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Linux vs. Windows for Schools?
Fiachra06 writes "I am involved in helping to maintain the computer systems in the local school (200 ~ 250 pupils) in my home village. The children range in age from 4 to 12. The 14 PC's are running either Windows 95, Windows 98, and XP Home Edition and I find this rather abhorrent. The licensing fees to upgrade all the capable machines to XP pro is unreasonable for such a small school. What would the esteemed Slashdot readers think of shifting all these machines to a Linux distro (probably Ubuntu). I have no doubt the children will have no problem adapting to the new OS (although the teachers might), the main concerns are the availability of educational software for them to use, and practicality of maintenance for people who are new to the OS given that I am not there regularly enough to be a full time sys admin. Preferably I wouldn't like to running too much through Wine but it is still an option."
Edubuntu?
Is it more educational to buy a packaged education or take a classroom and create a learning environment? The best way to learn is to create the tools of learning rather than memorizing facts or being shown movies or games all day. Tell them they are smart, get them involved and make the system that will teach more generations. Turn them into leaders of the future, not followers of the past generations.
Edubuntu may be the way to go.
Edubuntu FAQ
Looking at the Edubuntu Tour, some of the programs seem to be for a younger age, around kindergarten and up, but the SchoolTool calendar for teachers looks interesting.
OpenOffice is included (of course). You don't mention what applications the kids may need - if it's just for internet browsing and research, and maybe some of the other educational things already included (Typing, etc), Edubuntu may fit your needs.
The upcoming 6.04 release of Ubuntu's Dapper Drake may fit you better, as it will have a formal support cycle. (I want to say 3 years).
Close, but not quite. You're forgetting that you're not using the software for the software's sake; you're using it to acheive something. That is to say, the software isn't the be-all and end-all, it's just a means to an end.
More than likely, the OP needed "A spreadsheet" but chose the actual application based on a variety of factors, one of which was probably the OS he was running at the time. He doesn't need to run spreadsheet Brand X, that's just his current choice; if spreadsheet Brand Y can fulfil the needs as well, but works solely on Linux, that's fine. It's certainly not the vicious cycle of "I chose X because I run Windows, and I need to run Windows because I use X".
Admittedly there are retraining/migration costs, which would come under the cons of changing product (and are sometimes really large, e.g. incompatible data files). But don't make the mistake of thinking that because you can't get a specific app on Linux, it's not worth switching. People really use computers as a tool, to acheive certain goals, and people using and developing for Linux have similar goals to those using Windows. If you can do it in Windows, you can probably do it some way in Linux; don't get too hooked on the details.
My, that was a yummy potato!
Amazing... Simply ask a question hoping to gather some info and ideas and the incensed reaction from the Windows Elitists and their foaming at the mouth amazed responses that someone should dare consider something other than windows...
Lets review this persons response shall we...
*Abhorrent? Please. Licensing costs for 14 copies of XP Pro Academic Upgrade would run just under a grand.*
- Obviously current affairs are not a strong point with you - most schools are closing down programs or closing all together, for years the teachers themselves had had to purchase their own supplies for the classes they teach, supplies the schools used to supply (pencils, Scissors, Construction Paper, paste)
*If the machines are running 95 and 98, I'd bet more then a few are old enough that they probably shouldn't be running XP so the actual cost likely is less.*
- this combined with the privious statement shows your true lack of understanding within the modern school system let alone proper project planning and managment - IF the PC's in question are indeed incapable of running WinXP well then it will just cost less in licensing then LOL no, because then you have to upgrade/replace the PC to modernize the PC to run todays software and so then it will indeed cost far MORE - the person posting the original question was hoping to find a low cost solution to a modern need and as even Micro$oft and its ferverent backers will all agree, linux is moving up the usability ladder and showing up more and more in mainstream life - get used to it LOL
*Yes it's a significant chunk of change, but not crippling expensive. Obviously running 95, 98, and XP Home may not be the best solution overall, but it apparently seems to work for the time being.*
-See my first section in response to this, amazing some people actually think our school system can just go buy anything - sad to have that little understanding of the modern school crisis faced today
*What you are proposing is installing an operating system that is completely foreign to them. The software that they already own has been untested on it. It may or may not work. The availability of future software titles that run natively is also limited. Neither the kids nor the teachers have any experience with it. And to top it off, you even point out that you can't really support it like you should.*
- Has anyone knows children learn at a far faster rate and adapt to new tech far faster than adults, they wouldnt have a problem (and prolly would help the teachers as well) adapt and learn the new systems in no time - your assuming that Point-N-Click is a windows only thing?? take 1 PC, Load Ubuntu or whatever distro on it, load and setup Wine, add the needed software and test, once you are sure its stable, image the PC and load on the other PC's (after taking some time to familirize the staff with the new OS and the dreaded Point-N-Click on the icon interface as they prolly never seen that before)
*Sounds like a great plan!*
- despite your sarcasm, it does, nothing better than saving a cash strapped school system a few thousand needed elsewhere desperatly dollars than dump them into the coffers of Micro$oft that will dump Million$ (of its Billion$ in revenue/profit) into the school and educational systems worldwide, but cries licensing disputes right here in the US itself for the further education and empowerment of the youth here and now.
In the OP's defense, he doesn't say he is from the USA, which means "a grand" could be a non-trivial sum. Windows 95? Sounds like these systems were all donations, and no one has had the sense to retire OS hardware that is just a bit too old.
As a Linux advocate, I'd have to agree with you overall -- The poster already said he won't be a full time admin.
If he WERE the admin, and had someone as backup admin, he should not be gambling with his and other folks time trying to fix this... especially in one fell swoop.
My suggestion is to configure 1 new and 2 old systems as a diskless Linux Terminal, with the better system running as a server of course. DON'T SELL the folks on WINE compatability -- you asked about it, meaning you (OP) don't know much about configuring WINE to actually run more than Minesweeper and Notepad (think: native DLL's). If some things work in wine, BONUS, but from the start remove this feature from the plate.
If the k12 Linux Terminal Server project works for these systems, you have a good pilot. Now draw up a chart showing what a $1500 investment in the lab would get you (A few new XP systems, or a bunch of upgrades or new OS-less systems). Then let the customer decide.
It's a huge undertaking what you propose. You are not prepared for it if you have to ask Slashdot (no offense to anyone). If you do this and fail, your credibility will be destroyed, and when Linux gets better and better they will be the last folks on the planet to try it again because of the bad experience.
Aim for a pilot program, or a fileserver, but only if you are at least 80% technically capable of it. Some things you can find in Google, but there's nothing worse than some newbie posting on the forums, whining that they have to finish Something they don't know how to, and on a deadline at that.
Sure you get a peachy keen deal...oh but did you buy Office? *ka-ching* Did you get the educational software you needed? *ka-ching* Did you buy the support contracts? *ka-ching* Did you buy the anti-virus software? *ka-ching* Oh and did you figure up how much a compromise would cost? *ka-ching*
Not saying Windows is the worst solution, but you oversimplify the issue grossly.
The only change I can believe in is what I find in my couch cushions.
Sure the handful of crapfully crafted games he had for Windows wouldn't run, but within the first week he didn't care. The distro comes loaded with educational games and exercises. His 1st grade class has 3-4 ancient iMacs (the ones that came in different colors). My impression was that they don't use the computers to construct or teach lessen plans, but its there to get them accustomed to using computers on a daily basis. For some edu-games, some heavily restricted internet, and education exercises I HIGHLY recommend edubuntu for younger kids.