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The Science of Star Wars
anonymous lion writes "National Geographic has an interesting interview with a couple of scientists on the scientific reality of Star Wars. For example, related to the cohabitation of humans and Gungans on NabooSeth Shostak states, "So maybe it's possible to share, as long as neither species has the technology to obliterate, enslave, or merely cook and eat each other.""
...by the Bad Astromer. Still, I can never get enough of nitpicking sessions on Hollywood science. :-)
Well, that's all well and good, but massive underwater nuclear warfare has unknown (probably rather devastating) consequences on the environment as a whole. A decidedly better option is to create a briefcase-sized tactical neutron device and have carriers go inside the enclosed urban habitat to detonate.
Human civilization is approx. 4000 years old. In that time we have pretty much closed the technology gap of the vairous tribes of humanity. We can all forge metal, we can all make things move via petroleum based products, we can kill each other with projectiles ect...
In 10,000 the technology gap of a community of star systems that communicate with each other woudl also close. So it's not such a huge issue. Technology doesn't have to spread directly, even the rumor of something being possible can send other cultures into a frenzy to find out how. The stories marco polo brought back from china were more useful then the inventions and products he brought back. It sent europe into a frenzy into trying to mimic these items.
In the proccess of trying to mimic these products they derived their own innovations and advanced further. Over 10,000 this would equilize the technologies of the various intelligent life forms. As for the robots, perhaps innovation in robot designed leveled off long ago and even 100 year old droid are useful. Or AI requires some rare material that is now in short supply so even old droids must be maintained.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."
500 years ago we thought the earth was flat, today we think its a scientific impossibility to travel at the speed of light. 500 years from now we'll probably be wondering if its possible to leap over to the neighbouring universe.
Well, that would be largely inevitable or highly improbable.
Survival will be the primary goal of any form of life, and survival will require consumption of resources.
Unless the resources required for two life forms is remarkably different or there is a truly symbiotic relationship, it is quite likely that the two forms of life will be fighting with each other for resources. It may not even be intentional, but survival would require a fight at least at a very abstract level (deer and zebras sharing the same grasslands). And when you introduce complex factors into the equation, you can be rest assured that there will be a need for survival as you move up the food chain.
If you do not kill, you will be killed - this is a very likely scenario, and if sentience is to evolve, it would need safe and secure surivival first and foremost.
Learning to share resources is possible in only one scenario - symbiosis. Otherwise, it is quite unlikely given the nature of life, at least as we know it.
The other is stating that an advanced civilization would shun planets for artificial habitats. For an astronomer, he seems unfamiliar with the fact that the universe is largely cold, empty space with nasty hazards and such. Why would a race automaticly want to go live in space?
"A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing" - Alan Perlis
what i never understood was the scientific reasoning behind how a "long time ago" in a "galaxy far far away" a species identical to humans (so much to be called by the same name IIRC) evolved and is technologically superior by probably a few centuries to a millenium to us. Anyone have any ideas?
Move Sig, for great justice.
I agree with king-manic that technological gulfs, while huge, could be reduced significantly through interstellar trade. What is more signficant -- and I never see mentioned in these types of discussions -- are the huge gulfs in intelligence and mental abilities. There are going to be species out there that are vastly more intelligent or have incredible memories. In the movies and TV shows, all aliens have pretty much the same brainpower. That's just unrealistic.
Consider the following scenario: a race of technologically advanced reptiles are being attacked by intelligent insects from another world. The insects are more intelligent than the reptiles and have the same level of technological development. The reptiles are fucked unless they can get some help. They approach a world called Earth that contains intelligent bipedial mammals named humans. These mammals show promise but are relatively young and do not have sophisticated technology. They also are highly unpredictable and warlike. Knowing the risks, the reptiles make an offer: if the humans agree to enter the war by serving as tactical officers onboard their warships, the reptiles will provide the humans with advances in medicine, communications, power generation, and warp drive. Humans, eager for a chance to obtain technologies necessary to solve problems on their planet, leap at the chance. The highly-logical insects are used to the methodical, logical battleplans of the reptiles and are baffled by the unconventional tactics of the humans. They are quickly and easily defeated. Fearing they have created a monster, the reptiles quickly sever ties with the humans but not before they have transfered a signficant amount of technological know-how. Within a few decades, humans become a threat to the very reptiles who kick-started their space exploration.
Technology gaps are easily solved. Huge gaps in cognitive function are what make long-duration star wars unlikely.
GMD
watch this
My favorite "among other things" is the existance of life. A couple possibilities on why we haven't seen aliens (apart from those aliens who strangely only visit drunken hillbillies). In a galaxy with probably trillions of planets, where are the aliens? There should be countless species, all with plenty of time and tech to find us.
1) They're trying to conceal themselves from us. Of course, the questions of A) How, and B) Why immediately come up. They're furthered by the questions of "if one species is concealing itself, why are the others as well?", "how are they blocking all life-indicating radio signals/etc from us that originated hundreds, thousands, or millions of light years away?", etc. In short, it's possible, but raises questions.
2) We're the first. Yeay for us - we'll be the evil aliens invading the planets of others to colonize or strip them of their resources (until one of them uploads a macintosh virus into our computer). Of course, the odds against this seems quite extreme.
3) FTL is, sadly, impossible, and all other signs of life (radio, light, death stars blowing up planets, etc) are either taking too long to get to us, or are too weak to be received by the time that they reach us.
4) Life is extremely rare, and we're freaks of the universe. May raise questions about the existance of a deity (or not).
All of these are pretty big issues with a lot of questions associated with them. I'd love to know the answer, although all possibilities are a bit disturbing to me.
P.S. - I don't want to post AC (and am trying first as a different IP, about to give up), but I get this:
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Sigur RÃs: I didn't know that Heaven had a rock band.
The story is being told in the future. Therefore, "a long time ago" isn't referring to our past, but the past of the narrator.
The "galaxy far, far away" is our own. But in the future, when the story of Star Wars is being told, humanity has moved to distant galaxies.
And how do polar bears get so big? They eat stuff you don't see that often because it's under the ice: seals. Hoth must have some kind of geothermal-fed water underworld goin' on.
Power to the Peaceful
The comic makes a good point - of course the really more mature (in terms of discussion) source for the idea of a city planet is Trantor http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trantor .
:)
Asimov makes the exact point, in fact a whole lot of the plot in some books is about, the problems of supplying the population.
I guess the idea of many sci-fi writers is that a dyson sphere or segment of such would make for a much more likely galactic capital. Certainly a more impressive use of resources than covering a grotty planet with metal and so much more efficient.
Still give London enough time....
Fighters make sound in a vacuum.
Wrong. The space between stars in Star Wars is not a vacuum. There is evidently some background gas suffusing all of it, although probably not breathable.
Evidence:
1. Vehicles are audible even far from a planet's surface.
2. When the Falcon landed in a "cave" inside a smallish asteroid (1 km radius), Han Solo got out and wandered around without a pressurized space-suit.
3. Small fighter-ships in space combat manuver as if they were airplanes, slicing through a medium which imposes a maximum speed to their movement, rather than being able to accelerate indefinately (until stopped by lightspeed or fuel exhaustion).
And Leia, Obi-wan puts her where she'll become a princess, because her mother was a queen. Fer crying out loud, a princess is a princess only because she can document her lineage and everyone will know it! Way to hide her, Obi-wan!
This begs the question whether all the "humans" in the SW universe are the same species. Unless you're a rabid creationist, the answer must be yes, and so the Naboo were colonists sometime in the not too distant (in evolutionary terms at least) past. The Gungans may be non-native too for that matter. So "co-evolving" doesn't really apply. Further, the Gungans may actually be human in ancestry, just engineered to fit an aquatic lifestyle. That in general could explain a big problem (mentioned in the NG FA), that all the intelligent species are at a very similar level scientifically; they're all human and all descended from the same planet and culture, and some have undergone radical genetic engineering (or less likely, customarily wear rubber prosthetics and furry body suits). You just can't have wars if one species is decades, let alone millions of years, ahead of the others.
Actually that trench the rebels flew down to set off the conveniently placed self-destruct button houses the hyper and sublight engines, that's why it's on the equator.
Don't remember where I read that, I think it's in one of the Star Wars dictionaries or encyclopedias.
While Yoda didn't like starting so late (Anakin was 9 not four, according to Lucas Ep1 was a story about a 9 year old boy.), his main objection was 'fear' in the boy. Anakin was just to subject fears and worries.
**minor spoiler**
Notice how fear of loosing Padme is THE reason he falls victum to Palpatine manipulations. Anakin is trully fuds biggest victum. It's even possible Yoda and the other masters got some hint of this through thier views of the future.
Mycroft
https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea
Actually ESB and ROTJ are the condensed versions.
Luke spent many months on Dagobah (in essentially non-stop training with Master Yoda), and even more time tracking down what happened to Han.
If you read the books there are a few years (I've heard 5 quoted often) between episodes V and VII. I haven't read to many of them but this seems a pretty clear element to all the ones that mention it.
Also it's pretty clear Yoda stuck to the core elements and didn't cover much else such as Jedi history, obscure powers of the Jedi, Proper ettiquite when giving reports to the Jedi Council durring a holliday. In other words Luke got the Tech School version from a True Master determined to teach him hard and fast.
My impression from the books I've read is that Luke later realized Yoda pared down his teaching to strictly that Luke needed and could use and skipped a lot of the less critical skills and ones Luke didn't have much talent for. In one scene I remember Luke is shown to have an active pursuit of anything related to the Jedi in order to help with what he now percieves as the holes in his education.
Mycroft
https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea
Just like Whales and Humans?
What I find extremely odd is that the Gungans breathed atmosphere, yet lived underwater in a seemingly unnatural (i.e. gungan-made) underwater city. Are they just the evolution of a penal colony?
Wow, interesting. I wonder how different the Earth would be if humans lived among other species or even other kingdoms of life forms. That's why I love science fiction. I have to cut this short and go walk my dog.
Yoda's fears about Anakin turning to the dark side were a self-fulfulling prophecy. In their distrust, the Jedi held Anakin down in every way they could, instead of embracing him as the chosen one. The Jedi were poor masters.
Anakin was born as a slave on Tattooine, conscripted into a Jedi slavery where he could not rescue or even visit his mother, and finally sucked into Sith apprenticeship under Sidious. He was always somebody's slave, never free to follow his dreams and wishes. Luke may have felt tied down on the farm, but at least he wasn't a slave. He lived with family, had friends, and got to fix and fly spaceships for fun. Yoda never sensed fear in Luke, only recklessness: a fearlessness that comes from living free.
Obi-Wan totally let Anakin down. Qui-Gon would have let Anakin rescue his mother, the Council be damned. Then Obi-Wan lies to and manipulates Anakin's innocent children to try to undo his mistakes. I'm surprised he waited for Luke to grow up, rather than taking him to Dagobah at age 3.
So you watch Star Wars for the 'philosophy' and the philosophy is 'good will win'?
Give us a break! Why don't you watch cowboy movies then?
American philosophy seems to be that Americans will always 'win', where 'win' consists of shooting the baddie in the last reel. Then the film ends, so you don't need to think any more.
I wouldn't mind so much, only American Foreign Policy is exactly the same.