Intel and Tivo Partner Up

yapplejax writes "Intel and Tivo are partnering on a PC platform in hopes to standardize the platform. From the Associated Press: 'The goal of the Viiv label, he said, is to avoid consumer confusion and questions over interoperability. It also will ensure the products will work when the PC is being controlled from a distance via a remote control.'"

Comments

What about Apple?

[CyricZ]

What about the rumours that Intel-based Mac Minis, possibly available as early as January, will offer similar capabilities?

Re:What about Apple?

[doughrama]

Are you possibly suggesting a Tivo/Intel/Apple partnership? Or just that Intel may be hedging their bets by working with both Apple and Tivo... Or something altogether different.

I think a Tivo/Intel/Apple partnership plausible, though unlikely. Apple doesn't gain much by partnering with Tivo, in fact I think Apple loses by partnering with Tivo.

Intel of course wins either way, both companies still need chips etc...

Tivo is obviously in trouble, might they be trying to pretty themselves up for a buyout from Apple? Several years ago, just as the iPod/iTunes was taking off, I told a friend of mine that Apple's next move would be to buy Tivo... That it made sense. He agreed with me, and that was about the end of it. So far, I've obviously been wrong but I still think it could possibly be a good idea and possibly still happen.

Tivo has the strongest brand in the DVR market right now, I don't think there is any question about that. Their boxes for the most part do exactly what they are supposed to and they do it well. Problem is anybody can create a similar, comparable device. In this respect Tivo is Apple or Beta even. A superior product getting beaten down by a better marketed/positioned/priced inferior product. So Tivo's core business is clearly threatened by rip-off competitors. They have to move into a different market or die. Yes, as much as I like Tivo, they will die without doing something major.

Apple could acquire Tivo, and I think it might not be that bad of a deal. Though again I'm not sure what Apple would gain. Tivo would certainly gain respect and clout in eyes of media distributors/producers. Like iTunes has because of A. it's a great product (even if "you" don't care for it) and B. Steven Jobs/Pixar. For Apple, they'd gain instant living room credibility... Though from the looks of things (iStuff, you will buy it and you will like it) Apple doesn't need that credibility. Maybe I'm taking a look at it from the wrong angle. Apple doesn't need Tivo, but Apple might need to keep Tivo away from a competitor.

Regardless, fun times ahead.

The future as I'd want it (early adopter)

[dada21]

Tivo is in a world of hurt, from what I can tell. As one of the first Tivo users, my Tivo units just sit in the closet for the past few years.

Everything I see is pointing to the fact that people want on demand video more and more. The Pirate Bay's top downloads are consistently TV shows! Maybe it is because these shows are not available in Europe? Either way, people want TV when they want it, and they're willing to wait for a download of a show with no commercials and no price.

The profitability for a video provider is taking that 12-72 hour free download and turn it into a fast (real time?) download for the consumer when they want it. I'm not sure how we'll see this happen in the far future, but in the near future, it could just be On Demand from Comcast (which is actually pretty amazing) or Microsoft IPTV style downloads.

Tivo is wise to try to connect with Intel on selling their name as the "Video as you want it when you want it" brand. As an early adopter in almost everything, I can tell you my biggest complaints about Tv shows and movies are the following:

1. If I download a show, it is always in a codec that I can't view easily. AVC doesn't run well on any of my platforms (I mostly have 1.8Ghz P4s). XViD seems better, but I get odd pixelization on occasion. Intel has the power to combine with Tivo and offer a codec that is specific to their hardware platform, whereas illegal torrents aren't really targetted at anyone. I would gladly pay for that consistency. So would most adults.

2. I want it quick. Yesterday I had to redownload Quicktime and I was watching the download at aroun 850K/s. That's damn fast (I'm testing a new broadband provider right now). My neighbor's comcast cable was getting consistent 400K/s downloads. BitTorrent and other P2P systems halt at about 50K for me (with and without NAT). If I want to download a file, I want it near real time or faster.

3. I want to be able to pause, fast forward and rewind. I'm sick of getting movies that I have to re-encode beause someone screwed up and prevented me from skipping data.

4. I want it to look good at 720p and 1080i. There is nothing worse that trying to watch cable at 110" and seeing crap. I can watch DVDs from 6 years ago upcoverted to 1080i and they look great. There is no reason for bad quality images, even at reduced resolutions.

5. I want to be able to store it for the future or be able to redownload it at a cheaper price.

6. Rather that reconverting my shows for various watching formats (PDA, SDTV, HDTV or whatever) I should just have the option of redownloading it. I am currently converting an AVC to WMV for my PDA and it seriously says it will take 90 hours. Ouch.

7. I should be able to select my price to pay versus what I am willing to give up. In some situations I wouldn't mind paying less and be forced to watch ads. In other cases, I don't mind reporting what I fast forwarded past and rewound to review. It depends on what it is. I'd love to be able to say "I'll pay full price if I can keep it forever, never watch an ad, pause it as I'd like and rewind all I want" and also say "I'll pay zero but I will accept not being able to skip ads."

My fear is that Intel's VIIV and Microsoft's MCE are both looking to try to capitulate to a dying industry. I use Microsoft's MCE and absolutely love it but I won't upgrade to the latest patches that involve DRM. I am not against DRM, but I am against DRM that doesn't offer something to the end user.

Once a consumer tastes the sweetness of a new feature (even if illegal), there is NO way to back out of it. Instead, the market has been permanently changed and the suppliers need to modify their product to offer what the consumer is looking for.

Re:The future as I'd want it (early adopter)

[b0r1s]

Everything I see is pointing to the fact that people want on demand video more and more

This move is just yet another step in the line towards TV-over-IP. The big providers are already lining up, and the startups are hoping onboard. Guys like ManiaTV are going for the traditional route (centalized programming), while Vobbo and others are starting to look towards the amateur video broadcasting (public access TV for the internet - even easier, when you don't need a studio, just a webcam).

The big players will roll out their offerings in the next year or so, I believe. You'll start seeing 'interactive tv' first, until the ball starts rolling...

Re:The future as I'd want it (early adopter)

[dada21]

I agree, and I think it will be a very bright and intersting future for smaller producers as well. I'm thinking of doing a video-style podcast shortly, in fact.

For me, the big "scare" for any mass market video or audio producer is the idea of massively available wireless broadband. For an anarchocapitalist such as myself, it is the opposite: not a scare in the least. The availability of information when we want it without being tied to our home or our business will really increase the destruction of the highly regulated and mercantilistic market that we cann the mass media.

Re:The future as I'd want it (early adopter)

[garcia]

Tivo is in a world of hurt, from what I can tell. As one of the first Tivo users, my Tivo units just sit in the closet for the past few years.

I could see in the past year or so but not before that. My DirecTivo works just fine (and is inexpensive) as I (would normally) pay for it as part of my service. I think it's $5/mo? Their recent mistakes have caused me to leave the standalone Tivo boxes and not recommend them to my parents but that doesn't mean they should sit in the closet if you already have one.

1. If I download a show, it is always in a codec that I can't view easily. AVC doesn't run well on any of my platforms (I mostly have 1.8Ghz P4s). XViD seems better, but I get odd pixelization on occasion. Intel has the power to combine with Tivo and offer a codec that is specific to their hardware platform, whereas illegal torrents aren't really targetted at anyone. I would gladly pay for that consistency. So would most adults.

I wouldn't pay for TV downloads any more than I already do w/my ISP/phone service. I have *never* had a codec issue with Windows after picking up one of those codec packs that includes just about everything you need.

I don't currently download TV episodes as I have DirecTivo but when I did I didn't give a shit what quality it was as long as it was commercial free and not fuzzy like my rabbit ears were.

2. I want it quick. Yesterday I had to redownload Quicktime and I was watching the download at aroun 850K/s. That's damn fast (I'm testing a new broadband provider right now). My neighbor's comcast cable was getting consistent 400K/s downloads. BitTorrent and other P2P systems halt at about 50K for me (with and without NAT). If I want to download a file, I want it near real time or faster.

Then you are misconfigured at your router or you have some other problem. I routinely have torrents hitting my bandwidth limits. Especially ones with a lot of people on them (recent concert releases, etc).

3. I want to be able to pause, fast forward and rewind. I'm sick of getting movies that I have to re-encode beause someone screwed up and prevented me from skipping data.

I don't have this problem, ever on pirated stuff. Only DVDs that won't let me skip the commercials leading up to the movie.

If you think that the TV content providers are going to not include commercials, you've got another thing coming. Once one does it they all will. Paying for it twice!

5. I want to be able to store it for the future or be able to redownload it at a cheaper price.

Storing is an option that I would *demand*. Re-downloading is not something I'd expect or even ask for. You downloaded it, you should be able to view it (regardless of what PC/media device you moved it to) forever w/o keys, etc. That won't ever happen though.

"Viiv" rhymes with "five".

[CyricZ]

For those wondering how to pronounce "Viiv", the article states that it rhymes with "five".

I can see that name causing much confusion. Imagine a granny at an electronics boutique asking how much one of these "Veevee" systems costs. The salespeople may very well not understand what she's asking about.

This produces and interesting situation

[BattleRat]

given the fact the everyone's favorite monopoly, Microsoft, has just recently partnered with CableLabs to produce a CableCard capture device for watching and capturing HDTV on a Windows based PC. The question remains on how this will impact the Tivo/Intel deal, given that Tivo is Linux based. Will the next generation (or future generations) need a set-top-box in addition to the Intel/Tivo (InTivo?) just to get HD content? If there is a standard for PC/DVRs, what would prevent MS from slapping on Windows MCE 200x on it? Is MS the only way in the future for HD? Things will get interesting... http://www.audioholics.com/news/pressreleases/Micr osoftCableCARDXbox360.php

fine, now where is my hd tivo?

[asv108]

I've been waiting for standalone hdtv tivo since I purchased my series2 three years ago. How can a technology company not release a major product revision in nearly three years? Instead of releasing new products, Tivo seems to be worrying a lot more about partnering, catering to content companies(DRM), fiddling with the pricing model, and minor software updates rather than producing any real innovations.

What does this do fot Tivo anyway?

[jdehnert]

This could be OK for Tivo.

Like one of the previous posters I am an early Tivo adopter too, but unlike him, I have 2 units (series 1 and 2) that i use every day.

I still like Tivo better that the alternatives, but I have to admit that the alternatives are getting better all the time and Tivo is making it easier for them to catch up and doing themselves no favors in the process.

I'm not sure what the partnership with Intel is going to buy them though. Are they switching to intel CPU's?

I have Tivo2Go on both my Mac's and PC's and it works fine in both cases, so what does Viiv get me as a consumer?

Personally, I'm looking forward to an Apple PVR, especially if that integrate an iTunes server into the package (and perhaps an iPhoto server as well).

Besides, DRM is probably going to cripple all of this anyway, and like most people, if I have to jump through to many hoops to watch things the way I wana watch them, I'm just not going to do it.

Contrary to what the MPAA, RIAA, and TV execs believe, I am not going to change my habits to mesh with their wishes. If I can't have it my way, I'll just do something else all-together.

Add this to the FCC Cable a-la-carte news.

Perhaps I can cut my cable bill in half soon when I dump this stupid ass package I HAD to get just to get Speed TV to watch the F-1 races. Gimme basic cable at 1/2 what I'm paying now and Speed for an additional $2/month.

Oil and Water

[overshoot]

Oh, this just gets better all the time.

Aside from the fact that the South Fork team is still revising their project architecture, at least so far it's all been so completely Microsoft-based that the team was shocked to find out that Apple wasn't MS-based.

Now they're trying to sweep TiVO (Linux) and Apple (BSD) into the Borg Collective at the same time that it's supposed to go gold next month.

I can understand why long-time Intel employees call it "East Fucked."

Wrong and right

[esconsult1]

As long as you have broadcast TV, Cable and Satellite, (all tv on the producer's schedule), then you'll need a box like Tivo to timeshift and commercial skip. Sure, Tivo is getting ready for the future, and they're in a good place (so long as they prepare a new box with high speed connections and streaming capability). But to say that Tivo's dead is just a little shortsighted.

Consumers are in two camps. Passive and Active. We're active consumers of media so its no big deal for us, but Joe six loves what Tivo and his sisters do for him. Enough six packs (about 90%) don't have PVR's and just passively consume media. This is where content producers shift eyeballs to advertisers. And the way how they get paid to produce content too. There too much politics, jobs, infrastructure and inertia piled up for an overnight shift.

Right now there ain't enough of us actives out there to pay enough for production of our favourite content by subscriptions. Believe me, I want everything that the first poster said too, but at least I am realistic in the short term.

Fight You to Keep My TiVO

[queenb**ch]

1. Frankly, I love my TiVO. I can watch MORE TV with it since I can skip the commercials. If you know the right things to push on the remote, you don't have to watch the ads. A "60" minute show becomes something more like 40 real minutes of programming. That means that in the same 2 hour time period, I can watch 3 shows instead of two.

2. Codecs really aren't a problem for my TiVO. If there's a show or movie coming on, I can TiVO and watch it at my leisure any time later. I even have the option to burn it to DVD, complete with the ever-so-user friendly TiVO interface.

3. While I am dependent on what is offered, I have sattelite and have such a wide selection of channels, I don't really feel the need for "on demand" anything.

4. Your problems with resolution, pause/fast forward, and speed aren't one of my issues. My TiVo encodes everything perfectly and it manages to do most of its work either while I'm at work or asleep.

5. My ISP recently upgraded our service. We now have a 7MB/sec connection complete with fiber coming into our home. Our price for this - $36/month. We have plenty of bandwidth to download anything we want. Again, with 500+ channels to choose from and a TiVO to catch whatever I want whenever it's shown, I don't really feel the need for it.

6. I would like to be able to take the things I TiVO and load them on to my laptop. TiVO says that the hold up on this is not them, not technology, but the MPAA. Given that, I doubt you'll be seeing this any time soon from anyone. It would certainly make for a more intersting commute to and from work.

7. I agree that you should be able to balance price vs. features to what ever you are comfortable with, can afford, etc.

If this joint venture with Intel can make the thing I've come to adore better, than I'm all for it. If they're looking to add a bunch more DRM crap to my TiVO, I'm going to be fighting mad.

2 cents,

Queen B

another reason for me to go the MythTV route

[fak3r]

I don't want to get locked into anything, even if they're talking about 'interlopability'. Every self respecting geek should run a MythTV box first, and then go the Tivo route *if* it does more than you need via MythTV. I would prefer to see a home grown solution as an option always. (sorry, I can't validate paying fees for what purports to be an online tv guide while they determing how often I can view the content after I record it).

Slashdot predictions

[Goaway]

Now you can evaluate Slashdot's predictive ability:

New Intel Trademark Filed - An article trying to guess what this trademark was referring to.