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MS Calls On Kids to Stop Thought Thieves
theodp writes "Microsoft is calling all UK kids aged 14-17 to enter its Thought Thieves Competition. Remember kids, finalists must agree to formally license all intellectual property rights in their film on terms acceptable to Microsoft. And don't forget to download your free Thought Thieves Poster!"
They have full experience in the complete spectrum of this matter although the balance is a bit thin on the creative side. So I think they make a perfect judge perhaps not the most unbiased but who cares about that anyway, just go with the current-flow.
I tried to think of some witty comments here but there is nothing I can say funnier, darker, or more ironic than the story itself. This is even richer than when the MS Front Page license including a clause forbidding the use of Front Page to make web pages critical of Microsoft. The gall of these people! This is a new low, though, even for them. "Thought thieves"?! Someone up at MS is having a huge laugh over this.
Thought Theives? So if I have an idea, never share it with anyone and never act on it or put it into any real tangible form and someone else has the same idea and acts on it, they're a thief and I'm a victim?
Talk about poorly labeled.
Oh well. Nothing surprises me anymore. I just hope kids remain indifferent enough that they don't buy into this. What's unfortunate is that I think - if they get to these kids early enough - they'll change their attitudes for life. Kind of like those school programs that convince second graders that their parents are evil if they smoke and that they're alcoholics if they have a glass of wine.
I have a feeling this is a hoax. But it'll make people think...
So start earlier. I recommend early childhood, age 4-6. I recommend showing movies to those kids where "thought thieves" are evil, dark figures that, preferably, linger under kids' beds. You'll make very powerful subconscious fears your ally that way.
Alternatively, start later. Most teenagers and students will really like the idea of sharing thoughts, and software, and music, and they will only part with it when they enter business life and get a chance to make money themselves by stopping to share. I recommend offering every potential free software/open source developer a large amount of money if they license their stuff to you, exclusively. If that doesn't work, offer them a job at Microsoft, and pay them well. Very well. You might be able to stem the tide that way.
But seriously, I don't think you will. There have always been developments in history that were so natural and unstoppable that it made those who tried to stop them extremely funny to look at. You're in the process of becoming such a comic figure, Microsoft.
JPEG of the "Thought Thieves Poster"
Microsoft Thought Thieves? Aren't they the ones usually stealing ideas from other companies? I can't think of one innovative and original piece of software from Microsoft.
--
Fairfax Underground: Fairfax County, VA public message board
What would I do?
I certainly wouldn't set up a competition involving the most imaginitive age group of 14-17, get them to give all their ideas to me, and then steal their rights to them.
Yep, first thing I thought of when I saw this were 1984's thought crimes... I only wish this was some sort of joke.
I wonder if an entry with some of Microsoft's own deeds would win.
Of course, now that I've come up with the idea, no one else can do it, lest they defeat the spirit of the Thought Thieves competition.
"If I have seen so far, it is by standing on the shoulders of giants" -- Isaac Newton.
Microsoft only have got where they are today by standing on the shoulders of giants - people who were free with their (highly insightful) thoughts. Don't they remember this?
I shudder to think how progress would get held back if each individual jealously guarded their thoughts from each other. This campaign sends entirely the wrong message.
Oolite: Elite-like game. For Mac, Linux and Windows
The subject of the videos is supposed to be 'intellectual property theft'. But as I'm most here know, copying something or using a patented device with out a licence is not theft. It does not deprive anyone of anything.
No one can own an idea.
If you want to claim you own data, keep it private. Once you sell it to me, it is mine, to keep or to give away.
Copyright is immoral. If you tell me a story, you do not have the right to tell me that I cannot repeat it. Everyone has the right to say what is on their mind, regardless of who first thought of it. The mere act of creation does not give you any special rights to tell other people what they can do with their property.
This is part of a pattern of major IP holders brainwashing children,
there needs to be an alternative voice in the classroom.
Abolish Copyright. Restore Freedom.
Just because that one in-house guy says he knows Photoshop, doesn't mean he knows good taste.
FIRED!
The scary thing here isn't Microsoft doesn't want children to steal thoughts
The scary thing here is Microsoft thinks they own children's thoughts
Microsoft for stealing the kids' thoughts by having them give up their intellectual property to Microsoft.
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There is inferior bacteria on the interior of your posterior.
Ok, can someone explain to me how "kids" are suppose to make a "film" on IP rights with legally purchased software? As a small-time film maker, I can attest to the fact that creative software is EX-FUCKING-PENSIVE (not to mention, most enteries will probably be made on a Mac). It's all a little counter-productive to me.
But is the Nazi parallel really that strong? To my knowledge, Microsoft hasn't been exterminating people.
I think Godwin had something to say about this... um, oh nevermind.
Here's another idea for a film. Turn the contest around and show how people benefit from the sharing of ideas.
Setting: prehistoric man, living in a cave. Gork has the idea of rubbing two sticks together to make a fire. He finds that fire is indeed warm, and it is very comfortable to sit near it. The fire keeps him warm during the cold night.
Grog is very jealous of Gork's fire, and steals one of the burning branches while Gork is not looking, so that he can have his own fire. He carefully takes the branch to his cave, and makes his own fire. Ironically, Gork's fire keeps burning...
Grog enjoys his new fire, and soon realises that it is also very good for preparing food. Grog roasts himself a good meal. Grok is enticed by the new smells, and cones to check it out. He sees Grog also has a fire.
Should he be furious and sue for patent infringement??? It took him a lot of work and time to figure out the proper way to rub two sticks together to make the fire. No, Grok tries the food and likes the roasting idea as well. He stays awhile and learns what Grog has been doing. Pretty soon, Grok is enjoying his own home-cooked meals by his warm fire, having benefited from Grog building on his idea. Both are happier and warmer because of the fire. Both have learned something new from each other, and both are better off for the sharing of ideas.
fastforward a generation, and they are swapping BBQ recipies..
--
Please steal this idea and work with it. And then share it with everyone else.
The significant problems we face cannot be solved by the same level of thinking that created them. -Einstein
From the website:
Thought Thieves is about people stealing and profiting from your creation or innovation. Think about it: how would you feel if you saw your hard work being passed off as the property of someone else? What would you do?
ALSO from the website:
I will formally licence, on terms acceptable to Microsoft, all intellectual property rights
in my film and agree to waive all moral rights in relation to my film if requested to do
so.
I mean.....WTF!
Infinite time means everything that can happen, will. You being you is absolutely incidental. You do not exist.
Yes (me too), that's what jumped at me as well.
What can be said in their defense is that at least they had the decency to put the two paragraphs on different documents, even if each document is a maximum 2 pages long. So considering the MS lawyers were performing "constrained writing" (I mean hey, they're trying to bind minors into a legal contract, so they have to keep it simple), they achieved a maximum of educational value in a very small package.
To wit: I predict that the winner and the two runners-up will regret having signed the contract, and will thus learn a valuable lession. The lession is: if you made the movie for money, then you have just been screwed over, because you signed away your money-making rights. If you made your movie for art, then you have just been screwed over, because you signed away your distribution rights. And, especially in the latter case, you would have been leaps better off with an OSS / creative commons sort of thing.
And that, I call a very valuable lession.
/Thank you Microsoft! May I have another one, please?! *tHwAcK*
yes, we have no bananas
There is another aspect of this particular "bounty hunting" campaigne that is fascinating, disturbing, and possibly original. Namely, it is deliberately rewarding and encouraging people to MISUNDERSTAND the law about copyright, patent, and "ideas."
Would such bounties be acceptable if they encouraged other kinds of legal misunderstandings? For example, many people may erroneously believe "it is legal for me to download anything that appears on the Internet." Imagine if some large company provided similar bounties for films like this:
"Stop Illegal Harassment! Illegal harassment is when some person or company threatens you to stop doing something, even when you are doing nothing wrong. It sounds like science fiction, but it happens all the time. Some people and companies are contacting individuals who download things on the Internet and threatening them. How would you feel if your brother gave you a copy of the book he just finished reading -- and the publisher came and threatened you for 'stealing' the book? What would you do? We want to know."
Yes, the example above glides easily between different issues and concepts. But so does the Microsoft announcement, as it talks about "stealing thoughts" one moment -- and then asks how you would feel if people stole the *results* of thought, work, and effort.
In either case, it is frightening that it is so easy to start the equivalent of a vigilante campaigne that plays on -- and encourages -- people's confusion about the law. Even more frightening is that such campaignes may be perfectly legal.
And so you are doing exactly what they want: spread the fallacy that "ideas" or "thoughts" can be "stolen". Even most IPR law scholars agree that "intellectual property" is something entirely different from physical property and that you can't "steal" it.
The natural rights doctrine (I "made" it so it's all mine and mine alone) does not hold in the world of immaterial creations. It is introduced by creating artificial scarcity using laws, which should only apply in cases where they have overall positive effects.
With their "How would you feel if ..." oneliners, Microsoft reaches out to the inner desire of many people to be able to get rich simply by being the first to think of something. It can however easily be reversed: "How would you feel if you worked 2 years on a computer program completely on your own and when you tried to sell it, all sorts of people would start asking money from you even though all they did was pay a patent lawyer to file some documents describing ideas they once had?"
Donate free food here
Oh wait....shit....they're serious?
MS Rep: Hey kids, what do you need to stop thought theives? Thats right! Thought police!
Kids: Yay!
Seriously, I can't believe they ended up using the term 'thought thieves' even though any thought-crime is strongly associated with '1984'. What better way to reinforce the big brother image. Whoever thought this thing up deserves a mention in the annals of great PR history!
"When the only tool you own is a hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail." - Abraham Maslow (1908-1970)
Naw. That would imply that that you gave some thought to making the $6/hr Microsoft intern want to puke his or her guts on the table.
However, blanking out the first portion of the tape till you get to a juicy bit might be a good idea. So they don't just turn it off when they see the opening title and credits..
.sig: Now legally binding!
Not directly related, but this reminds me of RMS's story The Right To Read for some reason.
-- Ed Avis ed@membled.com
Yes they would... imagine if someone made a movie about all the companies that Microsoft crushed and stole from, just because they could. I know there is a much, much longer list of little companies who were lured in by Microsoft, had all their ideas stolen, and then cast aside.
I'll start the list.
Stac Electronics
Burst.com
Borland
Caldera over Dr. DOS in UK
This is almost a job for Michael Moore....
Unfortunately that idea comes directly from Sovjet Russia and the german Hitler jugend. Actually that indeed does work to some degree, but only to some, many people who were in the HJ or similar Sovjet organizations still became nice and critical adults during adulthood, because there is always the factor that only a certain percentage of people are sheep.
How can we ever compare common thievery with institutional thievery? Abuse of power? Please.
Anyway, I used to be the kind of person who hated SW piracy to death (to name some "evil thievery" thing) - until i met REALLY poor people. And this was in 92, Linux was simply out of the radar. I realized that sometimes the law was evil.
People grow, kids stop being naive. When they mature, they'll realize not everything's black and white.
Not Jewish holocaust, but certainly they've been involved in software product companies holocaust big time. (Symantec C++? Borland Office Suite? etc, etc...)
That is absolutely ridiculous, even for slashdot standards.
You are seriously comparing one of the most horrific events of the 20th century, the slaughter and torture of millions of men, women, and children, to the "death" of a god damn office suite?
Don't you think that this trivializes the real holocaust just a bit?
-CausticPuppy "Of all the people I know, you're certainly one of them." -Somebody I don't know
They have done this sort of thing before. Microsoft and irony go together, somehow ...
because there is always the factor that only a certain percentage of people are sheep.
...but the point is to make most well-trained sheep, and the rest too intimidated to take action. And those who are neither sheep nor intimidated, are either incapacitated by the government or an angry mob.
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
If that isn't loaded language then I don't know what is. How is violating intellectual copyright all of a sudden tantamount to theft? If I remember correctly the definition of theft includes not only the obtainment of but the withholdment of property as well.
When thoughts are outlawed, only outlaws will think.
Mod Karma -1: I sed bad wurds. If I cep my mouf shut, I wud be at riyses.