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NewtonOS Running on Linux PDA

Posted by CmdrTaco on from the platforms-never-die dept.

Seb Payne writes "At the WWNC 2006, Adam Tow has reported that Einstein, the NewtonOS emulator is now working on a Sharp Zaurus Linux PDA, showing future for our favourite green friend. Although it is not production quality, could this bring a future to the Newton platform?"

12 of 125 comments (clear)

  1. In a word... by Seoulstriker · · Score: 3, Insightful

    could this bring a future to the Newton platform?

    No.

    Newton has long been dead.

    --
    I am defenseless. Use your button. Mod me down with all of your hatred.
    1. Re:In a word... by feijai · · Score: 5, Interesting
      The things they mod 5:insightful these days.

      If you don't mind, allow me (a former Newton developer, and current computer science professor) to provide a slightly more informed take on the situation.

      The reason everyone in the Newton community is excited about the emulator is not that it enables us to revive our Newtons, but that it gives us an easy migration mechanism. Newton owners have been frustrated as hell with the god-awful interfaces running on current PDAs. PalmOS is astonishingly profoundly primitive. And PocketPC is just about the worst interface I have ever seen on a platform. Generally it takes about twice to three times as many pen interactions to get a given action performed on the PocketPC as it does on the Newton.

      I've used them all. A lot. And the Newton 2.1 OS is hands down the best PDA interface. And let's not kid ourselves: there still isn't a handwriting recognition system available that's as good as Rosetta. And the Newton UI is built around handwriting as a text entry mechanism along with a keyboard, unlike Palm and WinCE's traditional (and bad) character-entry-only event mechanism. And the Newton is fast. The MessagePad 2000 ran on a 167MHz StrongARM (predecessor to the XScale) in 1997.

      So Newton users are stuck with a great but aging OS trapped inside hardware that is breaking down and falling apart. Most of us have FrankenNewtons at this stage. What the emulator will do is allow us to move our environments to a new PDA and still be able to use our old software, data, and UI, while using the new PDA's OS for new things. That's a big deal.

      Plus, I might add, Einstein makes for a nice development environment.

    2. Re:In a word... by amper · · Score: 3, Informative

      Actually, it wasn't so much the CPU power, but the lack of available memory to store a large enough dictionary for the recognition engine. The early versions had a 10,000 word dictionary. The later versions increased this to 93,000 words. This, coupled with faster processors and a new recognition engine are what enabled the MessagePad 2100 to have a quite usable experience--but it was primarily the larger dictionary that did the trick.

  2. No by NitsujTPU · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Although it is not production quality, could this bring a future to the Newton platform?

    No, I see no reason why emulating an OS under Linux on a PDA would bring that platform a future. I think that the best thing to do would be to incorporate those features that you liked from the Newton into an existing platform, rather than emulating it under Linux on a Zaurus, which seems more like a "fun and geeky thing to do" than a practical solution to anything.

  3. Newton Hardware by nurb432 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The OS was only part of the puzzle.

    Yes, its great that the OS may live again in some useable form, but its not quite the same with out the larger formfactor and apple quality behind it.

    If by some miracle and Jobs got a clue so Apple would bring it back, i know id be in line to buy another one..

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
  4. this might lead somewhere by streetwise · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The goal here is not just being able to run decade-old apps from the Newton. It is extending what was so good about the Newton to new platforms. No pda has yet to come close to the best features of the Newton. Furthermore, palm os has stagnated, and there are lots of gadgets, from cell phones to "internet tablets" appearing that run on linux that are crying out for better user interfaces (especially decent handwriting recognition). Check out http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthrea d.php?p=7287#post7287 over on the Nokia 770 forum as an example of how this might play out.

  5. Other Newton Related Advances by Feneric · · Score: 3, Insightful

    There were lots of new Newton-related technology at the show. It's a pity it's not covered anywhere.

    One little thing I worked on was a Newton book reader extension for Firefox that can read Newton books from within Firefox on Linux, Mac OS X, Solaris, WinXP, etc. It's now in its second public version.

    The reason that people still work with Newtons is simple -- Newtons still do things that nothing else on the market seem capable of doing. There are some really good, solid ideas in that OS.

    1. Re:Other Newton Related Advances by Feneric · · Score: 5, Informative
      Everyone keeps saying that the Newton could do things that no other PDA can. Could we get some examples?

      Well, off the top of my head, picture a single hand-held platform that offers a free development environment with a choice of a few relatively modern (in at least two cases, solidly object-oriented; I'm not familiar enough with the other available languages to comment on them though) programming languages; support for direct wired ethernet; support for Bluetooth; support for 802.11b (and I think these days 802.11g); various techy sorts of apps like Telnet in addition to the more typical hand-held fare like address books, notepads, spreadsheets, and e-mail (and it actually has the best such client I've seen on a hand-held device); a word processor good enough that people have actually used it to write novels; a keyboard option that can actually be used for touch-typing but which is still portable; a decent graphing calculator; a full graphical web browser; a basic AI interface that can turn commands like "call Darren" into a sequence that'll actually dial your brother's telephone number, placing in all the appropriate prefixes / area codes / etc. for your current location; a free-form text-edit system that works (the early versions were rough -- the MP2000 & 2100 were both solid); a fast RISC processor that still gets excellent battery life; a grayscale display with enough resolution to be useful; Unicode support; it goes on. All of the regular add-ons for hand-helds like astronomy software, interactive fiction software, etc. are also available for the Newton.

      That's just a quick list. Sure, you can get lots of these things in other packages, but you can't get them all in one package except on a Newton.

      If you were to ask me on a different day I'd probably come up with a completely different list... and I'm sure other Newton users will come up with additional items that I overlooked at the moment.

      The big thing is the convenience of this combination with a rock-solid multi-tasking OS in a portable form-factor. It's a little hard to explain to someone who's never used such a thing. All the same reasons that people are buying and using tablets today support the Newton, although the Newton tends to be smaller and lighter than most tablets, and never crashes...

    2. Re:Other Newton Related Advances by metamatic · · Score: 3, Informative

      Write text directly on the screen where you want it.

      Draw a diagram under the text. Have the Newton automatically clean up your circles, rectangles and lines into vector graphics.

      Write some more directly under that. Select the text and have your handwriting converted to text.

      One gesture to start a new page.

      In other words, the thing the Newton did which no other PDA has achieved that I've seen, is act enough like a notepad that you can actually use it for taking notes.

      --
      GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
  6. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 3, Funny

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  7. It is not about a "comeback" by _vSyncBomb · · Score: 3, Informative

    I think people who don't actually know much/anything about the Newton are missing the point here.

    Of course the Newton is not "coming back". Its fate was sealed when Apple shut it down but refused to sell the technology.

    But at the Newton conference yesterday one speaker said, "I've been trying to replace my Newton for almost ten years now." The audience agreed. But the design philosophies behind the Newton (continued in Mac OS X) have kept it ahead of unambitious crap like the moribund Palm OS (talk about dead--*that* OS sure won't remain in use for a decade after it gets discontinued). And in these intervening years Newtons have remained in service and the data on these things has even continued to accumulate.

    Is the Newton coming back? No, it is not. But what Einstein means is that it may be able to STAY AROUND for a couple (several?) more years until the industry can come up with something good enough to actually replace it fro the people still using them.

    It's cool to be able to emulate old systems

  8. basic AI interface? by commodoresloat · · Score: 3, Funny
    a basic AI interface that can turn commands like "call Darren" into a sequence that'll actually dial your brother's telephone number

    Must be the crappy handwriting recognition everyone talks about. My brother's name is "Victor."