high business license fees.
All this means that a low-end computer that would cost about USD 4-500 ends up costing not less than USD 1000 when it arrives here. Is it clearer now?
And stop calling me Jesus. 8^)
Crumb's Corollary: Never bring a knife to a bun fight.
The solution that eventually occured was that IBM donated a number of G40e laptops (thank you guys!) so we were able to put low-power, fancy computers out in the field.
Now the crux of the issue to me, and this is something which I've brought up earlier, so bear with me, is the question, Now What?
I've got a 2.8 gig 802.11g machine with 512 MB of RAM sitting here, doing what?
The hard part is making it useful. Not many people out in the villages enjoy reading slashdot regularly, so we have to find useful things that they can use these beasts for.
Essentially, what we did was to create an information portal, data was downloaded every day over a CDMA 1x connection, and presented in a form which was accesible to people. Weather forecasts, crop and vegetable prices, information about government schemes, employment opportunities in the nearest town and so on. If you want to know more, then drop me a mail and I would be happy to give you full details. Better yet, if you are involved in something similiar, please do get in touch.
Now the technology part is cool. I designed it to work completely in our favourite browser - Firefox - *ducks*, I used CSS to make sure that when you print out the information it's in an easy to read form. Also, since Open Office, FF, the Linux distro itself a number of other applications have recently been translated into the local language (Tamil) it has been easy for the people themselves to use it, rather than needing either an external person, or to have to painfully learn a new language.
Just to quickly respond to the infrastructure part, India has been really good at providing communications infrastructure at a grassroots level. Every village is linked with a 2 mbps pipe, and wireless internet using CDMA is fairly easily available. This is a god-send for us, who want to put an IT project in, without having to build this stuff up from scratch. I speak from experience in Indonesia, where we had to transmit using VHF. Fuck, that hurt.
Now sub-$100 machines are good. But, like someone else was saying here, the people themselves are NOT going to be buying this. It's more likely to be governements, NGOs and the like who do bulk-purchases and then provide them in conjuntion with various other schemes. Remember that in many parts of the world the annual income is less than $350. This is equivalent to somebody paying about $13'000 for a computer in the US (if they earn about $40k, which I assume an IT manager will).
The technology is cool for us. How useful is it for them?
R.