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Fakes, Coming to a Store Near You

Posted by ScuttleMonkey on from the i'm-not-faking-it dept.

fishdan writes to tell us that while most Slashdotters have their own trusted sources for gear there is a growing concern that all consumers should look out for. According to PC World, more and more counterfeit hardware is coming to market each year. From the article: '...batteries aren't the only tech item that counterfeiters love. In October 2004, U.S. Customs and Border Protection officials in Anchorage, Alaska, seized 20,000 suspected fake Memorex USB memory key thumb drives from Asia. And last year, Miami officials seized 900 allegedly phony laptops valued at $700,000. "Maybe it's a laptop, an MP3 player, or a component like a DVD drive--anything in the digital world can be counterfeited," says Therese Randazzo, a U.S. Customs Service counterfeiting expert.'"

29 of 286 comments (clear)

  1. I don't get it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    What is wrong with counterfeit electronics? Do they have different functionality, are they shabbily built, or do they just take profits away from the rightful owners of the product?

    1. Re:I don't get it by Big+Nothing · · Score: 5, Informative

      "What is wrong with counterfeit electronics? Do they have different functionality, are they shabbily built, or do they just take profits away from the rightful owners of the product?"

      From TFA:
      Bogus cell phone batteries, shoddily made and potentially unsafe, are a specialty of counterfeiters. "It's one thing to buy a fake $30 Louis Vuitton bag on Canal Street in New York City. It's an entirely different matter when you buy a fake cell phone battery and it blows up"

      So yes, lack of quality IS a problem - it's not just IP whine.

      --
      SIG: TAKE OFF EVERY 'CAPTAIN'!!
    2. Re:I don't get it by damsa · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Counterfeits are not made to the same standard as originals, if they were made to the same standards then the counterfeiters wouldn't be trying to pass off their goods as fakes, they would be making claims that their products were better.

      When you buy a product from a manufacturer, you as a buyer are protected by warranty laws, a counterfeiter can get away with selling stuff even if the quality is the same as the original for a lower price because they don't have to support you.

      Counterfeiters do take away profits from the rightful owners of the product. Companies spend millions of dollars to develop a product and to appeal to a certain market. If counterfeiters were allowed to counterfeit, then companies would not develop products.

      Also, how would like to buy an Intel computer but only to find that the insides are actually made by a Chinese knockoff company.

    3. Re:I don't get it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It goes really far down the chain. Nowdays you can't buy certain power transistors from just anywhere. Prized japense power transistors like even 2sc5200/2sa1943 are being counterfeited. the counterfeit devices have a much smaller die and no heatspreader. they are just glued to the package.

      This obviously has issues with the entire manufacturing process. anything that needed these parts now must be tested.

      counterfeit stuff is almost certainly poor quality, possibly bordering on dangerous. it makes the most sense as you get maximum profits that way.

      Further there is no accountability. A defective and dangerous product could harm people, thusly bringing lawsuits. These lawsuits would target, in this case, innocent corporations instead of outright dishonest ones. the lack of a need to care about the consumer at all makes counterfeitting electronics dangerous.

    4. Re:I don't get it by baryon351 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Others have brought up good comments - that sometimes the counterfeits can be dangerous, not work the same as the real thing, not comply with local laws, be interference-prone electronics etc.

      Another problem is when a device made in the same factory as the real deal (let's say a Toshiba laptop) is sold in the US as a real toshiba. To many people hey, it's a real toshiba, and it's half the price!

      But part of the price of the REAL toshiba is the Quality Control that occurs along the line. Perhaps only 85% of all laptops made in that factory actually end up being accepted by toshiba as inventory, and the rest is set to be dismantled, scrapped or refurbished as something went wrong on the assembly line. So what do you get when you buy the fake toshiba?

      You get one of the *already rejected* "toshibas" that was never meant to be released to the public. Not only was it never given a serial number that matches a toshiba-sold product so all warranty is out the window, it's already been rejected and defined as having problems. Made in the same factory, yes, but not the same quality as the final for-sale object.

      Maybe you'll get lucky and get a solid machine that only has some case defects. Maybe you'll get a lemon that doesn't stay powered on for more than 15 minutes, has no warranty, and you still paid $400 for.

    5. Re:I don't get it by The+Clockwork+Troll · · Score: 5, Funny

      Is that the secret of NiMH?

      --

      There are no karma whores, only moderation johns
    6. Re:I don't get it by terminal.dk · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I agree. It is a problem. When the handle on the Louis Vuitton bag breaks, you can lose way more than a cell phone. Maybe your digital camera, video camera, and $2000 laptop all dies.

      There is a reason to buy quality, and to be aware that a brand name does not necessarily mean quality.

      In Denmark we had a case. A supermarket was selling "counterfeit" Puma shoes. The only difference between the cheap Puma and the full price Puma was, that the manufacturer had lost his Puma contract, but was still producing the same shoes.

      Go for quality rather than brand names.

      The best color you can buy is usually last year's :)

    7. Re:I don't get it by djupedal · · Score: 3, Informative

      Examples...and believe me, I know of where I speak, since I'm living at ground zero for where this stuff originates.

      Sony branded ni-cads - might hold a charge ok for the first few uses...rapidly downhill from there. Who knows what is inside. Use your imagination, but remember to only consider materials that are easy to obtain, with low cost up front.

      Sony branded 1gb USB microdrive - after one week...corrupted data. On and on...blank CDs, DVDs, SD cards....no end. If you get in with the shop vendors, they know what to avoid, and they won't sell you the bad stuff. I've learned how to spot most if it, but the odds are more than 50/50 you'll be buying fake, regardless of the outlet. Fake cosmetics, deodorants, medicines, shoes, clothes, watches...a small percentage are acutally high quality, just made after hours. But for the most part, the fakes are of lower quality than the originals.

      How good are they at doing this? No joke, I've seen fake raw eggs. Shell, egg white and yolk. No protein or edible matter whatsoever. Mostly off the shelf building materials. What kind of profit is there, when there is a market for a fake fresh chicken eggs?

      Why is this so prevalent? Believe it or not, being able to copy an original is considered a test of ability. It is routine for one generation in China to test itself by attempting to duplicate something done by their ancestors. From fabrics to porcelin, it shows respect and skill by being able to reliably copy something that was first done over two thousand years ago.

      Where is this headed? What better craftsmen, to really be the first to clone a human.

    8. Re:I don't get it by darkith · · Score: 4, Interesting

      NiMH batteries are generally pretty safe. They don't really require any onboard electronics, just a peak detecting charger if they're being fast-charged. If shorted, they may get *really* hot or ignite adjacent materials, but they're not as reactive as lithium based technology.

      Li-Ion/Li-Poly cells are the dangerous ones. Basically they can reach a run-away condition very easily, and lithium is *very* reactive. They can ignite if punctured, charged too fast, over-charged, or if they drop below a certain voltage and are then charged at normal rates. They will also swell/burst if over-discharged or over-heated. Most Li-Poly/Li-Ion packs include a circuit with a thermal cutoff to prevent over-heating, a circuit to prevent shorting/excessive-discharge-rates, and a circuit that isolates the pack if it drops below a safe voltage (usually around 2.5-2.8 volts per cell).

      I did purchase a pair of Li-poly batteries for a cell phone, which were no-name imports. They did not have any cutoff circuitry, and I suspect could have been nasty if they wandered out of spec (either through abuse or a defective phone). I used them with no problems though, but I think I'd reconsider, given what I know now about Lithium cells.
      That said, the circuitry required for Lithium cells is becoming cheaper everyday (the functionality is avaiable in a single chip), so I wouldn't be surprised if "decent" third-party units do have the desired safety functionality.

      D.

    9. Re:I don't get it by LarsG · · Score: 4, Informative
      [grandparentquote]
      Sometimes the factories in third-world-factories that produce the "legit" products also produce those "fake" things. Is there something like this in computer electronics manufacture ?
      [/grandparentquote]

      Depends on what your definition of "fake" is. It is well known that manufacturers of, say, memory chips producing under contract/license for known brands sell surplus and not-tested-to-make-sure-the-chips-are-within-spec stock to the grey market. Which is ok, as long as there is no contract/license agreements barring the factory from doing so and the memory chips sold in this manner aren't passed off as "known brand" chips.

      Rebadging does happen, but whether it is done by the factory or by people buying surplus is a different matter.

      Intel gave AMD all necessary Information to produce the Intel 80386 Microprocessor in the early 80's then the 486. As intel could make the CPU fast enough for the Demand and outsource to AMD to manufacture them.

      AMD started selling the exactly identical chip as Intel (they had the blueprints afterall and were by authorised by Intel to produce them. :)

      Suddenly there was Intel 486 Processor versus AMD 486 processor same processor but AMD was undercutting Intel on price.

      Enter Pentium haha AMD you cant copy our name any more since it is Trademarked


      The Intel/AMD story is a bit different. When IBM put together the IBM PC they had to rush to get it out the door to compete with the myriad of personal computers that were showing up on the market. Instead of taking the traditional route of designing everything in-house, they did something that at the time was very unusual for IBM. They went outside IBM to pick the components to build the machine, including the 8088 from Intel.

      IBM was then a powerhouse, and Intel was in comparison small fry. IBM did not want to depend on a single source for the components used in the IBM PC, so in order for Intel to get the contract they had to license the x86 to a second source - AMD.

      AMD was at first a second source producer of Intel designed x86 CPUs (8086, 8088, Am286). Intel considered the licence only valid up to the 80286, so they cancelled the agreement in 1986 and lawsuit(s?) ensued. AMD kinda sorta won, and starting with the Am386 in 1991 they have designed and manufactured their own x86 compatible CPUs.
      --
      If J.K.R wrote Windows: Puteulanus fenestra mortalis!
  2. Wow I'm glad he's an "expert" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "Maybe it's a laptop, an MP3 player, or a component like a DVD drive--anything in the digital world can be counterfeited," says Therese Randazzo, a U.S. Customs Service counterfeiting expert.'"

    Last time I checked there captain obvious anything in the analog world can be counterfeited as well. Basically anything can be counterfeited. If this guy counts as an expert I'd hate to see a n00b.

    1. Re:Wow I'm glad he's an "expert" by WheresMyDingo · · Score: 3, Funny
      Basically anything can be counterfeited. If this guy counts as an expert I'd hate to see a n00b.

      Maybe he's a counterfeit expert?

  3. Act now to stop hardware counterfeiting by Statecraftsman · · Score: 5, Funny
    I've decided to offer my own consumer hardware....ummm....authentication service. If you suspect you are in posession of counterfeit hardware(expecially the xbox 360 or an iPod nano), please send it it to:

    P.O. Box 12345
    Hometown, USA 12345

    Please note that due to cost concerns, your hardware cannot be returned. Thanks and if you include your email address I'll let you know if it's counterfeit.

    (just a joke...please don't actually send me anything cuz that address is extreme bogusness)

    1. Re:Act now to stop hardware counterfeiting by WoodieR · · Score: 3, Funny

      when you make your second million, drop me the first ...

      --
      Question Authority before IT questions You ...
  4. Wait till you see... by bronney · · Score: 4, Interesting

    what we have in stores for you. Earlier we had soy sauce made from hair juice. Yes, factories in China grinding human hair into juice and mix with water.

    Fake down blankets stuffed with shit polyesters.

    Now hear this, fake EGGS. Yes you heard right. What mogglers my bind was how on earth could you make eggs cheaper than collecting from chickens. The fake eggs were obviously inedible, but will crack and pour just like a real egg, with yolks and stuff.

    The famous fake gucci's and LV's are old news.

    Latest that came in from a buddy who works in shenzhen was that he rode in a fake mercedes benz. They copied all contours and instead of the tri-star, it's a 5 pointed-star (China)! Cool eh.

  5. Yeah except it costs the same by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 3, Insightful
    If I get a item that is 50% less for 50% of the cost I basically get the same deal. However if I buy a nokia battery that normally sells for 100 and instead accidently buy a fake for 80 and it then explodes I might feel that it is not such a good deal.

    Yeah "fakes" can work. In a way the PC your sitting behind right now is a "fake". Unless your a rich bastard sitting behind a IBM or Apple machine.

    This article is however not about those kind of fakes. It is where the buyer presumes he is buying the real deal often for the real price. That is not good.

    Same with software, you can hold a lengthy argument about software piracy but when I pay full price for a software package I would expect to get a real offical copy.

    By all means, make cheap memory or hd or mp3 players but don't try to pass it of as a superior product and charge the same money.

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

  6. REAL goods, FAKE labels by NigelJohnstone · · Score: 5, Interesting

    "In October 2004, U.S. Customs and Border Protection officials in Anchorage, Alaska, seized 20,000 suspected fake Memorex USB memory key thumb drives from Asia."

    Do Memorex even make USB drives, or do they simply buy them in from Asian and stick their badge on them?

    "Miami officials seized 900 allegedly phony laptops valued at $700,000. "Maybe it's a laptop, an MP3 player, or a component like a DVD drive--anything in the digital world can be counterfeited," says Therese Randazzo, a U.S. Customs Service counterfeiting expert.'"

    I bet they were *real* laptops and *real* mp3 players, the only difference was the label. What you're saying is they can fake *labels*. But that's just because the USA has become a fake brand country, companies license a brand like Polaroid or Caterpillar, buy in cheap Asian crap, stick a "Polaroid" badge on it and charge loads more money because people think they're buying American.

    Who cares if those fake brands get pirated, since its the difference between an overprice Asian product and a cheap Asian product, it's still jobs in Asia.

    They should tackle false origin of goods labelling instead, since that's the cause of jobs being lost in USA and Europe. How can an Italian shoe maker compete with companies which appear to be Italian luxury show makers, but are just fake Asian brands with some minor finishing in Italy?

    1. Re:REAL goods, FAKE labels by tpgp · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I bet they were *real* laptops and *real* mp3 players, the only difference was the label. What you're saying is they can fake *labels*. But that's just because the USA has become a fake brand country, companies license a brand like Polaroid or Caterpillar, buy in cheap Asian crap, stick a "Polaroid" badge on it and charge loads more money because people think they're buying American.

      I generally agree with your sentiment about Western Consumers getting sucked into overpaying for cheap crap because of a label (CK clothes instantly spring to mind).

      However - I do actually think trademark is one area of 'intellectual property' that helps consumers.

      If I buy a laptop that has "AMD Sempron 3000+" written on it, I would like to *know* that that's what it is - not an 900MHz Intel Celeron. Similarly, I want the video memory to be whats advertised, etc etc etc.

      Who cares if those fake brands get pirated, since its the difference between an overprice Asian product and a cheap Asian product, it's still jobs in Asia.

      Sometimes you do not get a rebranded equivilant, but something that is completely inferior to what you expected.

      I would be extemely pissed off if I bought one of the Fake AMD CPUs that were going around a while ago, to find it overclocked, ran hotter, and had a shorter lifespan that it should.

      --
      My pics.
  7. Windows by Freaky+Spook · · Score: 5, Funny

    I think my copy of windows may be counterfeit. Its really slow and every time I open internet explorer I keep getting directed to hardcore porn sites.

    1. Re:Windows by The+Clockwork+Troll · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Nope, that is the Windows Genuine Advantage.

      --

      There are no karma whores, only moderation johns
  8. Cisco is plagued by counterfeits by puzzled · · Score: 5, Informative


      A Cisco dual channel T1 controller, part VWIC-2MFT-T1 is $2,000 new list price. A small reseller will pay 70% of list or about $1,400 for it in distribution, while a large reseller might only pay $1,100 or so. Below we see a tinyurl link to an Ebay auction for a new boxed unit at only $227 or 11.3% of list price. I guarantee if you contact the seller you can get six dozen of them for the same price.

    http://tinyurl.com/ak9by

      This has gone on and on and on and on for the last two years, destroying the value of used Cisco gear we pull from customers and making it almost impossible to buy a used/refurbished card without running into this stuff.

      I found out about this sort of thing the hard way. I got a *fantastic* deal on six new in the box Cisco 1721 routers. It wasn't so fantastic when I had to explain to my biggest customer that half of the machines they owned couldn't be registered for service because Cisco had them listed as in service in South America. Oh, and they failed, one by one, with mysterious problems not attributeable to hardware or software ... they just acted ... different.

      Foo on all counterfeiters. They should be given counterfeit lifesaving drugs while riding in an ambulance equipped with counterfeit brake pads on their way to a hospital where they'll be cared for by a doctor who is really a drunken paramedic who thought it'd be fun to be a trauma surgeon for a day. If they live through that then they should be placed in a real live jail and periodically offered counterfeit parole papers to sign.

    --
    I am very easy to get along with, but I don't have time to waste being nice to people who are being stupid. -Theo
    1. Re:Cisco is plagued by counterfeits by gregorio · · Score: 3, Insightful
      A Cisco dual channel T1 controller, part VWIC-2MFT-T1 is $2,000 new list price. A small reseller will pay 70% of list or about $1,400 for it in distribution, while a large reseller might only pay $1,100 or so. Below we see a tinyurl link to an Ebay auction for a new boxed unit at only $227 or 11.3% of list price. I guarantee if you contact the seller you can get six dozen of them for the same price.
      Maybe because most Cisco's products are just cheap versions of industry standard hardware designs. This card is mostly a cheap-ass FPGA with a small associated analog circuitry. I bet the counterfeiters don't even need to copy Cisco's firmware (probably licensed from some cheap-ass chinese company), as most T1-related signal processing algorithms can be licensed for free or just real cheap.

      Any chinese company can build this kind of product, as the related technologies (and component prices) can be complex as manufacturing an ADSL modem.

      But that's Cisco TODAY. Back in The Day when the components and technologies necessary to build a T1 signal interface were really expensive, their prices at least made some sense. Today the amount of signal processing necessary for a full-featured ADSL modem is larger than for this kind of communications card.

      Today's Cisco is just a seller of overpriced commodity hardware.
    2. Re:Cisco is plagued by counterfeits by jmichaelg · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Cisco is plagued by counterfits.

      If Cisco outsources the manufacture of the hardware how can it possibly believe that the manufacturer won't run an extra X copies off the line after they've run Cisco's? Sure, your contracts may prohibit that but when the cost vs what Cisco charges the end user is so great, the temptation for someone at the manufacturing line is going to be pretty high. Especially if they figure they'll sell the goods in a market where Cisco isn't.

      There are reasons on-shore companies used to do the manufacturing themselves. This is one of them.

      Outsourcing may be cheaper in the short run but Cisco is beginning to learn what the long-run costs are.

  9. Fake laptops are almost indistinguishable by SecondHand · · Score: 3, Funny

    See for yourself: http://www.home.ecommerce.hct.ac.ae/news/adwcake.j pg

  10. I've got a fake Music CD by Advocadus+Diaboli · · Score: 4, Funny

    said it comes from Sony/BMG and then it was a rootkit installer. :-)

  11. Counterfeit Hardware by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I think counterfeit hardware could be the next stage in trojans and viruses.

    For instance, imagine you buy a wireless router from ebay, which the seller has pre-installed with trojan firmware and comes with a packet sniffer, bulk mailing software pre-installed, ftp server, password grabber etc. The best part is, most people trust their routers implicitly so don't bother checking them from the outside world. Some people then disable their software firewalls once they have a router available.

    Another great idea would be a network printer with a trojan payload.

  12. Elevators too by whoda · · Score: 4, Interesting

    There was a story about counterfiting in an issue of Fast Company last year. In it, there was an example of an elevator company who got called to service an elevator in a high-rise building.

    The elevator company had no record that they had an elevator installed there.
    When the technicians got there, they couldn't fix anything, because the elevator wasn't really theirs. It was a knock-off!

  13. U.S. Critical Vulnerability by cyberscan · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Where are many critical electronic parts for computers, automobiles, military weapontry, and other important devices for America manufactured? The simple answer is the "Peoples Republic" of China. How many of these devices have "trojans" or sabatage circuitry embedded in intergrated circuits themselves? We may never find out (Hopefully). I can picture the day when the world grows tired of accepting worthless paper (dollars or Federal Reserve Notes) as "payment" for tangible goods. I can also picture the day that the "People's Republic" of China decides to annex Tiawan by force. All they have to do is wait for or cause a certain condition to occur, such as a specific date, or a certain code to pass over wires, or even a specific signal to be transitted. The "trojan" circuitry picks up the signal and disables the device. A couple of lines of code or a few transistors can throw a real monky wrentch into the functionality of a device. How could the U.S. stop the invasion of Taiwan when its electronic infrastructure has been disabled? I'm sure that the U.S. government has investigated this option when it permitted American telephone equipment manufacturers to export equipment to Eastern Bloc countries before the fall of the Berlin Wall. Now, the tables are turned, and America depends on foriegn counties and companies for its electronic infrastructure.

  14. What a bunch of FUD by Lord+Byron+II · · Score: 3, Informative

    Yes, counterfeiting is wrong, but this article is jam packed with FUD! They make it sound like only counterfeit products will fail, but we all know that the real thing can be just as bad (XBOX 360s overheating, IBM HDDs crashing, Ipod batteries dying). The worst is when they quote the MSoftie who states that if you buy a counterfeit MS product, your credit card number could be stolen. What's the basis for that?