Gentoo Founder Quits Microsoft

ChocLinux writes "ZDNet is reporting that Daniel Robbins, the founder of Gentoo Linux, has left his job at Microsoft after only eight months. From the article: 'The reason I decided to leave had to do with my specific experiences working in Microsoft's Linux Lab,' says Robbins. 'I wasn't able to work at my full level of technical ability and I found this frustrating'"

Comments

Again?

[chinton]

What, did he have 2 different jobs at Microsoft?

That's always been my experience

[idkk]

But I suppose, the more experience you get, the more frustrating it becomes!

Hmm

[Freiheit]

It's a shame that he wasn't able to use his full skill set working for that company. Nothing worse than being at a job you're more than qualified for but not getting to use all you know.

Re:Hmm

[cbiltcliffe]

Well, come on, though. He had to know what was coming when he took the position.

You don't seriously think Microsoft would let a guy as familiar with Linux as this work in the Linux lab and tweak Linux for maximum performance for their tests, do you? They probably said there were certain things he wasn't allowed to touch, even if it would help. If he were given free reign, then all Microsoft's propagan^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^Hstudies would have to be futzed some other way.

Re:Hmm

[Capt James McCarthy]

It's a shame that he wasn't able to use his full skill set working for that company. Nothing worse than being at a job you're more than qualified for but not getting to use all you know.

Are you in the cube next to me?

Re:Hmm

[Alef]

You don't seriously think Microsoft would let a guy as familiar with Linux as this work in the Linux lab and tweak Linux for maximum performance for their tests, do you?

I imagine it would even be profitable for Microsoft to pay skilled people like him only to keep them from contributing to the Linux community...

Re:Hmm

[biglig2]

Same sort of thing happenned to me, I'm a brain surgeon and a few years back I took a job as a janitor at a hospital, just to get my foot in the door. I'd been working on my pet dog Skippy's brain for several years, but they just wouldn't let me do any operations, it was the most frustrating thing.

Zombified?

[Doctor Memory]

Sounds like they sucked his brain out and poured MS oatmeal in the hole. From TFA:

Daniel Robbins has decided to leave Microsoft to pursue his passion for software development with an independent software vendor where he will be focused on building in .NET on Windows.

Re:Zombified?

[amliebsch]

I think I see what happened...

STEVE BALLMER: Dan, we need you to work on customizing these Linux installations.
DANIEL: Sure thing Steve, right after I get done working on this .NET program.
STEVE: Yeah. See, the thing is, you're kind of behind, and we have some tests we need to run. So...yeah. If you could work on that, that would be great.
(ONE HOUR LATER)
STEVE: So, Dan, how are those Linux tests coming?
DANIEL: Yeah, good news, I'm almost started. Check out this .NET object-oriented Outlook clone I've been working on. It uses GTK# and even runs in Mono! Isn't that super?
STEVE: Can you stand up for a second? I need to use your chair.

Re:Zombified?

[jbolden]

I think if you look at the technologies the mainframe communities invented in the 70's and 80's many of them are just making to Unix/Linux and/or NT in this decade. They had the tecnological vision. They implemented succesfully.

Where they screwed up was culturally. Mainframe customers were conservative and so IS stagnated. The business community became frustrated and started using much worse computers where they had genuine control (PCs). Pretty soon a great deal of crucial business data was not inside the IS/IT depeartments.

With locked down PCs running only corporate approved apps and very strict change management for the desktops you are starting to see a push in the same direction. Give it another 10 years and we'll be right back in 1992 again.

pursue passion in .net on windows?

[jzeejunk]

FTA:
... to pursue his passion for software development with an independent software vendor where he will be focused on building in .NET on Windows ...

If he wanted to build .net apps on Windows why would he leave M$FT? I mean that is probably the place to be if that really was his passion. I can't believe how much BS these people come up with.

Re:pursue passion in .net on windows?

[biglig2]

What else is the poor devil going to do apart from .NET coding? Imagine the interview if he went for a Linux job:

"Hi Daniel, so you're an expert Linux hacker, sounds great, just what we are looking for. Oh, by the way, where was your last job at?"
"Well, I worked for Microsoft."
"Hah, yeah, that's funny. A Linux hacker working for Microsoft! Seriously, where did you work?"
"Microsoft! I was head of their Linux department! Steve Balmer recruited me!"
"Oh, I see. Say, could you excuse me while I just make a quick call? Thanks. Security? Yeah, we got another code three here."

For most...

[brunes69]

.. in the software development field, this is normal.

People in software development are constantly learning more and more about their craft, constantly having access to cutting-edge technologies and APIs. But rarely do you have a job where you can play with this stuff on a day-to-day basis, because actual real-life mean and potatoes development takes place using tools and technology 3-5 years behind the curve.

When was the last time you heard of a production application being written in Ruby on Rails, or in D? Sure, there are exceptions to every rule, but for the majority of us, we are stuck using older stuff.

Which is as it should be. Because if left to our own devices, programmers would always use the most whiz-bang, untested, unstable stuff out there. It's the technophile nature.

Re:For most...

[Pantero Blanco]

"Which is as it should be. Because if left to our own devices, programmers would always use the most whiz-bang, untested, unstable stuff out there. It's the technophile nature."

Of course, that's what the home, lab, or combination of the two is for. One of the niftiest things about open source projects is that they give the bleeding-edge "untested" stuff a testing ground and developer community, and often result in useful software. There generally aren't set-in-stone deadlines or things that absolutely "cannot go down", so people are free to use what they like.

It also takes up their free time, sadly. Oh, well.

Re:No wonder I got no reply

[truthsearch]

jobs for a UNIX systems administrator at Microsoft

You must be a masochist.

Shocked!

[Elladan]

I'm shocked. Shocked I say!

I was so sure that the founder of Gentoo getting a job at Microsoft was going to end well...

probably unable to buy into the b.s.

[slackaddict]

I was honestly shocked when I first heard about Mr. Robbins leaving one of the more geek-oriented Linux distros to work at MS. I'm sure there's much more to the story that isn't being said publicly, but he probably found the hive-like corporate culture incompatible to the freedom he had when managing his hard core distro. Going from being a superstar in the Linux/OSS world to one of the Joe's at MS had to be a huge shock.

I wish him all the best and I hope he returns to actively manage and develop Gentoo again. You can't blame him for wanting to feed his family and I'm sure he'll be welcomed back to our side.

Re:probably unable to buy into the b.s.

[jsnitsel]

It wasn't that shocking if you heard his reasoning. He would have continued working on Gentoo, but at that point he was $40k in debt due to his work on Gentoo. He needed to make ends meet, and working at Microsoft was one way to solve that.

Guess I'd get tired too...

[bitbiper]

after dodging chairs all day...

Nice Editing Job...

[ThinkFr33ly]

What a great job the poster did at editing out any pro-Microsoft sentiments in the article summary.

We wouldn't want to have that filth on the front page of Slashdot, now would we? Here is the full quote that was only partially included in the article summary:

"The reason I decided to leave had to do with my specific experiences working in Microsoft's Linux Lab. Although I believe that the concept behind Microsoft's Linux Lab is a good one, I wasn't able to work at my full level of technical ability and I found this frustrating," he said.

Also, earlier in the article:

"I didn't make the decision to leave Microsoft due to concerns about the company as a whole -- Microsoft has just had a string of very successful product launches and I anticipate that it will continue to enjoy great success," he said.

It probably went like this...

[CRCulver]

Anyone suspect a plot just to remove him from a productive Linux project to a place he could do no harm? It might have gone like this:

Manager: So, here's your office.
Robbins: It's empty. I don't even have a computer.
Manager: That's okay. Look, here's a ball. You can bounce it off the wall all day.
Robbins: And I'd get six figures a year just for that?
Manager: Sure. Enjoy.

Re:It probably went like this...

[Like2Byte]

This really happened...

It was 1997 or 1998. I was working for a multimedia company making training software for submariners. Two recently retired Navy Submarine Chiefs were hired to do some story-board writing. Typically, this entailed an Access 2.0 database with a vb front-end so they could enter their work.

The day they were hired the hiring manager, an ex submarine CO, hadn't procured an office to place them in...Nor desks, nor chairs, nor {{drum roll}} ... computers. When they inquired as to how they were going to get anything done without a computer to do it on the manager excused himself. Ten minutes later he came back with a stack of printed blank 'story-boards' and two sharpened #2 pencils.

They lasted at the company about three months - just long enough to get jobs at an aerospace corporation where the employees were taken seriously.

I wonder what the final straw was for him?

[DebianDog]

(Dan) I want to port .net native to Linux
(Microsoft) Umm... NO!!!
(Dan) Later Fucktards!!!

Note: Joke leeched from Nucrash on ZDNet

Re:Self-Important, Classless Move

[NDPTAL85]

He wasn't a mid-level guy. He is the founder of the Gentoo Linux project, he didn't just "contribute" to it. At that level you don't have to "behave" because your are far more talented than a true mid-level employee. This guy can write his own ticket.

Bummer

[187807]

From TFS:
"...has left his job at Microsoft after only eight months."

Sheesh, he didn't even have enough time to finish compiling Gentoo once.

Follow up interview

[gooman]

After an eight month study, Mr. Robbins concluded that TCO for Microsoft was significantly higher than Linux.

Mr. Robbins was overheard to say, "While Gentoo may cost countless hours of tweaking for bleeding-edge performance, Microsoft required the sale of one's soul to a man named Lucifer and yet resulted in only average performance."

When asked for their reply, Mr. Balmer cursed and threw a chair at this reporter. Mr. Gates only response was to place his fingertips together while saying, "Excellent."

No further comment was available.

Did the source go with him?

[saboola]

Tomorrow on slashdot: "Wintoo Announced" "Win32 installation that compiles itself to the specific needs of the hardware upon installation. Developers for Wintoo are remaining anonymous for the time being."

Some history on him

[porkThreeWays]

I think it's important to understand the history of this whole situtation to understand its current state. A few years ago, he came up with the idea for Gentoo. It was innovative at the time because there were few source based distributions out there. The idea of the source based distribution wasn't new, but portage definatly was/is the best source based package manager I've seen out there. He sunk a lot of his own personal money into gentoo that he never got back. When he left to work at MS, it pissed off a lot of purists and a lot of people shunned him. I think his move not to come back to the open source community (right now, anyway) has a lot to do with the fact he poured so much of himself into open source, and once he left to try and not live paycheck to paycheck, people immediatly forgot all of his contributions to gentoo.

drama

[buddha42]

They probably made him use redhat enterprise and forced him to use the rpm-provided versions of software.

NewBorg

[ElboRuum]

This is just the sort of reason why, when one of these little Linux/MS "updates" shows up, I just shake my head in despondency, largely because of what you mentioned, that the purists in the Linux community looked at him like a sellout. These are the same sort of "enlightened anti-groupthink" individuals who've been tearing at the buttocks of MS for years, all to the delight of Slashdotters everywhere. And people call MS users "drones"... Whatever.

The longer I read Slashdot, the more I believe there should also a picture of Linus Torvalds in a Borg headgear with maybe a green laser instead of red, right aside of good ol' Billy G. Talk about an exercise in groupthink, 90+% of Slashdotters seem to have drank the Kool-Aid where Linux is concerned.

Now you'll excuse me while I brace for the inevitable modding down into the 10th Circle of Heck to which this post will be subjected.

Re:NewBorg

[SalsaDoom]

And you deserve to be modded down too, but I won't do it. I'm a gentoo user, have been for many years now. When I heard drobbins was leaving for MSFT I was pretty choked about that in a way, but when I heard that it was because he had financial troubles and just needed a job that paid well... well, I understood. I wasn't entirely happy with it, but I understand that a man needs to pay the bills.

Now -- according to you, the everyone was seething about drobbins leaving for MSFT. It wasn't like that, we were all disappointed that drobbins had to end up at a place where we figured he wouldn't be happy and that was it. I spent a lot of time on the forums and on the irc channels back then and I never heard anyone call him a traitor or other shit like that. It made us sad, not angry -- those of us who are adults understand that you need a job that pays and sometimes that means not working on OSS all day long. drobbins MADE SURE that Gentoo would be free before he left and that proved to use that he was a good sort.

I didn't hear from these "purists" in the linux community, I don't think you did either. Some jackass somewhere might have said something but they were just some jackass somewhere and not a representative of anyones beliefs but their own.

Botton line: The Gentoo Linux community understood that their former leader had financial problems and needed a regular paying job. We wished him the best and still do.

--SD

In other news Google hires founder of Gentoo Linux

[CYDVicious]

In other news Google hires founder of Gentoo Linux, and Office Depot acquires new contract with Microsoft for office chairs.

Re:Self-Important, Classless Move

[Shag]

He left a month ago. You think he contacted the news media, after waiting a month?

Well, ya see, the Vice President wanted the ranch owner to tell the local paper first...

Gimme a break

[heroine]

5 job changes and layoffs later you'll find not working to your ability is the way it's done in that country. American job titles are not egalitarian like Hong Kong or Japan. The software engineering level is pretty much the same no matter where you go or what you do. Only if you network your way into management does the work get creative or challenging.

Hard to believe with all the information available from generation after generation of celebrity Linux programmer doing the same thing, they still have this attitude of quitting day job after day job thinking the next one is going to be better but never really getting anywhere.

Robbins *cannot* code

[Hackeron]

Portage is proof of this. Have you seen how bad the code is? - You cannot tell where the backend stops and where the frontend begins.

Try to import portage and see how far you get? -- the emerge frontend does *everything*, portage is just a couple IO functions easier achieved with cat.

If Robbins feels he wasnt used to his full potential in Microsoft, then, hmm, nice to know the "real world" is much easier than all us students expect ;)

A conversation heard in the lab

[Bloater]

PHB: "So, you're persuing technical excellence today?"
DR: "Yep"
PHB: "Same as yesterday?"
DR: "Yep"
PHB: "Still compiling is it?"

The hacker and the artist

[typical]

I spent a lot of time on the forums and on the irc channels back then and I never heard anyone call him a traitor or other shit like that. It made us sad, not angry -- those of us who are adults understand that you need a job that pays and sometimes that means not working on OSS all day long.

I think that an awful lot of people would be very surprised how many of the hackers that write open source software have a day job in which they write closed source software. If someone wants to attack those hackers as "selling out" or a "traitor", it'd be kind of silly. Lots of hackers (I suspect the majority of hackers) write open source software because they want to make something *good* for themselves and their fellow hackers. They want to enjoy a world time pressures, bad administrative-level ideas, language and platform requirements are all just a bad dream, and they can create truly nifty stuff. It's not because they consider themselves soldiers in some crusade -- sure, it's a fun idea to play with, but it's not really why people spend their time working on something neat. Open Source just allows hanging out and showing off with other hackers, and making it easier for other hacker-types to give a hand.

Maybe a good analogy for hackery would be the guy who is a commercial graphic designer by day and an artist by night. All day he has to churn out relatively boring things for people who often come up with absurd requirements. He has to work under time pressure and doesn't have the freedom he'd like to experiment with his ideas. However, at night, he can try out his ideas, do really interesting stuff, and so forth. Just because he has to churn out bread-and-butter stuff doesn't mean that he can't legitimately explore at night.

Put simply, the hacker is the artist of the computer world.