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Employers Trolling for Current Employee Resumes?
powderhound asks: "Recently, my employer started looking for new employees and started to find the resumes of current employees on the job Web sites. I've heard that management was not pleased. In the old days, before Web job sites, you could job hunt with relative certainty that your current employer would not find out until you gave notice. Now, any employer wishing to check on their employee's desire to find a new job need only sign up on the job Web sites and start trolling. How do we, as employees looking to change jobs, protect ourselves from possible discovery, and even worse, retribution? What have you done to protect yourself? Do you think employers are trolling job sites for their own employees?"
I dated an HR director for a few years and it gave me a huge insight into what HR does in the modern corporation. HR's job is to basically protect the corporation from any employee liability. This typically means they file away every little thing they think might be useful if they ever need cause for termination, to contest your claims to unemployment, to contest any claims for workman's comp -- basically to cover their ass. You would be amazed at what is in your HR file. ;) Anything after that is just extra.
;)
Now I'm not saying its like that EVERYwhere, but in most large corporations, and many small ones, HR is not your friend. This is really sad because years ago it was just the opposite. EA obviously has a poor HR department.
Well, it's not entirely related to this story, but I figured I'd share a little experience I had. In Feb of 2004, I was laid off. I was in the middle of creating some artwork that I was posting on a web-forum for others to watch the progress on. So, the goal of that piece became to make it ready to throw on my demo reel so I could seek work. I even named a couple of places I was gunning for. Unfortunately, it didn't look as though I was going to finish that piece as soon as I would have like, so I left the thread there and moved on to other stuff.
One year and 3 days later, happily employed, I found a little time one night to resume that piece. Once satisified, I posted the image. Unfortunately, I had forgotten to set my alarm that night. I overslept the next day. When I finally arrived at work, my boss was real happy to see me. You see, this forum I was posting artwork to was the exact same forum that he discovered me with. He read these February posts about gunning for a job at these two other places and became concerned. That, coupled with my lateness to work, gave his imagination a lot to work with. By the time I got there,though, he had discovered the YEAR of the post, and a good laugh was had by all.
There's no real moral to this story unless you seek it. It's just my own little anecdotal evidence that one should be careful about what he or she says on the net. This may seem like common sense, but it is funny how these little things can nip you in the rear. In my case, it was totally accidental.
This probably isn't all that relevent to the story. It might have been a more useful post in another story recently about somebody getting in trouble at work over something found in a search engine. No offense taken if this is considered off-topic, but yeah, employeers can see you on the net. Behave.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
What they really want is the most cost-effective relationship possible. And that just may be slavery. There are laws against outright slavery, but "economic" slavery is not outlawed by any means. Most world economies thrive and require it.
So spend, spend, spend little consumerbots!
"It is a two-way street, any manager expecting it to be a one-way street is fooling themselves."
It is a two-way street, but management has a big SUV that takes up both lanes.
I live in a rural area, and it has been known for the grapevine to "black list" certain people at potential employers, outside of official channels. When I lived in an urban area, it is common to find that most employers are equally crappy. It is very common for companies to want to pay practially nothing. Being a independent contractor could be great, but even that is highly volatile. The grass is always greener and all that.
"Still, I wonder if it is legal to fire someone just for having looked for alternate employment options."
IIRC, in some states it is legal, such as South Carolina ("will to work" or "right to work", I don't remember exactly).
Really rewarding and enjoyable workplaces are not particularly common. I worked briefly for one Fortune 500--but family run--company, and it was a great place to work (ample training, good benefits, etc.). Too bad it was in a part of the country I didn't want to live in.
Ummm...the HR person responsible for bringing me job applicants to interview seems to spend his life trolling monster.com. And I work for one of the largest private employers in my state.
The amazing thing is that he brings me very few "duds". Most of the people who make it this far really seem to be as sharp as their resumes claim, and I'd say I've given him a thumbs up on over 75% of them. Not that we've hired them all, but the ones we have gotten have been really good.
John
Last semester I interned at a computer consulting firm as a human resources recruiting assistant. The job was far from what I wanted to do, but I was in a specialzed political program and they felt that getting the CS major away from the keyboard would be more in line with that. I did learn a lot that I would not have learned if I were in a software development role, but I am certainly NOT an HR person. Bear with me, this is all very important for job seekers and does tie into the topic.
Anyway heres how it goes when a company doesn't do all/any of its own HR. They have a list, sometimes exclusive other times not, of HR/Consulting firms that they send job requests to. Those requests specify the length of the contract, the salary range, a brief (VERY) job description, and desired skills. It then became my bosses job to hand me that piece of paper from which I had to parse out a monster (we ONLY used monster for some reason) search string and start calling people.
First off we had an implied policy that we didn't bother with confidential resumes. Send an email and then leave it. Our response rate from those was exceedingly low, single-digit percentages.
We did have an easier time than many consulting contracting firms because nearly all of our contracts were temp-to-perm and my employer had farily good benefits. The way that works is a new hire was an employee of ours for 3 to 6 months, recieving pay and benefits from us while working for our client. At the end of that term, if the client was happy the client could then hire that employee on as thier own without paying us a finders fee. My employer got a (significant) cut, our clients got good people, and good people got full time, permanent jobs.
That sounds all well and good but human resources is not some place I can work and feel good about it. I had to look at a resume, review the stated skills in comparision to the desired skills, look at the employment history and see if/how those skills were actually used, and if that matched then I made a call (resumes with phone numbers get priority, because we can get you right away) and talked to the candidate to see if they were really interested.
Now I get to take a job description that was less than a paragraph with some notes/comments from my boss and tell (NEVER sell) the candidate about the position. Then if they were interested I had to ask questions and see if this person really had what we wanted for the job. It was hard because my boss (and by implication our clients) had very specific requriements, there was no room for 'I think this guy would be good' I had to take the vagaries of resumes and HR talk and salary requirements and quantify them. My coworkers (Hi Jeff, Julie, Lee, and Steve!) were great people and could handle that. It is very difficult.
Now coming back to the point, when we saw a resume of on of our people. We DID NOT CARE. If anything it was a good guide, as I'm reading the first few parts of the resume "Oh wow this guy would be perfect....because he is already doing (job) for (client).". I usually printed those out and used them as examples to compare to other resumes.
If you are looking for something better and not serious about going to a new job, you are wasting my time and yours. If you are "seeing whats out there" then you are a liability, it looks bad for us when an employee quits in the middle of a contract, it wastes my time, it wastes our clients time, and it shows an apalling lack of responsibility on your part. We were not hiring short-term contractors who were looking for adventure and new jobs every 3 months, we were looking for reliable, competent, full-time, well paid, permanent employees. If you want to see whats out there tell us when we call, we'll tell you what is out there, but we have other shit to do. Don't sit there chatting us up.
If you honestly are looking for a new job then I offer you the following advice. If you have an itemized list of skills, programming languages, apps etc. on your resume you need to be able to te
I'll see that. I worked as a contractor for so long that I generally got jobs on word of mouth. Since then I've proceeded to start my own companies, so I wouldn't know what the hell I'd put on a resume now. And unless there's a good reason, I hire contractors exclusively. We have less bullshit between us and we understand each other's goals.
From what I can tell of how people look for jobs, I can't believe anyone ever gets one!
It makes me sad to see how pathetic people are about looking for jobs. The only people who should be like this are people who have nothing to offer! (oh, wait...)
Take it from an employer: We want to hire you! Often as badly (or worse) than you want the job! If you come to us with this crappy "oh please hire me, I'm desperate and scared" attitude, 1) We won't want to hire you (unless we have an opening for sycophant) and 2) If we do hire you, we'll treat you just like you're expecting.
Here's a better approach: Treat the employer like you have something they want. They'll treat you with more respect.
If your employer would fire you for looking for another job, you are better off without them.
(And if an employer would fire someone just for looking, they are probably glad to be rid of you. I'd never treat someone who works for me like that. I'd ask them if they were unhappy, and if there was some way I could make it worth their while. Of course I also fire people if they're not worth my while.)
I don't expect an employer to be like a parent. However, the grandparent post did have a point. I have found that nearly all of my previous employers have said that they care about their employees, and their employees' happiness. Some genuinely did, and some really didn't. Those that did care probably felt that employee happiness helped their cause. However, if an employer claims to care, then yes, I expect their actions to match their words.
The contract with your employer is just that, a contract. If that's the extent of your connection to your employer, and if you're happy, then fair enough. But I've found that I was happiest where I also had a good working relationship with my employer; management saw me as an asset, and did their best to accommodate me. I enjoyed the position, and went out of my way to do what I could for the company.