Slashdot Mirror
After College, What Type of Jobs Should One Seek?
Sushant Bhatia asks: "I'm coming to the end of my Masters degree, and I'm on the prowl for jobs. However, there are so many types out there it's just overwhelming for someone who's never had to go through the job-hunting process before. So, what should I do? Should I go for a full-time, contract, half-time, or something else? Also, what kind of position should a person with a Master's in Computer Science be looking for (other than dish washer)? I've been looking at senior software developer positions, but is that too high up the ladder for someone 'fresh' to cope with? My current manager (research lab) says that 'You should always find a job that is above your skill level so that you can learn and be challenged.' I think he's right, but is that something Slashdot readers agree with? What was your job coming out of university?"
why? i graduated in march with a BS in CS (math minor too). with a 2.5 gpa, no references really or any industry experience and only applied for jobs online. Now in june i'm an official software engineer making good money. The irony is how much i listened to slashdot's gloomy idea of the real world was considering doing something else outside the computer industry because there was no jobs for me (as you would believe by reading slashdot). Not that it was easy for me to get this job, but it wasn't the only response i got to my resume. Course I also think I got pretty lucky.
So my personal advice is to try and do what you like and not get disappointed over being rejected. And I think people in masses tend to be pessimists.. so take what they (slashdot) say witha grain of salt.
I tend to approach it with 2 questions rather than 1.
.". The second keeps you from asking, "Why oh why did I . . .?" at the same age.
If today is the last day of my life, would my plans change?
AND
If I live another 65 years, will I regret anything included in my plans today?
Between the 2, you get a balance that keeps you from wasting the few years you actually do have, but without the reckless disregard for your future, should you have one (and statistically you will).
The first question keeps you from reaching old age, saying "I wish I had . .
The Glass is Too Big: My Take on Things
Let me apologize up front for how vehemently I'm going to disagree with you.
No. I mean no. For the love of God, No! Have you lost your bloody mind?! NO!
Don't. Ever. Work. For. Free. You might as well wear a sandwich board that reads "My time is worthless and I'm so naive that I believe an idea put forth by suits looking to recruit cheap, easily-abused labor. I'm beyond desperate, so please, pay me some lowball chump change."
Take a lesson from the marketers. People honestly believe that a thing is worth what you paid for it. If you ever work for someone for free, you'll never convince them to pay top dollar for your services.
You wouldn't believe how much my life has improved since I learned to look them right in the ye without blinking and say "You're right. I compete on quality, not price. To be honest, these are my prices if I design and implement. If I have to go through the headache of fixing someone else's mistakes, I charge a 20% premium."
You'd be amazed at how that one little statement/attitude improves your world. You never have to deal with those neurotic not-worth-the-trouble PITA clients, and the rest come to the job with a "he's expensive, he must know what he's doing" mentality.
So long as you can deliver the goods, it's a far more satisfying way to run your business.
He put his boots up on the table and made a face. "The sig," he smirked. "You can waste your life in search of the sig."
"So when a worshipping blogger posts a product rumor I don't like, I sue him. When a book gets written I don't appreciate, I have it banned from stores. And why do I do this? Because a fawning media and corrupt power structure let me get away with it. Because when I stand up here and spout revisionist treacle about fonts and calligraphy and my role in being first with the Macintosh, people like you believe it. And it gets reported and reprinted without challenge."
"So when I look in the mirror each morning and think about whether it's my last day on earth, I also say to myself, "Just in case it isn't, I better make sure I take care of No. 1." And I guess the lesson to you as you make your way through life is, Don't cross me, or I'll crush you. And nobody will be around to stick up for you while I do it. They'll all be too busy applauding my bogus life lessons while thinking, "What a guy!""
-- Seattle Times Columnist Paul Andrews re-writes Steve Jobs' Stanford commencement speech
I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
>I hope you don't get a "senior" level position.
The worst thing about that would be, moving into a senior position that the people below you didn't get promoted to.
Getting the job will be a lot easier than getting their respect.
Management has a whole different dynamic. People won't resent you for getting hired as a manager, but they sure will, if you fill some "senior" developer opening that the company didn't fill from the current pool.
You really don't want to be in a workplace where your whole team resents you because you got hired on your credentials where they did not get promoted on their experience.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
"Actually Wal-Mart has a very advanced inventory management system. Headquarters knows within minutes when you buy a candy bar even."
So I've read....
But, let me fill you in on the reality.
Christmas eve a few years back. I needed a Jeep Wrangler Power Wheels last minute. I'd heard of the legendary Wal-Mart inventory management system, so I figure a phone call and all would be well.
So, I called the closest store, and they said they didn't have any left (big surprise on Christmas eve). But never fear, the next closest store has 3 in stock.
So, I truck on over there only to find that not only do they have none, but they haven't seen any for a week--or so said the manager of the department. In disbelief, I combed the aisles looking for the three they supposedly in stock. I gave up after 20 minutes of wandering the garden section (Which is where they keep the excess stock of that stuff).
On my way home, I drove passed the Wal-Mart that I had originally called and figured I'd stop in to look at their power wheels selection to see what they had left in Silverados and what not, as being the newest Super Wal-Mart in my area, they had the biggest selection. When I walked in, there it was sitting in the middle of the aisle, a Jeep Wrangler Power Wheels.
An employee asked me if I was finding everything ok, so I asked them why I was told that they had none in stock when this was sitting right here in plain view.
He looked at the box, and looked at me and said, "well, this here was supposed to have been delivered to another store. But I guess the driver forgot to drop it there, so it ended up here, 'cuz he didn't want to return to the dock with it in his truck still. We're the last store on his route so that happens all the time."
So, there you have it. The system might be designed to work a certain way, but it's only as strong as the people involved.
Don't search for jobs at all. Incorporate yourself and find a business mentor, by asking around at your school's small business office - most good schools should have one. Call your alum affice and ask if any alum has offered to be a mentor in their field.
Make yourself up some business cards, and have at it! Starting a business is pretty easy, and if you work hard at it one can be a lot more successful than simply working for someone else.
Get an HSA (health savings account) with a small business association, and start a Roth IRA immediately.
In an interview in Inc. 500 a few years back, many hiring managers said that prior ownership of a tech business (even if it failed miserably) immediately put someone at the top of the list for a lead technical position or management.
Good luck!
'Be always mindful, even when ditch-digging.' --D. T. Suzuki
I would venture to suggest that CS degrees are devalued because computers technologies are becoming commodities. I will give an example of my own experience as a BSc Computer Engineer.
When I graduated in 2004 I was recruited by a Canadian celluar company into their IT department. For me I was hired into the operations side so sysadmin and tech support kind of work. Along with me various people from UofT and Waterloo were hired into the development side of IT. From talking with the people hired as developers I found out that during the interviews no one was interested in their knowledge of basic CS theories. Sure they asked about QA and software engineer questions. They also asked very hard questions about SQL. But there were nothing about O(n) or anything like that in the exam given during the interview.
For this company it's not suprising as is it all about data in from Oracle and then data out to web applications. In almost all cases they are dealing with O(n) complexity. All the hardwork for sorting etc are done already by Oracle inside their DB.
It's all part of the trend in computing. When PCs ran DOS people had to know how to program at quite low levels. You want a GUI? You had to built some sort of a GUI. Then came windows and GUIs were a matter of programming to an API. Of course then most people used C or C++ which needed you to do some sort of memory managment. Then came JAVA which removed even the need to do memory managment.
I am generalizing a bit but the point is that successive generation of technology made creating applications more simple. Add to that the fact that there are more and more software houses developing turn key solution for what used to be custom applications. And you have on one hand a reduction of skills required of developers. On the other hand a reduction of number of jobs because these software houses can market their wares world wide making increasing competition and reducing the number of firms making software. In turn this means there are fewer programming jobs needing people with lower skill levels.
For me finding this out was pretty much the last straw. The last thing I want was to be a replacable cog. So I found a job doing hardware work instead. I feel a little more secure as they still haven't managed to make hardware/firmware development something anyone can do. My advice to anyone about to enter University is: Pick a subject that deals in the physical world. Software's too easily virtualized into simplicity.