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Why Microsoft and Google are Cleaning Up With AJAX
OSS_ilation writes "Google uses it, and Microsoft is pursuing it, so there's a lot of hype and hubbub surrounding AJAX (Asynchronous JavaScript and XML). AJAX brings together some hot properties, JavaScript, HTML/DHTML and HTML, according to Julie Hanna Farris, founder of Scalix, a Linux-based, e-mail systems vendor. Scalix is using AJAX in Scalix Web Access (SWA), a Web-delivered, e-mail application. AJAX enables advanced features like drag 'n drop, dropdown menus and faster performance capabilities, which are now making their way into Web applications, she said. These kinds of capabilities represent a significant leap in the advancement of Web apps."
So we should ditch Javascript, but keep Asynchronous Javascript And XML? Isn't that like dumping gas-powered engines but keeping gas-powered cars?
I'm not sure if your comment was intended as a pointed jab at the buzzword status of AJAX or a serious suggestion that JavaScript is crappy, but I'm assuming the second.
There are some things about JavaScript that are really annoying. First, the object orientation seems very odd. It is well-rooted in the language, but it is quite annoying not to have real object namespaces (yes, you can use closures, but they're annoying and kludgy), real constructors, and that sort of stuff. It's almost as bad as Perl's hash + namespace = object idea, and worse in some ways.
What I'd like, I guess, is a language that is very similar to JavaScript, but has a real object-oriented system and better support for things like loading code dynamically. It's clear that JavaScript or some future variant of it is finally being used the right way--to make pages dynamic instead of just annoying--but right now it's very cumbersome. Loading Gmail, for example, is quite slow, because it (IIRC) downloads a huge chunk of code at the beginning. Perhaps someone (maybe me) could write a wrapper system in JavaScript that uses XmlHttpRequest to load JavaScript code on demand. But some sort of modular functionality ought to be officially added to JavaScript, before it's too late and we end up with the next "___ Wars"... this time it will be the fight between JavaScript frameworks.
ttuttle is a rankmaniac
It certainly matters. However, it doesn't matter quite as much as the hype suggests. AJAX is a very valuable technology, but the only reason why it's catching on now is that we've finally rid the web of early browsers like Netscape 4. Now that everyone has full JavaScript and DOM, we can finally build complex interfaces. XMLHttpRequest is just icing on the cake. (Hidden IFrames did the job just fine in the past, and are still more useful for some interfaces.)
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
Browsers could spend alot less effort kludging together DHTML and javascript and ride for free off of the JVM. I understand the JVM is a separate download, but browsers can include it as part of their install. I don't see why were a celebrating the creation of such a kludge with random inconsistencies across browsers and platforms that are far worse then what you find when targeting the JVM.
Well, the truth is AJAX is not in Microsoft's best interest. The internet in general is bad for Microsoft. They were way into interactive TV and stuff. They really would prefer that they be the gateway to the web and that you pay $$$ to them to be able to get the content as well as selling their OS. AJAX makes windows less relevant because you can run apps on firefox on any platform. So, I can understand why they wouldn't use much of it. However, as always denying a good technology is a mistake. You can see this as a form of protectionism that backfired on them.
No Sigs!
I keep seeing comments to the effect of "Java could do this!", and I'm going to pick on yours :)
See, Java *could* do this. Sure. I'll give you that. In fact, most people until recently HAD a JVM in their browser. Java applets should have taken over the world.
Why didn't they? Why is AJAX getting all the press Java should have gotten?
Me, I simply look at 2 things: gmail, and Google Maps. They both work, work well, and work better than anything else. Apparently millions of people agree with me, just look at the buzz around them. Are we all brainwashed by Google? Could these have been done as a Java applet? Maybe.
The fact is, they WEREN'T. Or if they were, no one used them. The way I see it, AJAX is the end all and be all (for now) because it WORKS. Maybe Java is just too slow (and here come a dozen posts claiming it's not). Maybe the wait time to load a JVM into memory, plus download an applet is too long. I don't know why Java hasn't been used, but it's not like no one's thought of it before.
I get the hype, myself. It means that I can sit at virtually any computer, type a URL, and BAM! Instant application. I've yet to see another technology that works this well.
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
I agree that both models are necessary. You wouldn't want to lay out text with a box model, but you wouldn't typically want to lay out a form or list with a freeform layout, either. The element was a decent compromise, for a while, but its limitations are many, and it confuses programs that expect tables be used for data rather than layout. CSS is the recommended replacement, but omits the most useful part of the element, arranging rows and columns of arbitrary elements, while failing to add the metainformation that would allow screen-readers and the like to quickly find the content of the page.
You say that we're "trying to force documents to be applications", and I agree. However, with HTML we're also trying to force applications to become documents. We need access to both layout models, because the Web contains both documents and applications. XUL provides this. For example, the XUL menus in the FireFox "chrome" are freeform, and the main part of the box layout is a container for freeform HTML, while the rest of the chrome follows a box model.
Even "document" pages usually contain some "application" elements; navigation buttons, or a search box, for example. The page should be treated as an application containing content, and not forced to hold both the framework and the content in one file, with the same layout model.
"The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat