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One REALLY Long Runway for Rent

DarkNemesis618 writes "NASA is looking into putting its 15,000 foot runway up for rent at the Kennedy Space Center. The runway, which is used for Space Shuttle landings, will soon be used less and less as the Shuttle fleet is set to be retired in 2010. The first private venture was seen last month when Steve Fossett took off at KSC in Virgin Atlantic's experimental plane. One promising deal in the works comes from Zero Gravity Corp. which offers customers a few seconds of weightlessness on a Boeing 727-200. The shuttle runway, built in the 1970s never got the use it was expected to, and with the next generation of space vehicles using parachutes to land, the runway is going to have even less use."

11 of 211 comments (clear)

  1. Runway Lengths by AKAImBatman · · Score: 5, Informative
    15,000 feet may seem like a lot, but it often helps to put things into perspective. For example, O'Hare International Airport has 6 paved runways with the following stats:
    Direction Length Surface
    14R/32L 13,001 Paved
    14L/32R 10,301 Paved
    09R/27L 10,144 Paved
    04R/22L 8.071 Paved
    09L/27R 7,969 Paved
    04L/22R 7,500 Paved
    John F. Kennedy International Airport has 4 runways with the following stats:
    Direction Length Surface
    4L/22R 11,351 Asphalt/Concrete
    4R/22L 8,400 Asphalt
    13L/31R 10,000 Asphalt
    13R/31L 14,572 Asphalt/Concrete
    So this runway is only about 428 feet longer than the longest runway at JFK International. (13R/31L - 14,572ft) Given that 14,000+ feet is already a huge amount of space, we can conclude that the KSC runway would be more interesting to new space ventures because of its location and lack of commercial traffic rather than its outright length.
    1. Re:Runway Lengths by iamlucky13 · · Score: 2, Informative

      ...and Edwards Airforce Base has a paved runway about 15,000 feet long, but there is an additional 10 miles or so of marked dry lake bed suitable for landing a wide range of aircraft on and considered part of the runway. Bottom line: this is a long runway, possibly even a really long runway, but not a REALLY long runway.

    2. Re:Runway Lengths by Xandu · · Score: 4, Informative

      In fact, the higher you go in elevation, the longer runway planes need. The longest runway at Denver, for example, is 16,000 feet.

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      --Xandu
    3. Re:Runway Lengths by AKAImBatman · · Score: 3, Informative

      Edwards Airforce Base has a paved runway about 15,000 feet long, but there is an additional 10 miles or so of marked dry lake bed suitable for landing a wide range of aircraft

      Good point. I used to use that runway in X-Plane to take off custom spaceplanes. The extra runway was extremely helpful in getting the vehicle off the ground. Especially when I equipped the craft with ejectable JATO bottles in lieu of a proper Solid Rocket Booster. :-)

      (In case anyone is wondering: No, I never made it to orbit. As soon as I hit Mach 5, I overstress the frame and lose a wing or somesuch. If I don't hit Mach 5, I run out of fuel before I obtain orbit. Even in the simulated NASP craft that is supposed to be able to make it to orbit. Guess I better let a real pilot at the controls.)

    4. Re:Runway Lengths by badasscat · · Score: 3, Informative

      So this runway is only about 428 feet longer than the longest runway at JFK International. (13R/31L - 14,572ft)

      Well, to put THAT into perspective, 13R/31L is one of the longest runways in the United States. There are only a few longer:

      # Denver Intl Airport (DEN) in Denver, CO has a 16,000' x 200' runway.
      # Southern California Logistics Airport (VCV) in Victorville, CA has a 15,050' x 150' runway.
      # Edwards AFB Airport (EDW) in Edwards, CA has a 15,013' x 300' runway.
      # Nasa Shuttle Landing Facility Airport (X68) in Titusville, FL has a 15,000' x 300' runway.
      # Vandenberg AFB Airport (VBG) in Lompoc, CA has a 15,000' x 200' runway.

      That's from MyAFD.com.

      So, still a pretty long runway by any standard. I mean that's nearly three miles, or about 50% longer than the runways at most major airports. (LaGuardia's runways, for example, are only 7,500 feet long, and yes, widebodies can and do use this airport.)

  2. For the metric crew: by b4stard · · Score: 4, Informative

    15 000 feet = 4 572 meter

  3. Google Maps link by woah · · Score: 4, Informative
  4. More info about the runway by heli0 · · Score: 2, Informative
    --
    Whenever the offence inspires less horror than the punishment, the rigour of penal law is obliged to give way...
  5. Even sadder... by fm6 · · Score: 4, Informative

    ... than underused shuttle facilities at KSC is the Air Force shuttle facility on the west coast, which cost $6 billion, and was never used at all.

  6. More Detail on KTTS (Titusville) by AceyMan · · Score: 3, Informative

    KTTS "NASA Shuttle Landing Facility" details here:

    Runway Information
    Runway 15/33
    Dimensions: 15000 x 300 ft. / 4572 x 91 m
    Surface: concrete/grooved, in good condition
    Weight bearing capacity:
    Single wheel: 120000 lbs
    Double wheel: 220000 lbs
    Double tandem: 500000 lbs
    Dual double tandem: 800000 lbs
    Runway edge lights: non-standard
    NSTD HIRL; 85' FR RWY EDGE.
            RUNWAY 15 RUNWAY 33
    Gradient: 0.0 0.0
    Traffic pattern: left left
    Markings: precision, in good condition precision, in good condition
    Approach lights: ALSF2: standard 2,400 foot high intensity approach lighting system with centerline sequenced flashers (category II or III) ALSF2: standard 2,400 foot high intensity approach lighting system with centerline sequenced flashers (category II or III)
    Centerline lights: yes
    CL RWY 15-33 NSTD, 10,000'. yes
    .
    .
    cribbed from airnav.com [sweet site]

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    -- Experience is a wonderful thing. It enables you to recognize a mistake when you make it again.
  7. Re:Can I rent it for a day? by modecx · · Score: 3, Informative

    Any potential merit you had as a car guy went right out the window when you suggested that the viper's handling as a track car is any better than mediocre... And that's despite your ludicrous claims on the Fierro *cough*bullshit*cough*... Every race prepared Fiero I've ever seen weighed in right at 2000lbs, and that was with the aluminum V6, and an 8 point roll cage! Furthermore, NASCAR circuit tracks are boring as hell unless they've got a road course in the middle, and not all of them do, and most are just average as road tracks go anyway. Yay for left hand turns? NO, damnit!

    My advice to the GP: look up some tracks in your area. In the US, there are places with lots of tracks, and places devoid of them (mostly in the middle), and some have open track days. Most will rent out a day, so if you can get enough people together to make it worthwhile that's an option... Maybe there's a Subaru club that rents a day at the track, which can cost upwards of $8000 depending on the track. So, the more people you've got, the cheaper it will be. Open track days can cost anywhere from $100 to $300 to attend, but it's worth it... But unless you've got an STI, I wouldn't push your car too hard, the plain WRX transmissions are pretty weak as far as sports car transmissions, they shafts and case can flex tear up a bunch of gears if you're not careful, or worse yet, you could break the case. Ouch. I've seen it happen!

    Other than that, I think the best investment you can make as far as going fast and enjoying it is in performance driving school. There's lots of schools around the country and tracks can often get you headed in the right direction. If you've got money to blow, and some space to work on and store your cars, you could get a wrecked WRX, and turn that into a semi-dedicated, but still road legal car.

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    Constitutional rights may be respected, repealed, or modified; but they must never be ignored.