Slashdot Mirror
Roadkill on the Convergence Highway
Duke Weber writes "Microsoft sometimes gets it right after three tries. Not so with Windows Media Center 2005. You do get a dancing Scooby Doo. You don't get much Media." From the article: "As a DVR, one tuner was just OK, with a second tuner working, it was still OK, provided you weren't too picky about mouths moving at the same time words came out. Out with the snazzy Realtek integrated sound on the ASUS-A8V motherboard. In with an Audigy 2ZS to lessen the load on the AMD 64 3000+ processor. More gadgets. That cured the synch. The picture still was no where close to a vintage Tivo. But it does keep track of the programs, important with a terabyte of disc."
Replay TV for me, all the way...
I like auto-skipping commercials, which is something I haven't seen in other DVRs.
I spent a lot of time shopping for the 'right' media PC, and came to a different conclusion: the 'media appliance' concept (with DLink still leading the way with their DLINK DSM-320) beats both set-top-boxes from the media providers and the pc-solutions provided by Microsoft, Sony, et. al. The DLink separates content from delivery - it's just there to play and present, and it does it well, wirelessly, without a hassle. It's not a DVR, but perhaps future versions will be. You're right, though - with cable providers bundling DVRs with service for a few dollars, PC vendors should allow that to stay in a different realm, and be content with delivery to TV from PC, and vice-versa. That is: they (Microsoft, Sony, etc) should be willing to step back, understand where their field ends, and then dominate up to that border, without trying to cross it.
My Video Blog!
Good post, I agree with basically everything you say.
The "IR blaster" solution is inelegant at best
You are right, it is inelegant. And yet, it works. I have a MythTV with an IR blaster so that it can change channels on the set-top box whenever it needs to. At first, this was really annoying. If you're watching live TV and you want to change channels, there is a significant lag since your command is routed through the computer, then the IR blaster, then the set-top box changes channels, and finally there is the buffering delay inherent to the capture card.
But you know what? In the end it didn't matter. The whole point of a PVR or HTPC is that you stop watching TV in the old "channel-surfing" mode. Everytime you sit down to watch TV, you have a slew of programs that have been recorded... and they are all programs you (more or less) want to watch, since you recorded them. No more flipping around trying to find something to watch. And if the show sucks, you delete it. Nothing lost.
And if you really want to channel surf, you can just have the normal (unbuffered) cable going into your TV's second input. Treat your HTPC as a VCR, so that you sometimes watch live TV and sometimes watch recorded stuff. In practice, I have found that live TV is no longer a concern.
This is just my experience. YMMV
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
This guy's problem is not Windows Media Center, it is because he built the machine himself. If he did any research, he would have learned that hardware compatibility is key to having a smooth running MCE. Using built in sound chip? PUHLEEZE! Unless you have Intel chipset, you are going to have some major problems (VIA boards SUCK!!!) You could have gotten a $20 Chaintech AV-710 and he would never have had to deal with his sound problems. And poor picture? I am guessing he purchased some cheap 1st generation tuners. If you would have gotten ATI 550 based tuners, the picture quality would surpass that of any Tivo. And did you even try HDTV??? IT ROCKS!!! It is VERY important that you test out hardware compatibility before building an MCE yourself (unless you want to do a LOT of experimentation). Which is WHY MS DOES NOT SELL MCE by itself!!! If you have the right hardware setup, MCE is a pleasure. I have over 500GB recorded TV and another 100GB of music and picture. I also have about 50 DVD's ripped on the hard drive that I can watch without ever getting up from the couch. There is no other device (including APPLE) that will allow you to do that as easily as MCE.
CableCard will fix this problem when it becomes mandatory and ubiquitous.
This is the one good thing about the FCC overstepping its bounds and mandating hardware support (unlike the broadcast flag).
I am becoming gerund, destroyer of verbs.
My small company is an OEM System Builder, even though we don't want to build and sell computers (we'd rather fix them).
Microsoft invited us to an event, gave us a for-resale copy of MCE 2005, and sold us $1200 worth of hardware that they selected to work with MCE for $399: mobo, Athlon 64 3000+, RAM, video card, tuner card, everything but a case and power supply.
So, I brought it all home, built a Media Center, and invited it into our lives.
It did what we asked of it, although it did so rather poorly.
The sound and video were synched OK, and the TV listing and recording features were easy to use. The remote control and IR blaster worked our Comcast digital box with about 95% reliability (and that 5% is a HUGE pain in the ass, let me tell you). All in all, it did most of what a TiVo (or Comcast's own DVR) could manage, in a much larger and louder package.
(Note: You can install more than one tuner card, but you must use the same tuning method on all cards... to do this on our setup, we would have needed to use two rented digital cable boxes).
Here's the best part: the build was only stable for about a month, after which it would BSOD and reboot itself about once a day. Rebuilding the OS would solve the problem for another month, so it was NOT hardware-related.
God forbid I had actually sold one of these things!
Happy ending: the parts made a smoking fast desktop, which is stable (as stable as any Windows box, at least).
AMD64, Audigy, hardcore mobo? I've had a dual tuner (PVR-250) PVR, with a miniATX Athlon 2000+, nVidia 5200 and a Fortissimo III (for the optical output) running without a hitch with SageTV for years. It not only records two shows at once but will replay a third without breaking a sweat!
What? I can only watch 4 lousy ABC shows? What? Only 320 by 200 resolution???
You fail to think of the future, when there could be a lot more TV shows there. Possibly even in better resolution though the current one is more than good enough to convey the subtle nuances TV has to offer (I can tell you've not tried watching any of them). It's definatley a far cry better than VCR or over the air quality.
The basic principle is sound. Why bother with all the UI and technical architecture issues you have with recording when the whole point of a PVR is to get a file into a random access digital file anyway? Aren't you simply better off starting with a whole digital file and working from there? Why does there need to ever be a time component involved other than when content is initially put up for aquisition?
TV viewers are like someone waiting at an airport luggage carosel, waiting until just the right interval of time arrives to get what they want. Why should TV viewing be that unpleasant now when there is no need. Why doesn't your video luggage just arrive and wait right in front of you for you to get it, now that it can.
I can also watch HD football on the Mac BTW - either with an HD tuner or downloading a torrent of same. In the future I should just be able to come home any time and start a football stream from scratch if I like.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
People always assume you need to spend a great deal of money for Tivo box. I recently bought a Tivo 40 hour for $50AR. I bought a 300gig HD for $100. I spent $299 for the lifetime subscription. So, for $449 I now have a 300 hour Tivo box.
You might say,"But you modified it, lost your warranty, etc". That is true, I threw away my 90-day warranty on a device that you can easily get spare parts for almost like a computer (check out www.weaknees.com). I also gained 300 hours worth of Tivo time that took me an hour to install using free software.
Now, on the value of Tivo versus Myth.TV and the variety of other vendors. It will cost you well more than $800 for the hardware to properly run a computer that is setup similar to a Tivo box. If you make it a Media Center computer, you're talking easily $1500-2000 for something that isn't much cheaper than Tivo. Cost wise, I spent $449 dollars over a 5-10 year period on something that will work. No messy fixes, no glitches because a built-in soundcard doesn't have a linux driver, it just works.
Tivo is to media devices what Apple is to computers, they build things that work intuitively. Take the dive, spend the money up front, and enjoy Tivo. The work-arounds for a "free" DVR aren't there, and probably never will be.
The hidden value proposition of analog cable has, for a long time, been that one did not need the expense of a cablebox for additional TVs (to receive non encrypted service one was already paying for). I doubt that analog will be encryped now as the future is digital (though I find the digital sound WORSE than analog and sometimes more difficult to hear speech). IF ALL digital becomes encrpted as a way for cable companies to MAX out their Revenue (extras like a Cablebox and remote etc etc for every TV) the value proposition of Cable TV service falls...... With other services becoming available it's not a good time for Cable companies to try to MAX OUT their Revenue IMHO. Yup I am aware that some Cable companies already encrypt. That's one of the reasons whu I suggested users do their due diligence up front re type of signal etc.