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LBT Publishes "First Light" Image

Posted by ScuttleMonkey on from the still-too-much-of-that-air-stuff-in-the-way dept.

FarmKing writes "The Large Binocular Telescope has achieved "first light" and published it's first image of NGC891. The image was taken with one of it's two 8.4 Meter (~655 ft^2) mirrors. When fully operational, LBT will be one of the largest optical telescopes in the world."

33 comments

  1. hubble? by Ojuice · · Score: 2, Interesting

    So what are the technical specs. of this telescope compared to the Hubble?

    1. Re:hubble? by beeplet · · Score: 5, Informative

      From this page it looks like the two telescopes in combination have a resolution 10x that of Hubble. Hubble's primary mirror is 2.4 m in diameter compared to the LBT's 8.4 m (but atmospheric distortion lowers the resolution of ground-based telescopes). The main advantage to the dual-telescope set-up is not the increased resolution, but the ability to do optical interferometry: cancel out the signal that you don't want, or select for the signal that you do.

      The Keck Telescope in Hawaii is also designed to do optical interferometry, though I'm not sure what kind of results they have gotten so far.

    2. Re:hubble? by deglr6328 · · Score: 3, Informative

      The Kecks, though they are capable of nulling interferometry, are not capable of imaging interferometry. Or at least they will not be capable of it until they complete the construction of the 4(?) small "outrigger" telescopes around the two Kecks currently on the top of the mountain. The completion of these small outriggers has been delayed for several years however because of the (idiotic) cries of "oh noes it will disturb the sacred mountain spirits so you can't build anything there ever anymore!!" from native Hawaiian tribe organizations. The binocular telescope in Arizona, when finished, will be ready right away to perform full imaging aperture synthesis with a ~22 meter baseline and simultaneous adaptive optics correction (with future capability for advanced multi-conjugate adaptive optics correction). This should (theoretically) allow near .005 arcsecond resolution in the visible spectrum to be achieved. Very exciting.

      --
      - "Hear that?! The percolations are imminent! Cease your ingress!"
    3. Re:hubble? by Somegeek · · Score: 3, Insightful
      deglr6328 stated:
      The completion of these small outriggers has been delayed for several years however because of the (idiotic) cries of "oh noes it will disturb the sacred mountain spirits so you can't build anything there ever anymore!!" from native Hawaiian tribe organizations.
      Why are they idiotic cries? Just because it is not your religion's most sacred site that is being desecrated doesn't mean that it doesn't matter or isn't important. How far would this project get if its proposed site was the Wailing Wall, or Saint Catherine's Monastery on Mount Sinai?
      --
      And as you tread the halls of sanity, You feel so glad to be, Unable to go beyond. I have a message, From another time..
    4. Re:hubble? by orasio · · Score: 1

      I agree with the previous reply.
      Hawaiians deserve the same respect for their religion/culture as everybody else.

      If you don't like it, build it in your back yard. If your back yard is not a suitable spot, tough luck.

    5. Re:hubble? by Tango42 · · Score: 1

      Precisely - none at all.

    6. Re:hubble? by deglr6328 · · Score: 2

      Why did I say they are idiotic? I didn't think I'd actually have to spell it out but...well, here we go. They are idiotic complaints for the same reason every other religious/superstitious complaint against the advancement of science is entertained these days. They are idiotic because when the progress of science and rational inquiry into the workings of the universe are held to the fickle whims and fears of irrational belief systems, then in my opinion that is an embarrassing and gross failure of the pursuit of human betterment.

      I'm afraid your rhetorical question of what I would think if the proposed building site would be the Wailing Wall or Saint Catherine's Monastery, would get the same response. I honestly wouldn't shed a tear. That these religions (juadism, christianity) are merely more widespread and accepted than the native religious belief of Hawaiians affords them no more protection against being recognized as completely foolish and worthy of scorn when they attempt to snub the pursuit of knowledge of our world.

      It baffles me beyond words that a (ANY) religious belief system could be so unbelievably willfully ignorant, nearsighted and completely arrogant as to assume their mythical belief system, unsupported by evidence nor reason could even hope to compare to the fantastic wonders of the cosmos which are revealed by actually studying it through the use of telescopes at the top of Mauna Kea. There have been something like 100 planets outside of our solar system which have been discovered using the telescopes on that mountain. Ponder that for a moment. That's sacred.

      --
      - "Hear that?! The percolations are imminent! Cease your ingress!"
    7. Re:hubble? by forkazoo · · Score: 1
      It baffles me beyond words that a (ANY) religious belief system could be so unbelievably willfully ignorant, nearsighted and completely arrogant as to assume their mythical belief system, unsupported by evidence nor reason could even hope to compare to the fantastic wonders of the cosmos which are revealed by actually studying it through the use of telescopes at the top of Mauna Kea. There have been something like 100 planets outside of our solar system which have been discovered using the telescopes on that mountain. Ponder that for a moment. That's sacred.

      Well, I'm not a religeous person myself, but I can understand how people get into it. Personally, I think that the telescope issue is primarily ones of salesmanship...

      Hey, local tribal leaders. The spirits created the land and the sea and the sky. They made the sacred mountain. They also made the mountain the best place to look at the heavens, and see the works of the spirits. Clearly, in order to better honor them, we should do what we can to see what they have made. Honoring them requires the construction of four small auxilliary telescopes, which would be built according to the appropriate ceremonies.

      Instead, the scientists probably started the conversation with a very dismissive attitude, pissing off the other people involved.
  2. Show offs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    We mere amateurs usually pick the moon, Jupiter or maybe M31 ... but NGC891?? That's just pompous!

    1. Re:Show offs by vettemph · · Score: 2, Funny


        [insert uranus joke here.]

      for example "Hey Britney, I would bend over backwards to photograph uranus"

      --
      The government which is strong enough to protect you from everything is strong enough to take everything from you.
    2. Re:Show offs by barakn · · Score: 1

      Perhaps they're trying to avoid frying the CCDs. It looks like the brighter stars are suffering from pixel bleed.

      --
      "I'm so moist I'm sticking to the leather." -Kermit the Frog on The Late Late Show
  3. 24 million years ago? by fodi · · Score: 3, Funny

    Okay, someone help me out here. The article says that NGC891 is 24 million light years away. From my understanding we're, therefore, looking at a picture of the light that left NGC891 24 million years ago. right? wrong?

    If so, why spend all that money to find out what something looked at 24 million years ago (unless you're trying to identify the brown liquid lying at the bottom of my fridge)?

    1. Re:24 million years ago? by QuantumG · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Cause we still don't understand how the universe was formed. Astronomy is the pure research that drives the study of physics. We have no hope of developing a unified theory without further astronomical research. Want nuclear fusion? Want new sensors, or new materials? It all comes back to physics. Our fundamental understanding of the rules of the universe is what defines our capabilities. Similarly for particle accelerators and other pure research.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    2. Re:24 million years ago? by Makoss · · Score: 2, Funny

      Good point, why don't you just hop on over there and give us an update on the current situation? Don't forget to pack an extra sandwich for when you get hungry . . .

      --
      Building a better backup.
      Zettabyte Storage
    3. Re:24 million years ago? by agentcdog · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Aside from the fact that history tells us how we got here, we assume that the laws of the universe are not dependent on WHEN something occurs. So some physical event which took place hundreds of millions of years ago is no less important than what is happening now. Either way, we can only watch and learn.

      --
      If I understand Dirac correctly, his meaning is this: there is no God, and Dirac is his Prophet. -Pauli
    4. Re:24 million years ago? by Vellmont · · Score: 1


      If so, why spend all that money to find out what something looked at 24 million years ago (unless you're trying to identify the brown liquid lying at the bottom of my fridge)?

      I guess I don't understand why it'd be better if we were looking at a more recent picture of that galaxy. In the age of the Universe 24 million years isn't very long. Even when astronomers do look at very old (or young in terms of the age of the universe) galaxies it's still very interesting.

      --
      AccountKiller
    5. Re:24 million years ago? by jsveiga · · Score: 3, Interesting

      > looking at a picture of the light that left NGC891 24 million years ago. right? wrong?

      Wrong, due to the accelerating expansion of the universe. If the light of something out there 24 million light-years away hits us now, it doesn't mean that this light left the origin 24 million years before.

      It would be true if the universe was static.

      There was a VERY interesting article on Scientific American about common misconceptions about the big bang some months ago
      (stripped-down web version http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=0009F0C A-C523-1213-852383414B7F0147&pageNumber=5&catID=2)
        explaining things like that.

  4. This is the version 0.9b by TheGuano · · Score: -1, Troll

    When completed it will also measure gamma rays (or GAYS), and the full power of the LGBT telescope will be unleashed.

  5. Defn: by lurch84 · · Score: 3, Informative

    For those not in the know, "First Light" is when a telescope is first used to capture an image after construction.

    1. Re:Defn: by deglr6328 · · Score: 1

      Goodness, thank heavens you cracked that mind boggling enigma for us.

      --
      - "Hear that?! The percolations are imminent! Cease your ingress!"
    2. Re:Defn: by Cronky · · Score: 1

      Call me what you like ;o) but I actually thought they had picked up the first visible light after the big bang on this telescope. So the definition put me straight!

  6. First Light by dolphin558 · · Score: 1

    That's no galaxy. Oh wait...

  7. Only one mirror? by Gogo+Dodo · · Score: 1

    Is what's clear to me and the pictures seem to indicate that only one mirror is currently installed?

    1. Re:Only one mirror? by dierdorf · · Score: 4, Informative
      > Is what's clear to me and the pictures seem to indicate that only one mirror is currently installed?

      Yes. The second mirror is still being polished and will be installed sometime next year.

      By the way, EACH mirror of the LBT is the largest single mirror in the world at 8.4 meter diameter. The Subaru telescope on Moana Kea is 8.2. There are larger telescope mirrors (Keck I and II, HET, and SALT), but they are segmented. Now that Arizona knows how to cast 8.4m mirrors, they are making the first of SEVEN of them for the next-generation Giant Magellen Telescope.

      --
      -- John Dierdorf, Austin TX
    2. Re:Only one mirror? by bryandjones · · Score: 1

      The second mirror cell and mirror were just installed about two weeks ago. You can see the second mirror if you look at the live webcams on www.lbto.org. However the second mirror is obviously not operational yet. It's scheduled to be aluminized in about six months.

  8. PLEASE by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    > "published it's first image of NGC891."

    In this context, it should be "its first image". No apostrophe.

  9. WTF - Flash website, and no 64-bit plugin! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Offtopic

    It totally sucks that such a terrific astronomical project with a such a very high public profile should employ a proprietary system like Flash for its website, thus denying some people access.

    Macromedia still hasn't delivered a 64-bit version of its Firefox/Mozilla plugin, and there's bugger-all we can do about it.

    LBT website developers, you suck in your choice of technology, and are letting down the terrific telescope team. There was no need for Flash at all.

    1. Re:WTF - Flash website, and no 64-bit plugin! by JimBowen · · Score: 1

      Agh, and no HTML alternative either.
      Surely they must have considered that search engines also do not support flash? :@

      *flames website designer*

  10. wow by Quadraginta · · Score: 1

    That is very impressive. I doubt you could do better on the Moon.

  11. squirrels by pease1 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Are the damn squirrels dead yet?

  12. Perhaps by metamatic · · Score: 1

    Perhaps they're just big Edgar Froese / Tangerine Dream fans.

    "NGC891" was a track on his album Aqua .

    --
    GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
  13. First Light? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "First Light" ???

    Do we really have to sound like a bunch of fags about it?

  14. Hawaiians by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Regarding Keck and the outrigger scopes: you've got to realize that Mauna Kea is (legally) owned by the native Hawaiians, they are just letting other institutions / state & federal government make use of parts of it. All discussion of sacredness aside, it is in their interest to make sure that development is controlled well. If you owned it, wouldn't you do the same? That said, what they have allowed so far, you must admit (especially if you have been there) is pretty significant.