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Core Duo Power Sapping Bug is Microsoft Issue

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the explore-all-possibilities dept.

illusoryphoenix writes "A few weeks ago, Tom's Hardware noted a significant reduction in battery life of the Core Duo processors it tested when USB devices were inserted. Intel claimed that Microsoft had a bug in their USB drivers, while Tom's Hardware was unable to reproduce the same result for any of the other Pentium M microarchitecures. This issue has finally been publicly confirmed by Microsoft to be a USB driver problem which keeps the processor from entering advanced sleep states."

28 of 109 comments (clear)

  1. Oh My God! by NutscrapeSucks · · Score: 4, Funny

    There's a driver glitch with brand new hardware!!! It's already been two weeks and they haven't fixed it yet!! What does this mean for the computing landscape? Is this Wintel's downfall? Will Apple return to their days of prominence? The implications could be enormous!

    --
    Whenever I hear the word 'Innovation', I reach for my pistol.
    1. Re:Oh My God! by dlZ · · Score: 2, Funny

      There's a driver glitch with brand new hardware!!! It's already been two weeks and they haven't fixed it yet!! What does this mean for the computing landscape? Is this Wintel's downfall? Will Apple return to their days of prominence? The implications could be enormous!

      Didn't you hear??? Apple is switching to MS Windows, I heard it from a reliable source! And Linux costs just too much to run, we're all out of alternatives!

      --
      rm -rf ./evidence @ punkcomp
    2. Re:Oh My God! by evilgrug · · Score: 5, Informative

      "There's a driver glitch with brand new hardware!!! "

      Actually it affects Pentium Ms as well, according to Anandtech.

      "It's already been two weeks and they haven't fixed it yet!!"

      Microsoft first identified the issue and published a Knowledgebase article July 12, 2005. That's a little more than 2 weeks.

      In fact, the regedit quickfix they're recommending was also published on that date ... meaning they still haven't resolved it 7 months later.

    3. Re:Oh My God! by tpgp · · Score: 5, Informative
      I know that you're joking, but I have to reply to the serious parts of your post.

      There's a driver glitch with brand new hardware!!!

      From the TFA
      When a peripheral device was connected to a USB (universal serial bus) 2.0 port, the notebook's battery life plunged at a greater rate than would normally be expected from the use of a peripheral such as a mouse or storage key.
      Nope, not new hardware. USB is not new. The core duos just made the problem more obvious.

      It's already been two weeks and they haven't fixed it yet!!
      From the TFA
      Microsoft published a Knowledge Base article on the subject in July 2005, but made that information available only to PC vendors and partners, a company representative said in a statement.
      So, its actually been over six months and they haven't fixed it yet.

      As usual, Microsoft waits for an issue to become public before bothering to fix it.
      --
      My pics.
    4. Re:Oh My God! by cloudmaster · · Score: 5, Funny

      From the TFA

      Don't you mean "From the TFA article", or maybe "from the friggin' TFA article"? :)

      FYI information, this post is courtesy of Windows XP, based on NT technology, and transimtted using NIC card features to get the message posted as ASAP as possible.

      just becuase I've nothing more to contribute (except that Tom's Hardware sucks)

    5. Re:Oh My God! by MysteriousPreacher · · Score: 4, Funny
      There's a driver glitch with brand new hardware!!! It's already been two weeks and they haven't fixed it yet!! What does this mean for the computing landscape? Is this Wintel's downfall? Will Apple return to their days of prominence? The implications could be enormous!


      John Dvorak, is that you?
      --
      -- Using the preview button since 2005
    6. Re:Oh My God! by cnettel · · Score: 2, Interesting

      One could argue that keeping USB2 devices plugged for long in a laptop running on battery is a kind of new scenario. The issue is also aggrevated on a dual core machine, as the need for "deep sleep" on one of the cores is actually a quite common scenario there, whereas the effects on a single-core older Pentium M is less pronounced (especially if you're using the system for anything, like playing a MP3, which will prevent your system from going to that level of power saving most of the time anyway).

  2. anandtech test by Dionysus · · Score: 4, Informative

    According to some testing over at anandtech, problem was in the way Windows XP polls USB2 devices.

    --
    Je ne parle pas francais.
    1. Re:anandtech test by deong · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "And this is why Tom's and other tech review sites should always test it with, say, Linux in addition to Windows. They'd have known a lot sooner."

      Funny. In my own independent testing, the Windows USB driver provides about a 30% gain in battery life using Linux as my baseline.

    2. Re:anandtech test by diegocgteleline.es · · Score: 2, Informative

      In the Linux kernel Dave Jones also found a power consumption problem with USB, but it seems (to me) that the USB spec is just f*cked up - i wonder if this microsoft issue is related.

  3. This is good news by nurb432 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    That means its fixable with a minor software patch. Much better then having broken hardware.

    At least we know someones QA is still working.. ( and that wouldnt be microsoft in this case )

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
    1. Re:This is good news by KarmaMB84 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The fact that it didn't break until a brand new processor hit the scenes tells me their QA was fine. How do you QA for non-existant products?

    2. Re:This is good news by tpgp · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This is good news....That means its fixable with a minor software patch. Much better then having broken hardware.

      Good news for whom?

      I agree that it's certainly good for people unfortunate enough to use Microsoft's operating systems - they'll be able to fix a problem with a software patch rather then a hardware patch.

      However, it's certainly not good news for microsoft - the small amount of trust that people have left in MS's QA processes will be lost in the news that they found this bug over six months ago, but didn't bother releasing a patch until it was publicised. (I hope their security QA processes are better)

      --
      My pics.
    3. Re:This is good news by FireFury03 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      A good code review can often (not always) find problems before they show up at runtime.

      In my experience, code reviews only pick up the reasonably obvious problems - your example was an obvious problem that could be spotted a mile off. Code reviews generally don't tend to pick up problems in intricate algorithms.

      Infact, looking at the user agent string _at all_ is a bug, nomatter what string you're looking for. It is the reason that browsers have to fake their UA strings (IE claims to be Mozilla, Opera often claims to be IE, etc) - if you check UA strings then you have to update the site every time a new browser is released. On the other hand, presumably your UA test was to serve up some specific code needed to work around browser bugs - that makes detecting a later version of the browser and serving up the same code to be an invalid thing to do since that later version which hasn't yet been released may not have the same bugs so you're suddenly serving up workarounds that aren't needed and may potentially break.

      That said, as other people pointed out, whilest MS didn't originally spot this bug (whcih may or may not be a problem with their QA procedures), they _did_ spot it over 6 months ago and didn't bother to fix it - that's the bigger problem. I wouldn't complain too much since under existing hardware this didn't affect people much - the real problem is that they also take this attitude with security bugs, and that's more worrying (only fix the bug when it has public attention... usually coz it's being exploited in the wild)

      --
      http://blog.nexusuk.org
  4. Tom's was wrong by jamesl · · Score: 5, Informative
    AnandTech has an in depth analysis. Like most things, the answer can't be found in a headline.
    http://www.anandtech.com/mobile/showdoc.aspx?i=269 3/

    We've spent almost the past two weeks performing non-stop battery life testing on five notebooks with up to 4 different USB devices, testing theories, trying to pinpoint exactly what causes this problem and testing Microsoft's fix. What follows is the process that we went through in our labs when faced with this strange bug.

  5. Where's the new logo ? by Potatomasher · · Score: 5, Funny

    Intel with a dropped e ? That's so like 1970 to end of 2005.
    Get with the times Slashdot.

    --
    A million monkeys and this is the best sig they could come up with...
  6. BIOS Fix? by slashnik · · Score: 3, Insightful
    From TFA

    Microsoft outlined a fix that involved modifying the registry key for USB 2.0. However, since then the company has realized that this is an impractical fix for most users, and is working on a new fix that could involve a BIOS update patch


    What! Microsift to patch the BIOS
    Not on my notebook
    1. Re:BIOS Fix? by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Microsoft outlined a fix that involved modifying the registry key for USB 2.0. However, since then the company has realized that this is an impractical fix for most users, and is working on a new fix that could involve a BIOS update patch

      What! Microsift to patch the BIOS
      Not on my notebook

      Indeed. Microsoft can easily patch their own friggin' registry monstrosity.

      Patching the BIOS of the machine is an outrageously bad suggestion, and a bad precedent.

      How long before MS patches everyone's BIOS into oblivion or DRM hell?
      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    2. Re:BIOS Fix? by ecuador_gr · · Score: 2, Informative

      Ok, I might be overboard here, but something does not feel right. MS does confirm that it is their usb driver's fault, but a possible solution would be a BIOS upgrade??? How is not a Windows update able to fix an MS driver bug?
      But if it is not really a driver bug, as the BIOS statement would indicate, why on earth would MS cover for anybody?

      It does not make sense! If Chewbacca lives on Endor, you must acquit!

  7. So predictable. by twitter · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Good thing no one made the Critical error of speciously faulting Apple or Linux without testing, that would look like FUD when faced with a typical Microsoft problem.

    --

    Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.

  8. power sapping bug by revery · · Score: 4, Funny

    Core Duo Power Sapping Bug

    [Starscream holds a press conference]
    Ummmm, yes... we were hoping no one would notice, but it's the fricking Insecticons gathering Energon for Megatron... Again. Microsoft only got involved because they own the North American rights to all acts of evil.

  9. It's not just Microsoft... by Junior+J.+Junior+III · · Score: 4, Funny

    I can't get into a deep sleep when someone jabs a USB plug into one of my ports, either. Apparently I'm hot, I'm pluggable, but I'm not hot-pluggable.

    --
    You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
    1. Re:It's not just Microsoft... by Odin's+Raven · · Score: 5, Funny
      Inexperienced hot-pluggers often feel this way. First, and most importantly - there's absolutely nothing wrong with you - you are hot-pluggable. Don't let a bad initial experience convince you otherwise.

      The realy problem here is with technique - jabbing is never recommended. You want to firmly grasp the peripheral near its end, then gently slide it into the port. Okay, try that a few times - firm grasp - good! - and gennnntly slide it in. Now withdraw the device, and gennnntly reinsert. In and out, in and out, over and over and over again. Excellent, now you're getting the hang of it.

      Although it's sometimes normal to encounter resistance inserting a peripheral into a brand-new port, this friction should disappear with use. Be extra-gentle in these circumstances, and resist the urge to just jab a device into the slot. Again, slow and easy, gently sliding in and out. Yes...yessssss! Getting frustrated and randomly jabbing with your peripheral is unlikely to result in a successful connection, and can damage your peripheral unit or the slot. Overly forceful insertions have even caused the tip of a device to snap clean off - don't let this happen to you!

      Deep sleep is a separate issue. It's normal not to sleep immediately after a peripheral is inserted - the unit is in active use, and sleeping would be undesirable. Wait until interactions with the device have ceased before entering sleep.

      Hopefully this has cleared up some of your concerns. Remember that hot-plugging is a perfectly normal activity, one which anyone can learn to enjoy with a little practice.

      --
      A marriage is always made up of two people who are prepared to swear that only the other one snores.
  10. Re:Perish the thought... by ettlz · · Score: 2, Funny
    we can ask Redmond to bring back the Teletubbie Hill with Vista
    Even the Teletubbies were smart enough to know UNIX was the only solution for the Superdome.
  11. All a bunch of whiners.... by jnadke · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Jesus... if Microsoft fixed every little bug to come along, then who would upgrade to Vista?!?!?

  12. Here's the fix... by altheusthethief · · Score: 2, Informative

    Important This article contains information about how to modify the registry.

    Make sure to back up the registry before you modify it. Make sure that you know how to restore the registry if a problem occurs. For more information about how to back up, restore, and modify the registry, click the following article number to view the article in the Microsoft Knowledge Base:
    256986 (https://premier.microsoft.com/kb/256986/ [microsoft.com]) Description of the Microsoft Windows registry

    SYMPTOMS
    Consider the following scenario. You install Microsoft Windows XP Service Pack 2 (SP2) on a portable computer. Then, you connect a USB 2.0 device to the computer. In this scenario, the computer uses its battery power more quickly than you expect.

    CAUSE
    Windows XP SP2 installs a USB 2.0 driver that initializes any connected USB device. However, the USB 2.0 driver leaves the asynchronous scheduler component continuously running. This problem causes continuous instances of memory access that prevent the computer from entering the deeper Advanced Configuration and Power Interface (ACPI) processor idle sleep states. These processor idle sleep states are also known as C states. For example, these include the C3 and C4 states. These sleep states are designed, in part, to save battery power. If an otherwise idle portable computer cannot enter or maintain the processor idle sleep states, the computer uses its battery power more quickly than you expect.

    RESOLUTION
    Warning Serious problems might occur if you modify the registry incorrectly by using Registry Editor or by using another method.

    These problems might require that you reinstall your operating system. Microsoft cannot guarantee that these problems can be solved.

    Modify the registry at your own risk. To resolve this problem, add the EnIdleEndpointSupport entry to the USB registry key.

    To do this, follow these steps:

    1. Click Start, click Run, type regedit, and then click OK.
    2. Locate, and then click the following registry subkey:
    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Servic es\USB

    Note If the USB subkey does not exist, create it. To do this, follow these steps:

    a. Select the Services key. On the Edit menu, point to New, and then click Key.
    b. Type USB in the New Key #1 box to name the new key "USB."
    3. Right-click USB, point to New, and then click DWORD Value.
    4. In the New Value #1 box that appears, type EnIdleEndpointSupport, and then press ENTER.
    5. Right-click EnIdleEndpointSupport, and then click Modify.
    6. In the Value data box, type 1, leave the Hexadecimal option selected, and then click OK.
    7. Quit Registry Editor.

    STATUS
    Microsoft has confirmed that this is a problem in the Microsoft products that are listed in the "Applies to" section.

    APPLIES TO
    Microsoft Windows XP Service Pack 2, when used with:
    Microsoft Windows XP Professional
    Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition

    1. Re:Here's the fix... by akac · · Score: 3, Informative

      If you read the article, you'd also see that this "fix" also caused stability issues and didn't work after coming out of sleep.

  13. Special sleep states by scarlac · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Resumed from hibernation - Now entering Zombie Sleep State(tm)
    *deep and sinister buzzing sounds comming from the harddrive*

    But seriously - if there's one thing I really miss, now that i've been using 99% linux for over 1½ year, it's proper power management features. I've tried a few distros and none of them delivered 100% working power management, such as standby.
    I did, however, manage to get hibernation up and running, but apparently the docs on softwaresuspend aren't perfect, and I did manage to be able to hibernate - with the regular nv driver - but the properit...y.. (sorry for my bad english) nvidia driver has some problems with sleep states, making it impossible to stand by using xorg and that driver.

    So to conclude: I love Linux and the freedom I get, but I do miss the "works out-of-the-box" power management features of Windows >=2000.