Slashdot Mirror
All Aboard the Nerd Boat
Forbes is running an article detailing a most unusual cruise. 180 Computer Science profs were brought together on a Royal Carribean ship to talk about bringing computer games to the classroom. Despite the topic, there was a lot of serious discussion. From the article: "After Microsoft's Luehmann praised the technical sophistication of three new Xbox 360 games (Mass Effect, Too Human, and Gears of War), a silver-haired professor raised his hand and commented: 'You just showed us three very sophisticated and very violent games, and I'm sure they're good for something--though I don't really know what that is--but what I want to know is, when will you make a videogame that's really useful? When will you make a videogame that's going to teach my students chemistry?'"
Games are traditionally something that people do in order to relax and have fun. A game that teaches chemistry? It doesn't exactly sound like something I'd want to have a multiplayer deathmatch in...
Don't forget that videogames are a business. The developers make what the market wants (at least, that's the theory).
Baltika
What, this guy's never played Chemistry Hangman? http://www.creative-chemistry.org.uk/funstuff/hang man/hangman.htm I mean Come on!
nothing
That's one helluva idea for a game. :)
McGyver style.
The new engines would finally allow for that level of sophistication.
Create a database of 1000-2000 different chemical reactions, then give objects besides the standard "texture, lightness, weight" properties the property of chemical composition. Give player a lab to prepare stuff. Then let them loose on missions, using at first simple stuff like black powder, later play with transporting a canister of nitroglicerine across Manhattan in public transport, then do more advanced stuff, fill a building with hydrogen-oxygen mix, smuggle dissolved gold in fuel tanks, etc, all the cool stuff you can do with chemistry.
Cool!
Anagram("United States of America") == "Dine out, taste a Mac, fries"
When will you make a videogame that's going to teach my students chemistry?'"
Newsflash: Your students don't want to learn chemistry. They want to beat up the hooker and get their money back, run away from the cops in a flashy sports car, and unload an entire arsenal into the local shopping mall.
That's why Grand Theft Auto 3 is the most successful franchise in history, and Mavis Beacon Teaches Chemistry hasn't even gotten to the drawing board stage yet.
I suppose DrugWars was more about economics than applied chemistry, unfortunately. If there'd been a meth-cooking section to the game, maybe we'd feel differently about it. :)
Anyone remember Rocky's Boots? I played it on the Apple II, and I'm not aware of an updated version. It was essentially a logic game, building machines from sensors, logic gates, and actuators. Think Mindstorms minus the physical Lego. It was a blast for a little kid to play, and taught some valuable concepts much earlier than I might've otherwise encountered them. But I haven't seen anything like it in years.
The question is a good one: Where have all the good educational titles gone? Perhaps now that violent games have proven they own the market, there's less appetite for trying something new and educational. Anyone?
Civilization taught me history and geography, Sim City taught me business and government, the Total War series taught me military tactics, the Sims taught me about relationships, Pro Pinball taught me, uh, how to play Pinball, Chessmaster taught me how to play chess and Doom taught me the proper use for a chainsaw.
Computer games taught me everything I know...
Why would Microsoft go on a cruise that is specifically designed to identify games as an education source, only to highlight and force-advertise their 360 lineup? It would be no less transparent if Sony showed off the latest version of GTA or if Nintendo showcased Mario 128. What do they have to gain other than a shallow attempt at advertising, and hopefully a few more consoles moved?
That said, the prof might be a little out of his element (I have a hard time finding a "silver-haired professor" being a gamer of any means, although that is a generalization and I could be wrong), but his question is at least somewhat valid. What is stopping someone from incorporating, say, chemistry elements into a crafting/spell casting system? Think Secret of Evermore (or World of Warcraft if you can't think back that far) where real-life elements and compounds create items and objects. True, it would be a transparent attempt (kind of like "The Bible Game" being nothing less than pure religion dressed up as a game), but would it really be all that bad? I can imagine at least a capable system involving some marginal knowledge, at which point someone *could* theoretically benefit and gain some knowledge.
This could be stretched further, but at that point it becomes difficult to pinpoint great examples. Describing true physics in a game using the Havok engine? Applying that mentality to space games in an attempt to teach some rudimentary physics, and possibly theoretical (string theory)? I dunno.
At the end of the day I'll admit I'm looking for my games to be fun, not giving me a lesson on something. Although I must admit, Civilization does a handy job of giving some background knowledge on key historical topics (if you take the time to read the blurbs, I mean, and I haven't played one since Civ2 so I don't know if the recent incarnations carry this data also).
I'm not scared of anonymous cowards.
They always left or obscured out a crucial piece of the bomb recipe.
So, the majority of users would be stuck, leaving a few of the more gifted and determined ones to work out the remaining details. Then you pray to Darwin that this minority takes reasonable precautions (your game should teach them that too).
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
Computer games taught me everything I know...
So you didn't learn anything from Leisure Suit Larry? Come'on, that was chalk full of one-liners that are sure to impress the ladies!
-Valiss
"When will you make a videogame that's going to teach my students chemistry?"
Full-Metal Alchemist!
"Games are traditionally something that people do in order to relax and have fun."
No! That's ONE accepted definition of a game. A game can educate (it's called a simulation). The military uses games to educate. Same with business (what do you think simcity and the tycoon series taught?). Even healthcare uses games.
The nice thing with most modern games is that the tools are within everyone's reach. From FUN to making a movie, everyone (with talent) can create.
First, I'll add that to achieve a desired level of stimulation often (but not always) requires more complexity as time goes on, partly to continue being a challenge. However, I work in schools where many of the children are learning typing skills through games like "Tuxtype" and others.
Educational games can be one of the best ways to engage young people. Taking a child that is otherwise reticent to learn and making it 'fun' will have him or her suddenly wanting to do the activity, not realizing that her or she is actually learning in the process.
As for chemistry... I've seen some screensavers that show the arrangement of various molecules in common substances. Perhaps a play on this could be made into a game using a tetris-like meme or something similar? How about pokemon meets scrabble, where you can choose the molecule to combine, but a more complex arrangement may beat your opponent's 'hand' (similar to having longer words with less common letters).