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Broadband Service as P2P Distro Experiment
Not another doctor wrote to mention a PC Doctor article about the Sky by Broadband service. In addition to providing access to the internet, the service also helpfully downloads and installs the Kontiki P2P service. From the article: "What this really means is that Sky in all their advertising are making out that you are downloading content directly from them rather than other users. Also, the P2P link continues to run in the background after you've shut down the main application, eating up bandwidth by allowing others to download the files from your PC. Kontiki also collects and sends back to Sky a lot of information about your PC. There is no mention as to how this data is protected from unauthorized access, however, initial examination with Ethereal seems to show that all data is at least encrypted during transmission."
So you've decided to illegally download movies...
If you play with fire, you're bound to get burnt. Whether it's Sky's Kontiki client or some other P2P app, you're always running the risk of sucking up bandwidth with background services. And so what if you are? The maximum throughput is only slightly decreased and you get a bunch of extra features. Isn't that worth the tradeoff? Did you really think you could get something for nothing?
...we're INTENTIONALLY creating Sky-net.
Just want to make sure I'm understanding this right. Don't mind me, I'm going to go hide in the Vet office.
Karma: Chameleon (mostly due to the fact that you come and go).
From the website that is linked to from the article: "There is, however, a darker side to the Sky by Broadband - it installs onto your system a P2P (Peer-to-Peer) application called Kontiki. The purpose of this is to allow others to access the movie data that lives on your PC. This means that they entire Sky by Broadband system is a big P2P experiment and everyone wanting in on Sky by Broadband has to take part."
From the PC Doctor: What this really means is that Sky in all their advertising are making out that you are downloading content directly from them rather than other users.
Sky is being very honest about this despite what the PC Doctor says. I think it's very clear from the website that you are downloading the the movies peer to peer. What ELSE could they say to spell it out? I don't get it.
No Sigs!
Submitter was created for the sole purpose of commenting on this article. His link leads back to the PC Doctor website, which I don't think most of us have heard of. It sells tech books and support.
On topic, this is pretty serious if true. We really do need a P2P content distribution system, but having it on the sly doesn't really work. I'd like a system whereby it's cheaper if you agree to seed for a bit voluntarily.
Just a troll article looking for pageviews, from the fraking SKy by broadband page:
How does Sky use Kontiki's secure peer-to-peer technology to deliver videos to my PC?
Sky by broadband displays the video content available for you to download. Kontiki offers the underlying peer-to-peer technology which delivers the videos you choose in a secure, efficient manner, enabling very large, high-resolution videos to be delivered to your computer.
Specifically, the Kontiki technology determines how to download the video you selected by searching for sources of that video on locations which may include Sky's own network, or other users of Sky's Kontiki network or "grid". If the video can be delivered to you more quickly and efficiently from another computer, that's exactly what Kontiki will do! Conversely, your computer is also part of Sky's Kontiki grid, so your computer might be used as a source location for transferring a video to another Sky user.
Pretty much says it's doing what TFA is bitching about them not saying.
Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
Specifically, the Kontiki technology determines how to download the video you selected by searching for sources of that video on locations which may include Sky's own network, or other users of Sky's Kontiki network or "grid". If the video can be delivered to you more quickly and efficiently from another computer, that's exactly what Kontiki will do! Conversely, your computer is also part of Sky's Kontiki grid, so your computer might be used as a source location for transferring a video to another Sky user.
I can't see how this is being sneaky! It's in plain english.
This is not adware, this is using P2P technology to speed up transfers.
I vote the article as a -1 troll
Kontiki is what Gamespot uses as an alternate way of accessing their content, I believe. They may not use it anymore though, it's been a little while.
How much public data does a user need to receive & transmit before that user is accorded common carrier status, and the attached protections? A fast broadband connection can pass as much inforamtion as a small telephone exchange.
So what if your little enterprise collects no revenue, nor puts any conditions on its 'subscribers'?
There's a Starman, waiting in the sky / He'd like to come and meet us, but he hasn't got the time.
Sounds similar to Skype. If your firewall allows incoming connections you act as a relay for those who don't. Combine this with a dodgy ISP which charges you for your uploads (http://bigpond.com.au/) and newbies are in a world of pain.
Applications like this would be great if they were opt-in: if you had to say how much upload bandwidth you were willing the application to use, fine.
I think I just 1-UP'd you on the smart-ass score.
Obligatory Soundbite Catchphrase
This kinda seems to be what he was talking about.
Sky is smart for using a P2P architecture, a cool solution to an engineering problem. I have serious concerns about the partial uninstallation issue though.
Was the broken uninstaller a mistake or a "feature"? They have something to gain from using your computer as a P2P host. If, say, an investigation produced emails showing it was in the design spec, has a fraud been comitted? Deceiving someone to profit at their expense (resources--bandwith, CPU, etc) sounds like fraud. Have they broken the law?
Can anyone familiar with UK law comment?
Look. His handle is Not another doctor and the article is on the website of PC Doctor.
Obviously he's not connected with them. What are you, paranoid or something?
Infuriate left and right
Since when does being a Socialist mean 'someone who has a different opinion than me'?
The parent obviously didn't RTFA.
Also, the P2P link continues to run in the background after you've shut down the main application, eating up bandwidth by allowing others to download the files from your PC.
Then kill it by other means, or pull the plug, or somthing... If you know what this all means your quite capable of finding a work around, if not, then, well, you know, ignorance is bliss.
Movielink
Cinema Now
Vongo
Kontiki
NetcableTV
They all do this in one way or another. I'd be surprised if it's not in the EULA.
That's the way furture video distro is going to be, it's the only way they can make it work economically.
If you don't like it, don't install.
In addition to providing access to the internet
If you were to bother to read the requirements page, you'll see that one of the requirements is "A broadband internet connection of at least 512KB (1MB is recommended)".
This service does not provide connectivity, that's a separate requirement. Also, I don't know quite why PC Doctor is getting so upset about this. I briefly checked out the Sky by Broadband info a week or two ago, and from a few minutes clicking around the linked site it was perfectly plain to me that it involved installing the Kontiki P2P app. Ok, they may not shout it from the front page, but they're not exactly hiding the fact, either.
On top of that, the service is free to existing qualifying customers. It's not like you're paying to have the eevil Sky corporation steal your bandwidth...
It's official. Most of you are morons.
I applied for the BBC's online show trial and after reading the terms and conditions i abandoned it because it infact uses the same kontiki p2p service as sky apparently are. I emailed the bbc help address regarding this and was told if you dont like it you can turn your pc off...
"Kontiki also collects and sends back to Sky a lot of information about your PC. There is no mention as to how this data is protected from unauthorized access, however, initial examination with Ethereal seems to show that all data is at least encrypted during transmission."
So they know the encrypted data is sending back information about your computer. And they also don't know that the data is encrypted, because there is no mention as to how the data is protected from unauthorized access.
Erm. *tightens tin foil hat*. End of world, cats and dogs, soviet russia, O RLY.
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Whether you agree that specifying the P2P nature in the Terms and Conditions is enough, the Kontiki P2P software is hard to uninstall.
7 5/Blog.aspx
Uninstalling Sky By Broadband does NOT uninstall the Kontiki peer to peer. So, anyone who tries Sky By Broadband, doesn't like it, and uninstalls it, is still participating in the P2P network - and most likely doing so without their knowledge. I bet they're all wondering why teh internets have gone all slow...
I wrote some uninstall instructions on my blog last month for the Sky By Broadband Kontiki P2P server:
http://www.opinionatedgeek.com/Blog/blogentry=001
And here's another set of uninstall instructions:
http://www.nanagram.co.uk/sky.htm
The big question in my mind is whether it is incompetence that makes the software hard to uninstall, or is it a deliberate attempt to grow their network.
So here's a really implausible thought:
All Sky has to do is find one sucker each on a high-speed connection to download each movie they have on offer. After that they turn those computers into supernodes and sit back and watch while the movies are copied from user machines everywhere. A small notification is sent to them with each download that allows for billing/payments.
Of course that was really implausible. I'm sure media companies would never sink that low!
"Kontiki also collects and sends back to Sky a lot of information about your PC. There is no mention as to how this data is protected from unauthorized access, however, initial examination with Ethereal seems to show that all data is at least encrypted during transmission." ..its nice to know my information is being stolen from me safely.
Most people have no idea what they are doing, and are silently panicking on the inside.
Kontiki is Sky realising they've got away with one ripoff and are now embarking on a second to leech even more money from their customers - no different than just about every other big corporation that we the cattle masses have allowed to get too big for it's own damn good.
Wake up and smell the coffee people! If you don't like how a corporation is screwing you then don't buy their products, it really is THAT SIMPLE. The more people that do that, the more they have to take notice and stop treating their customers like mindless cattle.
And as for Sky, don't bother with them. Wait a year or two and all those nice TV programs you want to see get released in a handy DVD box set that you can probably buy for less than a month's subscription to Sky anyway.
Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
Gee, never saw this coming, did we?
Anyway, content owners want the benefits of P2P without the risks. The MACHINE is OURS, however, so we can play hardball right back at them with a firm ethical foundation to stand on. We can fight back with the same methods:
We need something like a P2P "robots.txt" file that is somehow accessible to outside entities, containing the conditions under which our machines can become part of any content distribution system. It could implement (through standard settings) a license under which your machine can be used for such purposes by a third party.
Example: using such a file, I should be able to rig up my machine so that it advertises the fact that any content distributed on the machine must be public domain, open source, in uncrippled formats, etc. Distribution of any other content on such a system would constructively create a license to use that content in specified ways.
In other words, if you stream your content (even in part) through MY machine, then you're giving me the rights to distribute, copy, modify, reverse engineer, etc., that content. If you're not happy with that, don't distribute using my machine.
Putting this in a technical setting like a metatag or *.txt file makes it possible for any distribution software to check the setting. So when they argue that you "clicked the EULA" you can argue right back that the software "agreed to the terms of distribution on my machine." Then they get to argue that it's harder for software to employ a clear and standard permission check than it is for an average person to read and understand a crafty EULA that hides away the fact that you're becoming a peer in the distribution network.
I don't know if my explanation was clear but I think it's a good idea.
Meanwhile UK ISPs are introducing download limits as low as a couple of gig per month, and charging for excessive usage.
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Sky movies on demand works as below (i helped deliver the product)
bskyb encrypts the films and stores them on seed file servers.
A user connects to a bunch of j2ee apps browses the film list and selects a film to download. The film is then downloaded, either initially from bskyb file servers or later, once many users have a copy, from the p2p at large. Thus solving inherent bandwidth and technology constraints of 7 million UK punters trying to download GB films from a single source.
When playing the film the users pc connects to bskyb, traverses some j2ee code and makes a request for a microsoft DRM key (couple of 2003 DMR servers in the farm).
A key is provisioned and playback commences.
easy as 1,2,3
People don't want to be surveilled no matter how many of these stories you float.
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can't they make up a new and original name?
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